fat pete Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 Anybody fix hammers for stone masons??? If so what is your proceedure? do you Heat treat them? how do you know what kind of steel they used? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Ameling Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 You have two main types of hammers when dealing with stone masons - those used to hammer the stone directly, and those used to strike the steel chisels. The hammers used to strike the steel chisels tend to be heat-treated softer or not at all. The hammer tends to be the "consumable" part as opposed to the steel chisels. So they tend to mushroom out in use, and the surface dents/nicks more. This helps preserve the more expensive steel chisels - which can them be heat-treated harder to last longer. But one or the other needs to be the "consumable" part and wear away in use. Plus that softer hammer face helps ... grip ... the end of the chisel better, instead of wanting to just skate off of it. Hammers used to strike stone directly need to be ... tougher ... than harder. Too hard and the face/edges will crack and bits of shrapnel might fly off. So the hammer head itself needs to be viewed as a "consumable" item. Weyger's books have some good info on stone mason's hammers and chisels, and how to make and heat-treat them. The only real way to know what steel is in those hammer heads is for you to make one up from known steel. Otherwise you would have to contact the company that originally made it. A friend reworks hammers and chisels for a stone mason near here. He is always debating with the guy about how to heat-treat both. The guy always wants both to be heat-treated HARD - to extend their life. But Andrew is always worried about cracks in the edges, and the possibility of shrapnel flying off in use! So he ends up doing as that specific client requests. But that guy has also experienced that "shrapnel" problem. He caught a 1/4 inch chunk from the end of the chisel one time. It entered near his wrist, and traveled up through muscle almost to his elbow! No, he did not sue since Andrew is his friend and did what he specifically requested. But others might not be so ... understanding. Especially when their work/livelyhood and family get affected by an injury. "Family" can be a lot less understanding about deals worked out with friends. Just a few humble thoughts to ponder. Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat pete Posted May 28, 2009 Author Share Posted May 28, 2009 thanks mike! I was looking thru a weygers book.... I guess a spark test would help on the hammer....i also have a junk metal dump nearby that has a scanner to scan the metal....talkin with the guy this morn he kept saying the hammer must cut the stone... i asked him how bad it was figuring if i could use a scotchbrite on it i wouldnt have to treat it....he said i would have to remove too much metal so he wanted the hammer head "pounded flat" .......he said that was the best way....he also said it was hard to find someone that is capable of sharpening the hammer.... I dont believe he is talking about a chipping hammer....he is talking about a stone hammer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Ameling Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 thanks mike! I was looking thru a weygers book.... I guess a spark test would help on the hammer....i also have a junk metal dump nearby that has a scanner to scan the metal....talkin with the guy this morn he kept saying the hammer must cut the stone... i asked him how bad it was figuring if i could use a scotchbrite on it i wouldnt have to treat it....he said i would have to remove too much metal so he wanted the hammer head "pounded flat" .......he said that was the best way....he also said it was hard to find someone that is capable of sharpening the hammer.... I dont believe he is talking about a chipping hammer....he is talking about a stone hammer If he kept talking about the "... hammer must cut the stone ...", then he most likely was talking about that chisel-shaped peen. That chipping hammer - kind of like on a "brick hammer". That "chisel" end is what would then "cut" the stone. Most "stone hammers" are for just pounding on the stone. You ... hit ... the stone to break a chunk off. If you tap along a line with the long/narrow peen, it sets up a fracture line in the stone until it just snaps off along that line. Or you tilt the hammer to the side a bit and use the "edge" to create that fracture line in the stone. Otherwise you are hitting a chisel, and that chisel then ... cuts ... the stone. In the end it still comes down to what you will be hitting directly with that hammer. If you are hitting the end of a steel chisel, then the hammer face needs to be softer to give a bit and "grab" the end of the chisel. If you are hammering directly on the stone, then it needs to be a lot harder to stand up to the use/abuse. I'm still kind of puzzled by his response. But then I do get ... easily confused. Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rutterbush Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 (edited) Had a stonemason request a cutting pein that was hard all the way to the handle. Says the store bought hammers wear out and get short quicker than the old time hammers. He couldn't produce one to show, so I just let him talk. Some of the older hammers had squared faces with a raised cutting edge. As I've heard, to make the hammer, the face was upset or mushroomed, then the mushroomed edge was forged toward the face. This would make a vee shaped stone cutting edge around the outside of the face. The sharp edge of the vee pointing away from the face and toward the stone. A stone could be chipped or cut by tilting the hammer edge to the stone to be cut. These hammers had very little to no hardening. Of course, I expect that they were not made with 1095. Edited August 2, 2009 by mod07 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fat pete Posted August 1, 2009 Author Share Posted August 1, 2009 thanks guys....upon further investigating i understand the hammers are upset by the mason who is constantly pounding them...makes sense.... so you must draw them down on the pein and realign them...the hammering by the mason will eventually distort the hammer ..... so you want it on the harder side but you dont want it to chip ...so i go play....I will tell ya what they think when they use my hammer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 Can you post before and after pics too? Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted August 3, 2009 Share Posted August 3, 2009 There are "bush hammers" with the face composed of rows of raised pyramids and splitting hammers with a sharp straight peen and even another type composed of hardened edged square stock pieces lined up in a row. Hardness will depend a lot on what type of stone---granite is quite different from limestone and I can cut soapstone or talc with my fingernail! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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