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I Forge Iron

RToons

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About RToons

  • Rank
    Advanced Member

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  • Gender
    Male
  • Location
    Economy Pa
  • Interests
    Fishing, Hunting, Gardening, Shooting, Forging[New 2018]

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  1. RToons

    Forge HELP

    I hope you can understand why some of us are finding this confusing and having trouble giving you the best advice. I can see that now. My mind skipped the word charcoal and only saw LUMP and put out the idea I was using LUMP Coal. I will be more specific to aid in a clear understanding of what my objective is and what products including fuels I am utilizing. Thank you for pointing this out to me.
  2. RToons

    Forge HELP

    Thank you Thomas, That is the type of constructive input I am looking for and need. Would 3" base of hot ambers and 2" above steel be enough or should the base of hot embers be thicker? Just about all videos on youtube show a coal forge with no way to have metal inside ember's which Frosty made it clear the metal should be resting on a bed of hot embers and covered by same. I purchased 100% All Natural HARDWOOD LUMP charcoal-there is that word charcoal ? See photo below
  3. RToons

    Forge HELP

    NOT sure where this discussion on charcoal is coming from. I have not used term "coal grill" or CHARCOAL in any of my comments/questions. I went back and read my entries and responses and NOT until yesterday were the words charcoal used and NOT by me. Let me be clear on my objective and understanding of the great responses I have received. I want to use LUMP COAL purchased at a store which I break into ~1x1 pieces to fuel a forge to heat metal to hammer into rough shape of a knifes. I am utilizing a small pickup break drum ~6"round by 5"deep that I plan to cut to allow metal to be inserted into and covered by hot lump coal embers. As the metal is hammered to grow in length I will have a forge that allows the metal to be placed in and covered by hot embers as needed to heat metal where needed. I feel you are NOT giving positive feed back but for some reason criticizing me as a novice individual. I am attempting to build a knowledge base of trial & error with POSITIVE feedback from skilled individuals. All positive feedback is appreciated but NOT feedback to show how one has knowledge I lack. I know some individuals express themselves in a negative way without realizing they are doing it. Please be positive in comments as you assist me in my forging attempts.
  4. RToons

    Forge HELP

    Not sure where you are going with this? I am utilizing lump coal broken into ~ 1x1 nugget size and NOT charcoal.
  5. RToons

    Forge HELP

    I scanned videos on coal forges and almost all have metal above the hot ambers and not directly in the coal embers. As Frosty suggested the metal needs to be in the hot embers of which I have to agree. Youtube is good for general ideas but most are not the greatest for practical applications for a poor retired cheep individuals like myself. I plan to cut about 3" wide and 1/2 way down the break drum where the end result will be as the blade grows it can be put directly into ambers and NOT above them. If working on a small blade I can use cut out metal to be placed back into cutout to preserve heat. I will cut it on an angle so when I need to place it back it will slide into place and not fall out. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
  6. RToons

    Forge HELP

    Arkie, I have watched how they make the metal from ore and it was very cool. I also watched several masters and 1 thing they all have in common: having 2 assistances using sledge hammers as the master turns the metal. My 2 sons deserted us and my better half of 40+yrs encourages me but will NOT swing sledge for me! I will spend today on computer after the day of heating & hammering yesterday. I usually takes me a few days to recover and be able to swing a hammer with any metal moving results. Thank you for your assistance.
  7. RToons

    Forge HELP

    Frosty, is the picture below what you were suggesting? EXCITED: 1st time I was able to weld together 11 pieces of various metals. it was 2.5"W x3"Lx2"H and using the coal forge shown below they STUCK and did NOT come apart-WoooooWeeee. Tomorrow or after I recover from using hammer I will reheat and shape into a knife. I must figure out how to get into hot coal once it gets longer & will not fit into hot coal I now have? Any suggestions ? I do not want to cut car break drum but maybe I will have to. Or as PNut suggested use the ground to build a trench packed with sand. That could work. In the picture they are fire bricks cut to fit & a piece of refractory I made a seat for propane forge to rest metal on while heating.
  8. RToons

    Forge HELP

    Thank you Glenn, The air I was unsure about. I have a gas ball value I can adjust air flow . When I had little air it did not seem to burn lump coal to a glowing level. I do not understand your suggestion to use bricks? I have no clumping kitty litter all around the outside of drum to keep in heat so not sure what bricks would accomplish? Should I replace litter with breaks? Question: I heated rebar, pounder into shape, grinded to get shape I wanted and reheated to dunk in oil. Should I do all the hammer work, dunk in oil then grind into final shape? Thinking about cutting side of metal.
  9. RToons

    Forge HELP

    Built my first coal forge using junk table, CAR break drum, clay non clumping kitty litter, shop vac and using GAS ball value to control air flow [had extra from propane forge]. I must learn to control air flow better because I went through about 1/4 bag of lump coal to heat up 3/4" rebar. I thought the steel would get hot quickly but it took quite awhile? Maybe my lack of knowledge utilizing lump coal and placement of coal. I ate a lot of small HOT ash and the cover I used did NOT stop these tiny HOT ambers. OUCH! See pictures attached and ALL positive input would be appreciated. How to better arrange coal, how much coal to use at a time, etc... Sounds like a dump question but I ask it anyways. This is my 3rd knife made forging from junk metal. My better half of 45yrs said I am getting better with each attempt. Makes me feel good and that is encouragement to continue. Although I have cut and burnt myself which she calls me a half blind [MD], deaf, forgetting, TIN man [RA issues]! First 2 from propane and this is 3rd but, 1st from coal. I failed at stacking steel and getting them to stick. BuzzKill made suggestion to apply borax before WHITE hot and that is the type of comments I am looking for. All input is appreciated. As I said I have serious issues reading books & white papers and enjoy & learn from pictures most. I have always been a hands on & IMAGE processor to learn how to do things. Again I THANK all that provide guidance, opinion & thought. FROSTY gave me tips on handling a hammer to avoid the next few days of pain after a few hours of forging fun.
  10. RToons

    Forge HELP

    Like you I learned many ways to weld. As a burner in a scrap yard, mechanic at Fruehauf trailers welding tie down with arc welder & worst of all MIG aluminum welding but best was TIG braze welding. In any case my wife kinda forced me to computers. Now retired I enjoy the smells & visual pleasures of the shop. These elder gentlemen have insights I let behind for computers of which I did not know I missed so much. In any case I will stop rambling. I have developed many questions with forging that Forge in Fire show skips to the determent of all watching. Like after heating & before oil/water dunk you should cycle blade in air to cool down several times. After dunk in oil/water blade should be place in controlled heat source ~400 overnight then allowed to cool down. I am not sure where to take these considerations and determine if these are in fact true? Then the handle making? I can say I am looking to developing knowledge & skills. One major issue is I have eye issues that hamper reading to a significant level that glasses cannot correct. So I relay on face to face discussions with individuals or watch videos/TV I will get wool sprayed as you suggested. Knife making from scrap metal is my objective and handle making is a desired skill. I will look for ABANA in my area. Not sure what you indicate by stock removal?
  11. RToons

    Forge HELP

    Correct, the back half is getting metal white hot with intent to avoid flames coming out the front. I have applied borax After metal was white hot. I will pay attention to your comment when to apply. The lawn mower blades were found in junk store. Still in package it indicated contains carbon in creation of blade? Got 2 for $5 so could not go wrong, maybe? I believe I should turn to coal for many aspects of forging with most being involved more with heating process. I will look at JABOD ideas. I am looking for active forgers in my area but only found 2 and they purchase metal already made to cut/sand/heat treat without any hammers. Not my idea of forging-to move hot metal to form desired shapes! Where is fun in that? The elders I visit in their machine shop do not actively swing hammers /forges anymore but have good insights. They still do metal fabrication, rail road track testing, make specialized parts for rail road & local govs. Only because they want to stay kinda busy & they have done this for 50+yrs and no shop is still open to accomplish these tasks locally. You are right with bottle jack from motorcycle jack stand. Speed is only as fast as my foot and the force will only be as strong as my fake knees will allow.
  12. RToons

    Forge HELP

    You are correct. The simwool between grill & milk can are not treated. The do not get exposed to much heat and never to flame. Just there to use up xtra pieces and make a better top/botton insulation. The break drum is around 1' across and 6" deep. I figure after adding sand MAYBE it will work OK. I will search for JABOD forges to get ideas. These forges are they within IFoirgeIron or external like Youtube? Kinda excited to got the lump coal way because as the elder guys from 85-90+yrs old say it is a hands on experience that produces results with less danger as compared to propane gas as long as used in open air or with proper ventilation.
  13. RToons

    Forge HELP

    I have built, rebuilt several forges just playing around. I have a forge built within coal grill I got for $20, put in 2" simwool, sprayed with sealer and applied 1" of refractory. Then used old forge made from Military milk can, with 2" simwool, sprayed with sealer, appliqued 1" refractory and covered with liquid glass and inserted into coal grill with xtra simwool between grill & milk can. I put pressure to 7psi ay first, then 12 psi after heated up. Some suggested to put pressure to 25-30psi. This makes me unsure if this is wise? I get steel white hot and can move and shape without any issue. Where I have failed every time was to attempt to weld 3,4,6 pieces together. I use truck spring, files, rebar, 1950's lawn mover blades, black pipe, etc.... I have them same dimensions, clean, welded together and heated to what looks like white hot. I add borax, reheat and hammer lightly to weld together. I have never gotten all pieces to stay welded together? I was talking with elder men and most told me a propane forge will NOT likely get to high enough temp with 1 port supplying propane. They suggested I should consider a coal forge both for the joy and hands on when utilizing a coal forge. They suggested I would get better results once I learn to manage heat on steel and would have a more enjoyable experience. Any Thoughts? I have a truck break drum, steel poles, pipes, sand and all I need to build a coal forge. Other issue is I have been thinking about a power press made from a manual hydraulic motorcycle jack . I want to use this jack because it has a foot press and a quick release knob which appears to be what I want. Any thoughts on how to configure to utilize as a forge press? Note: flame is to rear of forge to avoid flames breath out front. The breath goes out back and I lightly cover 80% with a piece of simwool to keep moist heat in. VID_20200419_143510.mp4 VID_20200419_143510.mp4 VID_20200419_143510.mp4 VID_20200419_143510.mp4 VID_20200419_143510.mp4
  14. Looking for local individuals that have built a forge with propane, build coal forge, built power hammer and press. Would like to talk on phone & depending a visit to their shop.

    I have built/rebuild several propane forges and can make knifes & shape metal. I have failed EVERY time when attempting to forge multiple layers of various steels. From truck springs, rebar, lawn mower blade indicating carbon content, black pipe, files, etc.. with borax. I was told by elderly smith that propane will not reach temp required to weld together. I see the metal is white hot yet he said not likely.

    Considering lump coal  for new forge I want to build. I have truck break drum I plan to use. HELP!

  15. Looking to Visit forges In Freedom, Baden, Ambridge, Cranberry twp PA

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