Scott McMenemy Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 G'day everyone, So I found this forum trying to research the principles I need to know for building a forge specifically for shaping metal into medieval armour (cold hammering sucks!) I decided to join because I was completely blown away by the scope and depth of content! Any advice on which section to delve into and search for what I am after above would be great. I'd rather not ask a question that has likely been answered many times before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Howdy Scott, you aware of armourarchive.org? I will have to post some pics of my tools sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott McMenemy Posted December 2, 2020 Author Share Posted December 2, 2020 (edited) Hey mate. It rings a bell. I suspect I have looked at it but some time ago. When I get back to my PC I'll have a look. My big difficulty so far is getting info on how to work out how big to make airflow holes and where the bloody xxxx I can find a raising stake! lol. Edited December 2, 2020 by Mod30 Language Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Welcome aboard Scott, glad to have you. If you'll put your general location in the header members living within visiting distance my toss an invite. Lots of information is location specific. An old and long passed online friend of mine used to work sheet steel though not human armor 1/2" and up IIRC. His sheet forge was a refractory table, fire brick I think. The forge was a sort of spittoon shaped pot that fit flush with the table top. His burner was aligned tangential to the side and it produced a ring of flame at the table top. He passed the plate around over it using a jib boom crane (I THINK) and had good control of what got heated and how much. I haven't thought about Chris Ray's table forge in probably 30 years. Early Artmetal.list days. <sigh> Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Scott: You will probably find that you will need to make many of your own tools either from scratch of by modifying existing scrap. I made a rounding stake from a large round headed bolt I found on near an old railroad derailment site. Sheet metal tools can have a lot of applications in armour making. Also, what references regarding fabricating armor do you have? I'll jot down a few that I have and I'm sure that Thomas can add many more suggestions. "By hammer and hand all arts do stand." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 I use the dome headed RR bolts for making dishing hammers, working hot you don't need the big heavy hammers and the lighter ones are easier on your body. There are a large number of possibilities for a raising stake; first one I saw in use was made from a piece of RR Rail with the end ground and polished for it's use. Polidor was raising a beehive helm from real wrought iron using it back in the early 1980's. I've also seen people raise using a ball stake. A few of my toys: Almost forgot to mention: look up Armor Forge by Eric Thing I believe there is a write up about it across the street. I found a mint condition Pexto stake plate at my local scrapyard, bought it for under US$9, also found 99# cast iron spherical dock weights and a lot of trashed oxy bottles to cut for dishing forms. Sad thing is I don't do much sheet metal work anymore. I still want to finish off my pattern welded spangen helm project though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott McMenemy Posted December 2, 2020 Author Share Posted December 2, 2020 Wow, this is such a warm welcome. Thank you to everyone who took the time to say Hi and reply. I'm unsure how to edit the title but will look into this when I have a free second to browse the forum. That is almost certainly somewhere. 17 hours ago, Frosty said: Welcome aboard Scott, glad to have you. If you'll put your general location in the header members living within visiting distance my toss an invite. Lots of information is location specific. An old and long passed online friend of mine used to work sheet steel though not human armor 1/2" and up IIRC. His sheet forge was a refractory table, fire brick I think. The forge was a sort of spittoon shaped pot that fit flush with the table top. His burner was aligned tangential to the side and it produced a ring of flame at the table top. He passed the plate around over it using a jib boom crane (I THINK) and had good control of what got heated and how much. I haven't thought about Chris Ray's table forge in probably 30 years. Early Artmetal.list days. <sigh> Frosty The Lucky. Hey Frosty. I'm so sad to hear about his passing but it really does sound like you have fond memories. Honestly that has to be one of the most pure and amazing things we can leave behind to people. His setup sounds awesome. I doubt I will be able to actually forge tools (It will be reasonably small and not very enclosed minus a small funnel) but I'll do my best to learn about it because it might be my main option. 6 hours ago, ThomasPowers said: I use the dome headed RR bolts for making dishing hammers, working hot you don't need the big heavy hammers and the lighter ones are easier on your body. There are a large number of possibilities for a raising stake; first one I saw in use was made from a piece of RR Rail with the end ground and polished for it's use. Polidor was raising a beehive helm from real wrought iron using it back in the early 1980's. I've also seen people raise using a ball stake. A few of my toys: Almost forgot to mention: look up Armor Forge by Eric Thing I believe there is a write up about it across the street. I found a mint condition Pexto stake plate at my local scrapyard, bought it for under US$9, also found 99# cast iron spherical dock weights and a lot of trashed oxy bottles to cut for dishing forms. Sad thing is I don't do much sheet metal work anymore. I still want to finish off my pattern welded spangen helm project though. Also reply to George: The tools above look great! I have a planishing ball steak and a small 20 kilo anvil (plus a planishing hammer and a few Bunnings hammers I have sanded down to some curves) to work with so I can start mucking around at the very least. I have actually made some 15th century pauldrons and and segmented upper arm attached before, and did that entirely by dishing into a stump cold and then planishing them to smooth surfaces so I know I can definitely do it. My thinking is, being an SCA fighter most recently, the 1.5mm steel I can get won't meet the standards if I dish because I'll be stretching the metal, so raising was an attractive skill to learn because it thickens the metal. It also seems like a very valuable skill for the craft to learn from what I have read. At the very least coveted. I found my motivation coming from two directions which helps a lot. I want to do more combat, so making my own (I'm in Canberra so my population here is small) made a lot of sense because it is a time rich but low cost setting over time, and I also just genuinely really enjoy the craft. I find it almost meditative and get a lot of p[ride from finishing a project and seeing what my time has produce... even something poor quality warmed my heart with pride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 I wondered; been in the SCA for 42 years now; I sometimes hang little laurel leaves from my beard braids... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 I, too, have been in the SCA for about as long or a bit longer than Thomas and can wear Laurel leaves. Here are some references you might try to obtain. I'm pretty sure that Interlibrary Loan works in Oz. Price, Brian, Techniques of Medieval Armor Reproduction: The 14th Century (Comment: This an excellent book but does not seem to be available on Amazon except at v. high prices. Also, it does assume a reasonable level of skill in the reader.) Valentine, Rob, The Art of Making Armour: A Craftsmans Guide to Creating Authentic Armour Reproductions Ffoulkes, Charles, The Armourer and His Craft, from the XI to the XVI Century, Dover Press, 1988 (Comment: this is a Dover reprint of a 1912 work and is more a historical study of armour and its production than a how to book on how to reproduce armour.) Sim, David and Jamie Kaminski, Roman Imperial Armour, Oxbow Books, 2012 Pfaffenbichler, Matthias, Armourers, Univ. of Toronto Press, 1992 (Comment: Again, more a study of the historical craft than a how to book.) Blair, Claude, European Armour 1066-1700, B.T. Butsford, 1958 (Comment: A history of European Armour. Good photos and illustrations.) Flax, Brian D. (editor), The Best of the Hammer, vols I-IV, Raymond's Quiet Press, 1983-1987 (This is a compilation of articles about reproducing armor for the SCA from the 1970s and '80s. You might be able to find this through SCA sources.) I'm sure that Thomas may have many other suggestions. "By hammer and hand all arts do stand." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 I'll double down on ToMAR! My leaves were for blacksmithing/ ferrous metals technologies and not armourmaking. So most of the sources I could mention are not armour specific; though I think everyone should own a copy of "Heroic Armor of the Italian Renaissance: Filippo Negroli and his Contemporaries." Pyhrr, Stuart W., and José-A. Godoy, just to keep them humble. Also if you are interested in the Metallurgy of armour the best modern research is in "The Knight and the Blast Furnace", Williams. (His companion volumn on the metallurgy of swords is "The Sword and the Crucible". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott McMenemy Posted December 3, 2020 Author Share Posted December 3, 2020 Lol I actually own ToMAR so already off to a good start! It was one of the first resource I got when I started. I also bought the Traditional Bowyers Bible out of interest buuuuut the techniques used were not really possible in the space I had so it collects dust right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.