Nickwebb Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 I have a dead PETER Wright anvil. There is a 6" crack on one side between the hardface and the body. What would be the best weld process and filler to repair the crack? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the iron dwarf Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 how deep is the crack? you cannot just weld the surface or it will break up, you need to weld the entire area of the crack and then maybe re heat treat the anvil. this is a major task. post some pix and details about the anvil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 Best to check the rebound first. If it's good, leave it alone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 This probably a "use it until it fails and then repair it" situation; as the repairs may cause more problems than the original issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickwebb Posted July 29, 2017 Author Share Posted July 29, 2017 3 minutes ago, arkie said: Best to check the rebound first. If it's good, leave it alone! It is definitely dead. Nearly no rebound at all unfortunately. I have a Hay Budden, but the PW is in good shape except for the crack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 Ouch! Sorry to hear that. There are some folks here who may be able to give you some advice. It ain't gonna be an easy fix. Glad you have the HB as a backup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickwebb Posted July 29, 2017 Author Share Posted July 29, 2017 16 minutes ago, the iron dwarf said: how deep is the crack? you cannot just weld the surface or it will break up, you need to weld the entire area of the crack and then maybe re heat treat the anvil. this is a major task. post some pix and details about the anvil I've welded a good bit of cast iron and cast steel so I'm fairly familiar with the process (not good by any means) It's the high carbon top to the cast that has me scratching Head. I was thinking 309L might do it with about a 300-400 deg f preheat and then a slow cool which is similar to what I do with cast, but not sure what it'll do to the hardface. I'll post some pics this evening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 OK if the face has completely delaminated then the fix is to remove it and either do a complete weld side to side usually by offsetting the face with a piece of sq stock in the middle and welding it up from both sides. Or by building up the body with correct rod to create a new face. As the body of a Peter Wright is NOT CAST ANYTHING but rather real wrought iron I do not understand your last comment. The Face plate may be cast steel and either a monolithic piece or several pieces forge welded side to side down the length of the face depending on age. Any experience welding real wrought iron? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the iron dwarf Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 the body of the anvil is not cast it is WI, how much experience of welding that do you have? first test the surface with a small hammer and mark the entire area that sounds hollow with chalk, next post a picture of that. the problem is a failed forge weld and it might be over a large area Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 Got a lot of friends, coal, and a high pressure & high volume water supply? You could try to weld it back the old fashioned way---forge welding and then re heat treating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickwebb Posted July 29, 2017 Author Share Posted July 29, 2017 Not at all on wrought iron. And the crack goes about 2/3 of the length of the hard face on one side only so far as I can see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the iron dwarf Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 so it does not go across the width of the anvil at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 It's how deep it goes under the face we are interested in. A quarter inch---V it out and weld it up! 3" and it's time to decide if you want to repair or just replace the anvil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickwebb Posted July 29, 2017 Author Share Posted July 29, 2017 4 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said: Got a lot of friends, coal, and a high pressure & high volume water supply? You could try to weld it back the old fashioned way---forge welding and then re heat treating. That might actually be fun, but I'm not sure my friends like me that much. Lol 10 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said: OK if the face has completely delaminated then the fix is to remove it and either do a complete weld side to side usually by offsetting the face with a piece of sq stock in the middle and welding it up from both sides. Or by building up the body with correct rod to create a new face. As the body of a Peter Wright is NOT CAST ANYTHING but rather real wrought iron I do not understand your last comment. The Face plate may be cast steel and either a monolithic piece or several pieces forge welded side to side down the length of the face depending on age Any experience welding real wrought iron? 2 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said: It's how deep it goes under the face we are interested in. A quarter inch---V it out and weld it up! 3" and it's time to decide if you want to repair or just replace the anvil Understood. What filler should be used if it's weldable? 6 minutes ago, the iron dwarf said: so it does not go across the width of the anvil at all? Not that I can see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the iron dwarf Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 did you test it like I told you? get a small hammer and tap the surface all over, mark with chalk the area that sounds hollow then post a picture of it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickwebb Posted July 29, 2017 Author Share Posted July 29, 2017 1 minute ago, the iron dwarf said: did you test it like I told you? Haven't yet. I've just stopped in for lunch. I'll check it this evening and I'll post some pics. Thanks for the help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the iron dwarf Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 as TP said if it is just 1/4" deep v it and weld, if it is 3" it is a different problem. if you want to fix it the way it was made you need people there who are experienced at forge welding because I presume you are not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickwebb Posted July 29, 2017 Author Share Posted July 29, 2017 1 hour ago, the iron dwarf said: as TP said if it is just 1/4" deep v it and weld, if it is 3" it is a different problem. if you want to fix it the way it was made you need people there who are experienced at forge welding because I presume you are not Your presumption is correct. I am not. It has been a bit since I had this old anvil out from under the bench. After cleaning it up. The crack wasn't as long as I remembered. After checking the rebound again, it is only dead from the Hardie hole back. And more on the side with the crack than the other. I do see another line near the midpoint of the body but I suspect that may be where the hard face is forged to the body (I included a pic)...I can use it as is, I would just hate to let the crack contiue to grow if I can stop it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the iron dwarf Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 have seen video on here of a team welding a face on an anvil, Thomas will probably know it, if it can be found it may help you see the mammoth task you have if it is a major repair yes it will be fun but it will take a lot of organization and preparation and will be a lot of hard work for a large team of people, it may nor work well or at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 They welded on a face in the traditional manner as the Friday Night Demo at Quad-State one year---took them 4 tries as I remember before they got it to stick. I missed that Q-S which was a shame as I had suggested that as a demo... Another group tried it quite some time ago and If you can dig out pictures of the "Cajun Blackened Anvil" you can see what an epic fail trying to forge weld a face on an anvil can look like---those folks burnt up a lot of their anvil trying to heat it to welding temp. Face delamination on the heel is a non issue as far as my work goes, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickwebb Posted July 29, 2017 Author Share Posted July 29, 2017 Thanks guys. I think I'm gathering from you guys that it may take a long time for the rest of that side to let go and I'm not going to hurt it any worse by continuing to use it without any repairs. Is that correct? I'm getting close to retirement (2nd one) and when life slows down I'd like to learn more about blacksmithing. I've been working with steel and aluminum for years as a hobby but blacksmithing has always interested me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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