JTadeo28 Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Hello this is my first forge and my first time blacksmithing, and i have some questions: how long should it take a small charcoal forge to get a thin piece of steel to glow yellow hot? I have a hair dryer running through 3/4" galvanized pipe to right under the pile of lazzari mesquite lump charcoal, is that sufficient for thin pieces of steel? How much charcoal do I need to pile for a day of blacksmithing? How can I make the charcoal last longer once it's burning? Thank you. Also are there any blacksmiths near moorpark, CA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale M. Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Welcome here and to your new addiction.... Think your air supply is to small.... Small diameter pipe restrict the air flow to much... Tube from hair drier should be same diameter as dryer.... Probable 1.5 inches or larger.... Its really hard to go to large on air supply tubing but really easy to go to small.... As for how long to get your heat up...... Well.... Charcoal though many have used it and and had good success is the poorest heat source available.... Size if fire will be directly dependent on amount of heat you expect.... Small fuel load small heat, large fuel load, big heat.... Only way to make charcoal last longer is cool fire down.... As for a "day" of blacksmithing, you will have to feed fire whenever heat output goes below what it required to heat metal to levels you require.... Dale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 A hair Dryer puts out WAY TOO MUCH AIR for a small charcoal forge. No wonder you are going through fuel at a fast rate---like driving your car with the accelerator pressed to the floor all the time! As to exact times; not enough information as to what you are doing. Now a 1/4" sq piece in what I consider a "small" charcoal forge; put at the proper place in the fire---not right against the tuyere; but up into the stack; should come up to working temp in a couple of minutes (say under 5) from ambient temp and faster after it's been preheated---if you don't let it cool down to ambient while working it---in general it should be still glowing slightly when it goes back in. Is your forge designed for charcoal or are you using charcoal in one designed for coal? To help conserve fuel when I use charcoal in my coal forge I place a couple of fire bricks on their sides to make a trough across the tuyere to hold the fuel and fill it up with charcoal. If you have to use an electric blower, get a foot switch---like an old sewing machine foot switch to run it so it's OFF whenever there is not a piece in the fire. *and you can control the speed of a universal motor with it as well!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTadeo28 Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 Wow thank you guys for replying! I will attach pictures to this comment to show you my forge. First is the forge ready to be lit: This is my charcoal and anvil (vise): This is to show the pipe system for the air supply: And here are some tools that I use for forging: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale M. Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 As mentioned before , way to small of pipe/tube to feed effective amount of air to charcoal... Also to many turns and twisted to get air under fire.... Dale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Hi, Firstly I strongly recommend you ditch the galvanised pipe. Even the slightest risk of it getting warm enough to generate zinc fumes is too much for me and zinc poisoning is just not worth it. Now then. How thin are you talking? As said, from cold I would expect steel to get to a good working temperature within 5 minutes. At the very most. From already hit, it will be much faster! I actually really like using charcoal as a fuel because it burns nice and hot and clean. You have to get decent hand made charcoal not store bought trash. Typically mass produced charcoal is made in places like Africa and is a very inferior product, it spits and doesn't burn well at all. Whereas proper hand made charcoal burns very well. The only trouble is that it burns really very quickly compared to coke/coal. So you use a lot more fuel. I've let this burn down too far and I was about to pile on some more fuel but you can see there is plenty of heat available in charcoal. All the best Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Double post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Sorry, triple post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTadeo28 Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 Thanks guys. I have some things to improve on before i get hammerin' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTadeo28 Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 Also what kind of pipe should I use and where would I get it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTadeo28 Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 Also I heated up some steel to dark orange with it, but it cooled to black very quickly. It took about 5 - 8 minutes for that. I expirimented with twisting and folding, and made a fork! I was wondering what do you need to make your own charcoal? And the steel I use is about 1/6 - 1/10 of an inch thick. I really like the design that andy has, but I am wondering if it would be cheaper just to buy a forge. I feel like I am going to be spending a lot of money, and I wonder if buying one would be cheaper. I would also like to know where I could learn to make knives online? There are no blacksmiths in my area, and I really want to make a knife. Thanks guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Most of us use black pipe, used for natural gas and propain installation. Your local hardware, building supply, plumming supply, or in my case my local welding shop has it with our the official plumming code markings. The plomming up to the twear can be flexible or rigid exaust pipe, sourced from an exast shop or auto parts store. But talking to the local mechanic and/or plumber and telling them what your up to might lead to free or almost free scrap that will work nicely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale M. Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Read the posts where people are making brake drum forges..... I uses a truck brake drum, base (cart portion) off old gas BBQ.... Black Iron pipe, have may be $50-$75 invested... Be creative, do a lot of looking on Youtube at forges.... Look at pics 003 and 013 in this sequence, it can be this simple... http://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/31104-first-time-forge-build/ You have the idea what a forge is all about, you need to refine it more to make it more efficient.... Dale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Also I heated up some steel to dark orange with it, but it cooled to black very quickly. It took about 5 - 8 minutes for that. I expirimented with twisting and folding, and made a fork! I was wondering what do you need to make your own charcoal? And the steel I use is about 1/6 - 1/10 of an inch thick. I really like the design that andy has, but I am wondering if it would be cheaper just to buy a forge. I feel like I am going to be spending a lot of money, and I wonder if buying one would be cheaper. I would also like to know where I could learn to make knives online? There are no blacksmiths in my area, and I really want to make a knife. Thanks guys. Sounds like you just need to do some googling. Find videos on YouTube and spend some time on here. That was a cheap forge I build in a few hours to get me up and running after moving house. I have since rebuilt it and to be honest I think I'm going to build another one again. I put a thread up about building it here, http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=100296&highlight= Total cost was less than £15 Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTadeo28 Posted March 1, 2013 Author Share Posted March 1, 2013 Thanks andy for telling me about the zinc poisoning. I ditched the galvanised and bought some 1" black pipe. That has given me a HUUUGE increase in airflow and I simplified the pipe system. I'll be back tomorrow with some more questions once I test out this new air system. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTadeo28 Posted March 2, 2013 Author Share Posted March 2, 2013 Alright so the new pipe system is working great but I am burning through charcoal like mad. I bought a brake drum and that has given me some great control, and hotter temperatures. I need a better fuel source. Any suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toolish Posted March 2, 2013 Share Posted March 2, 2013 Have a look what is around you, you might just have to put up with shoveling more and more charcoal into it. See if you have Coal or coke available around your area. Coke will last a lot longer then the charcoal does and still gives good heat. Just see what you can get your hands on and see how you go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale M. Posted March 2, 2013 Share Posted March 2, 2013 If you would put your location up in your profile, we would know generally where you live and that makes it easier to direct you to a fuel source.... Many vendors sell coal in 20-25 pound boxes on e-bay, and there are many vendors who sell coal in 50 pounds bags... Also from tradition "blacksmithing" retail sources or from "fuel vendors".... Local blacksmithing groups sometimes have coal available through group, where the buy maybe a ton at a time to keep shipping costs down....You might even try local yellow pages under "coal" or "fuels".... Remember coal is really cheap.... Its the shipping that is killer.... Dale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted March 2, 2013 Share Posted March 2, 2013 Try your local farrier supply, the usually have 50# bags. Not the cheapest way to go. You can always order a train car :-D keeps shipping costs down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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