Paul Crosby Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 Hello I'm looking at a Hill anvil that I saw at a antique store. The owner said it was made between 1830 - 1850 and the markings say it's 165 lbs. It appears to be in good condition except for a hair line crack on the side between horn and face. It's kind of hard to see as well as hard to find. I was wondering if it was worth buying and what it might be worth. He is asking 345.00. I'm really just getting into black smithing, but have had a interest for many years. I had a great great grandfather that was a black smith/ Fire Chief in the 1880's in Burlington, Vermont during my time in the fire dept I read articles in the old newspapers and city report articles on some of the items he made for the fire dept during his years in the fire dept. My father worked for the Shelburne museum and worked in the black smith building. I guess I would say there is iron forging in my blood and the time is right to start learning. Any way I want to get some equipment for myself and start learning. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 Hi Paul, welcome to the forum. can you get any pictures of the anvil? A hairline crack may not be a problem if it is only a surface crack but if it runs deep then it could cause issues. Are you able to hit the anvil with a hammer to check its ring and rebound? I'm not very knowledgable about anvil brands. Let alone ones in the states. I'm sure one of the more seasoned members will post shortly. The price is just over $2 per pound which isn't too bad. Though there's no harm in trying to haggle it down a bit, especially if you pay cash. - try the old "call it $xxx for cash and you've got a deal" Best of luck with it. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 Look up the ball bearing test online. That is a "ringing anvil" and so unless mounted so it doesn't ring it should. Ringing it will likely tell you if that crack is a problem as internal cracks dull the ring of an anvil substantially. If they won't let you test the anvil---walk away with a smile! Old style anvils were forge welded up from a bunch of different pieces so that crack may be the line where they welded the horn on---OTOH not all forge welds were good ones and it could be that the horn's weld is failing. Not that much of a problem as anvils were pretty hornless for centuries if not millennia *except* that broken anvils should sell CHEAP! My last heelless anvil went for about 33 cents a pound with a fair horn and a great face, with the heel it would have been more like $2 a pound... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Crosby Posted October 24, 2012 Author Share Posted October 24, 2012 Hello everyone I'll get a picture of it this weekend. I'll also perform a few tests that you have recommended. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Crosby Posted October 26, 2012 Author Share Posted October 26, 2012 Here is the Hill Anvil I'm interested in. Any imput would be appreciated. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everything Mac Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 It looks ok but that crack appears to extend right across the face and some way into the body too. In which case $345 is way too much IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Crack may be at the weld line for face plate pieces. But while still usable it does lower the value a lot as it may be an indication of the heel forge weld beginning to fail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 I have a peter wright with a weld in the face plate. It steel has worn more along the weld more than the rest of the face over its life but it is a superb anvil. That Hill is a good anvil but the price is a bit high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 I don't much like the look of the crack and wouldn't pay nearly the asking price. I don't much care if it's cracked along an existing weld or clear iron/steel. I'd talk up all the hazards of working a cracked anvil and seriously low ball my counter offer and would balk at $200. If after a little tapping with a hammer to judge the crack I might go as high as $200 but that'd be my limit. Then again, that's me, I could be wrong. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted October 26, 2012 Share Posted October 26, 2012 Its not really a crack its more a result of decarbonizeation, grain enlargement and physical ware along the weld line most likely the defect does not extend below the face plate. This is normal for older anvils with the face plates put on in pieces . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furnace1 Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 Hello I'm looking at a Hill anvil that I saw at a antique store. The owner said it was made between 1830 - 1850 and the markings say it's 165 lbs. It appears to be in good condition except for a hair line crack on the side between horn and face. It's kind of hard to see as well as hard to find. I was wondering if it was worth buying and what it might be worth. He is asking 345.00. I'm really just getting into black smithing, but have had a interest for many years. I had a great great grandfather that was a black smith/ Fire Chief in the 1880's in Burlington, Vermont during my time in the fire dept I read articles in the old newspapers and city report articles on some of the items he made for the fire dept during his years in the fire dept. My father worked for the Shelburne museum and worked in the black smith building. I guess I would say there is iron forging in my blood and the time is right to start learning. Any way I want to get some equipment for myself and start learning. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks PaulPaul, I live in Vermont also and know a gentleman named Ray Vartuli in Mallets bay Vermont. Not too far a drive from you and well worth it. I have bought an anvil from him as well as many other blacksmithing tools over the years. There has never been a time I've been there when I did not have at least a dozen anvils of all sizes sitting right in his shop in front of me to choose from. He is a very decent person to deal with and his prices are more than fair. You could certainly do better with him cost wise, than the one you have pictured. Let me know and I'll dig up his number for you if your interested.....Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Crosby Posted October 27, 2012 Author Share Posted October 27, 2012 Scott that would be great if you could get his number. I really would like to get a older anvil with some use. I really haven't tried to get the price down on the anvil but I have stopped in to see it about four times. I wanted to get as much information as possible about the anvil before I paid that price. He has two others for sale but they have been used more and show a lot of ware on the face. I want to make my first anvil worth buying and use it for many decades. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furnace1 Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 Scott that would be great if you could get his number. I really would like to get a older anvil with some use. I really haven't tried to get the price down on the anvil but I have stopped in to see it about four times. I wanted to get as much information as possible about the anvil before I paid that price. He has two others for sale but they have been used more and show a lot of ware on the face. I want to make my first anvil worth buying and use it for many decades. ThanksOk Paul, I'll get his number to you tomorrow. Just my opinion, but I would flat out forget about that anvil your looking at given the price and condition. I bought a 230 Lbs Peter Wright from Ray two years ago for not too much more than that one and in much better shape. He usually has all the top name brands available in different sizes, so you can choose whatever you like and lots of other blacksmithing tools as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Crosby Posted October 29, 2012 Author Share Posted October 29, 2012 I'm also looking for a supplier of coal from the Middlebury, Vermont area if you can help. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furnace1 Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I'm also looking for a supplier of coal from the Middlebury, Vermont area if you can help. ThanksSorry to take so long getting back to you. Just got our power back on after the hurricane beat us up a little these past few days. I just came in and his numbers in my shop....rough two days here but I won't forget it tomorrow. As for coal, I buy mine at Aubuchons the store in vergennes has 13 the last time I looked online but you can order whatever amount you need and they will ship it to the closest store to you. I just did that the other day. It was $12.49 a bag plus tax and no charge for shipping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Crosby Posted October 31, 2012 Author Share Posted October 31, 2012 Hello Scott. Thanks for getting back to me. Sorry you had problems from the storm. We were lucky here no power loss or damage. I did find a supply of coal at Jackmands in Bristol for 7.75 a bag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furnace1 Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Hello Scott. Thanks for getting back to me. Sorry you had problems from the storm. We were lucky here no power loss or damage. I did find a supply of coal at Jackmands in Bristol for 7.75 a bag.OK Paul, Ray's number is ...802-863-6480....really nice guy and plan to spend at least a few hours there. As for the coal you bought at Jackmans, that would be anthracite heating coal. Not a problem really I use that as well but, usually get a few strange looks from other blacksmiths that use the soft blacksmithing coal that I mentioned Aubuchon's sells. I use that to get my fire going and then use pea size anthracite for the rest of the day. Good luck with your visit to Ray's, let us know which anvil you wind up with...Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Crosby Posted November 1, 2012 Author Share Posted November 1, 2012 Thanks Scott! I'll keep you updated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furnace1 Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Paul, just checking in to see if you got over to Ray's place yet and got yourself an anvil? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ten Hammers Posted November 11, 2012 Share Posted November 11, 2012 Once again IFORGEIRON is the place to make connections. World wide. Thanks Glen and company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Crosby Posted November 12, 2012 Author Share Posted November 12, 2012 Hello Scott It was real busy last week and I plan on calling him tomorrow. I'll let you know soon. Thanks for checking on me!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Crosby Posted November 12, 2012 Author Share Posted November 12, 2012 Thanks!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Crosby Posted November 15, 2012 Author Share Posted November 15, 2012 I talked to Ray this morning and I'm possibly going down on Monday. He has about 39 anvils. Thanks again Scott I'm sure with that selection I will find a good one. I'm working on my forge now and bought some blacksmith coal at Aubuchons. I'm thinking of a anvil around 150 lbs what do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furnace1 Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 I talked to Ray this morning and I'm possibly going down on Monday. He has about 39 anvils. Thanks again Scott I'm sure with that selection I will find a good one. I'm working on my forge now and bought some blacksmith coal at Aubuchons. I'm thinking of a anvil around 150 lbs what do you think?That sounds great Paul....I knew he would have a bunch of them for you to choose from. 150 pounds is a good size, I have a few in that range but to be honest, I prefer one in the 200 pound range. Not that you can't do just about everything you need to on the 150 as long as it's anchored down good. It's just I prefer a larger working surface and when I'm forging something heavy it's more stable. The first anvil I bought from Ray was a 230 pound Peter Wright and that seems to be the average shop size anvil you find for sale around here. Good luck and let us know how you make out....say hello to Ray for me, Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Crosby Posted November 22, 2012 Author Share Posted November 22, 2012 I finally had a chance to go to Ray's on Tuesday to look at anvils. I did manage to find one I liked. I found this Hay Buddon 114 lb for 275.00. I talked myself down to a smaller anvil so it would be easier to move around if I had to. I believe it's in great shape and has a beautiful ring to it. I think it was made around 1912. I'm cleaning it up now and will post other photos later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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