Scampbell Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 Ok so I posted pics of it in the it followed me home, but I need to know what to put in the hearth? I'm new to all of this and really want to do it up rite so the question is I was told to use some sand in it, and use " good sand" or I will burn the tueiron, so 1 do I use sand for it? 2 what kind of sand, I was kinda thinking sand dune, beach, or store bought "play" sand thanks in advance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basher Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 If you are talking about a side blast forge ... line the bottom with fire bricks and then sand . then fill with coke and allow dust to build up . the tue is water cooled so wont burn out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 (edited) Ok so I posted pics of it in the it followed me home, but I need to know what to put in the hearth? I'm new to all of this and really want to do it up rite so the question is I was told to use some sand in it, and use " good sand" or I will burn the tueiron, so 1 do I use sand for it? 2 what kind of sand, I was kinda thinking sand dune, beach, or store bought "play" sand thanks in advance! First impression from the pictures you posted is that the tue iron could do with being a little higher, however if it has been working, then it should still do so. The reasons sand is used is to take up space in the hearth so you do not waste fuel, secondly if you use coal as opposed to coke you may find that if you leave the fire, then the burning area will increase to fill the hearth. Normally ash from previous fires is used to line the base and rear of the hearth which prevents the fire burning back further than the front face of the tue iron. If you don't have ash, you can use DRY sand, another alternative which we use on our forges is to line the forge with old refrectory bricks, leaving a fire pot area around the nose of the tue which allows the clinker to drop below it when in use. The rest of the hearth has firebricks (or Sand) stacked around about level with the centre line of the tue. To the rear between the tue and the back of the hearth we pack this area to about level with the top of the tue, Sort of like a shelf area, the hearth can then topped up with fuel, we place a heap of fuel (Coke in our situation) at the rear over the tue iron so we can rake it forward as we use the fuel in the hearth. To light the fire, clean out the previous days clinker and ash and discard, make sure you are well below the centre of the tue, use some balled paper light it and place in this area, then add sticks/kindling, gentle blast of air then when wood is lit, add fuel and let that ignite, increase blast after a short while. NOTE, do not increase blast too early as you can extinguish the flames and blow out the fire. Hope this helps . if any part is not clear, then please come back and I will try to explain or clarify. Oops, Owen beat me to it, but not quite as detailed Edited January 17, 2011 by John B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scampbell Posted January 18, 2011 Author Share Posted January 18, 2011 Ok it makes some sense now, kinda what I was picturing in my head! So you think any DRY sand will do or is there a specific that I should be looking for? Man I really thank you all for the help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Ok it makes some sense now, kinda what I was picturing in my head! So you think any DRY sand will do or is there a specific that I should be looking for? Man I really thank you all for the help! Any clean dry sand should be ok, fine grain would be better, but basically its just an inexpensive filler by the way I am only 9 miles away from Exeter, wrong continent I am afraid otherwise I would pop over and see you. What air control method are you using on the forge? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratel10mm Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 As John says, it's a filler. We even used whatever dirt was around Moony's smithy a couple of years ago to get a couple of forges going. No fire bricks, we weren't messing around! I don't know if he ever replaced / enhanced it with anything else to be honest. John & Owen, if I recall correctly Bob Oakes' side blasts don't employ fire bricks at all, just sand. Never saw what Pete Oberon's was lined with, and Owen I never thought to ask you mate . And other than Dave Budd's iron age setup I haven't had experience of any other side blasts. So you've got me curious - do the fire bricks add something useful beyond (presumably) a means of containing the fire? I'd have thought if you used them to surround the fire like a pot, you'd have to be able to move the side bricks without busting them to get a long heat? Cheers Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basher Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 the bricks are there just to add security so that you dong dig a fire that is so deep you burn your forge bottom out .I think sand would work fine on its own 90%of the time . If you are used to working on top of the fire of a bottom blast forge you may find working "in" the fire on a side blast a little oxidising . just build your coke /coal level untill you are working above the oxidising area (in front of the tue iron ,but still in the fire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 As John says, it's a filler. We even used whatever dirt was around Moony's smithy a couple of years ago to get a couple of forges going. No fire bricks, we weren't messing around! I don't know if he ever replaced / enhanced it with anything else to be honest. John & Owen, if I recall correctly Bob Oakes' side blasts don't employ fire bricks at all, just sand. Never saw what Pete Oberon's was lined with, and Owen I never thought to ask you mate . And other than Dave Budd's iron age setup I haven't had experience of any other side blasts. So you've got me curious - do the fire bricks add something useful beyond (presumably) a means of containing the fire? I'd have thought if you used them to surround the fire like a pot, you'd have to be able to move the side bricks without busting them to get a long heat? Cheers Matt As I said, its just a convenient filler, with fuel as expensive as it is, there is no point in using more then you have to. Just consider how much fuel you would need to fill that hearth otherwise, Looking at the picture I would estimate at least 100kg (4 or 5 sacks) would be needed, and at £10+ per sack, I can utilise that cash in a much better way. With regard to the 'Like a fire pot', it does not actually contain the fire, and is just a layer taking up space that would otherwise be fuel, with a space down to the base of the forge directly in front of and giving about a 12" square open area for the fire to fill when in use, and sand on its own is OK, Firebricks are not needed under the tue iron, I had a small (18" x 30" x 4") shallow side blast portable forge made from aluminium with an old wooden wheel axle box for a tue, about 3" above the aluuminium base, and all that had underneath the tue was a roof slate, the rest was filled with ash and coal for fuel. Refrectory bricks out of a redundant storage heater are ideal for the price (free) I have used firebricks to make a reverbatory style of fire if I wanted long heats in the side blast, but I keep these seperate, and fit them in when needed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HWHII Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Scampbell, I took a picture of mine to show you what I have done on mine. Mine is filled will screened dirt no rocks. About 2 to 3 inches deep. The fire area is lined on the outside with 3 fire bricks. The bottom is sloped back to the tuyere and hollowed out underneath the tuyere. This is for when your fire is burning your klinker will flow underneath there and form. This will help in keeping your fire clean. Above the dirt is just ash and coal dust and then coal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted January 18, 2011 Share Posted January 18, 2011 Scampbell, I took a picture of mine to show you what I have done on mine. Mine is filled will screened dirt no rocks. About 2 to 3 inches deep. The fire area is lined on the outside with 3 fire bricks. The bottom is sloped back to the tuyere and hollowed out underneath the tuyere. This is for when your fire is burning your klinker will flow underneath there and form. This will help in keeping your fire clean. Above the dirt is just ash and coal dust and then coal. Thats just about what I was describing with one proviso, If the clinker forms under the Tuyere, it can be a beggar to fish out in one piece, if the "Fill in" comes level with the front of the tuyere the clinker should come out in one solid piece after you have shut off the air blast for a few minutes, you can then restart with a clean fire Use whatever you have available, the principle is the same Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scampbell Posted January 19, 2011 Author Share Posted January 19, 2011 Only 9 miles eh.... Just across the pond! Lol it's too funny how many times people ask if I am from that Exeter. Well as for the posts I thank you all so very much! Oh and the picture that really helps! Unfortunately the weather here hasn't been good enough to get out and use so I'll have to wait but at least I have an idea of how this is going to work! I havnt used it at all but I do know that it came from (sierra forge and fire) here in town and I guess it was used there a whole lot. I guess many would come from all over the world just to take classes there, too bad it closed in one light but good for me in the other..... Still would have liked to have had some hands on resources to use locally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratel10mm Posted January 19, 2011 Share Posted January 19, 2011 Don't forget to keep the bosh full of water. Thanks for the fire brick info John & Owen. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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