Jump to content
I Forge Iron

Stainless steel nails.


Recommended Posts

First post. Hello all.
I work with green English oak frequently. The tannic acid in the timber reacts with mild steel forged nails leaving black streaks and accelerating corrosion.
So, I want to have a go making some stainless nails but I've never worked with stainless. Is it viable? What grade stainless would be best?

Thanks!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Stainless does not move as nice under the hammer compared to mild. Certain grades are high carbon, so you need to check your specifications and select a suitable grade. I have reforged some stainless bolts into trinkets successfully without excessive effort. Stainless will rust under many circumstances, and is often pacified to strip free iron from the surface and develop a thick chrome oxide layer. I have been told that heating about something like 2000F then allowing to cool naturally will have a similar effect for as-forged items.

Pacification is done with nitric or citric acid typically.

While I am unsure what grade to select, I would avoid titanium bearing grades as those are meant to resist deformation at higher temperatures.

Phil

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I`ve had luck with 316 stainless.It`s what most deck hardware/fittings for boats is made from and will resist salt air corrosion if treated properly as Phil suggests.
I`ve also had some luck with prop shafts made from an alloy called Aquamet.
The old wood boats used bronze hardware to good effect with oak frames so that may be an alternate approach if you can afford it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


316 will work fine, but 304 is all you really need and a lot cheaper. Work it at near white heat and hit it HARD.


I get all my 316 from boatyard scrap.Where is a good place to get the 304 Arftist?
Is that what is coming out of the food mfg plants?I can go to Portland and get some there if it is.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

316 is used in tomato processing to handle the acidity.

303,304 are really common grades that are carried everywhere. We literally use tons of it where I work. Matter of fact I have quite a bit of it in various diameters. I didn't sort the bar ends for grade, so they are a mix of 303,304,316,and a little 400 series at times. To me stainless is stainless for my applications.

303 is free machining, and cuts a lot easier on a mill or lathe than 304 does. We also have some with selenium added to it which cuts really really nice.

Link to comment
Share on other sites



303 is free machining, and cuts a lot easier on a mill or lathe than 304 does. We also have some with selenium added to it which cuts really really nice.


I used to hate machining stainless.You just knew during the clean up you would be cut on your hands in at least one place.Those long chips just get wrapped around everything and are razor sharp. :(
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Cracker,
A common cheap form of stainless is the one used for auto exhaust it is magnetic so it has marginal scrap value yet literally tough as nails and very easy to come by in scrap form. It is worth noting that 309 & 310 (both are ASTM297 products) are suitable for high heat aplications (read furnace etc.) ie lots of chrome and thus very difficult to forge.
Ian

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I get all my 316 from boatyard scrap.Where is a good place to get the 304 Arftist?
Is that what is coming out of the food mfg plants?I can go to Portland and get some there if it is.


For commercial marine work, 304 for above deck, 316 under water. For pleasure boats, 316 regardless, since cost is less important than pretty. 304 resists corrosion by developing a thick chrome oxide. 316 will resist the oxide but only if mirror polished. 303 is wonderfull to machine, only 360 (free maching) brass cuts easier, but it's resistence to marine corrosion is unsuitable, lasting 5 years or less in salt water. The tannic acid in oak may well attack 303. In my area suppliers carry both 304 and 316 in most common shapes. 316 is slightly harder to machine than 304, both are difficult at best.
Junkyard purchases of stainless can be difficult, since they group 304-
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'll be interested to see your results. I used to make a lot of marine fastenings. Really enjoyed working with silicone-bronze. I ran into problems heading stainless (probably 316 iirc). using a loose header, the shank would often tear where it meets the head. With most materials I've worked with a little of the head material will extrude down the hole in a loose tool. It doesn't seem the stainless likes to do that and I ended up using split gripper type headed whenever I was working stainless.

You might consider using silicon bronze for you project. Might be able to do them cold to keep them stiff, but you'll still probably need to drill pilot holes when using them. Fine work is always done that way anyway.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I'll be interested to see your results. I used to make a lot of marine fastenings. Really enjoyed working with silicone-bronze. I ran into problems heading stainless (probably 316 iirc). using a loose header, the shank would often tear where it meets the head. With most materials I've worked with a little of the head material will extrude down the hole in a loose tool. It doesn't seem the stainless likes to do that and I ended up using split gripper type headed whenever I was working stainless.

You might consider using silicon bronze for you project. Might be able to do them cold to keep them stiff, but you'll still probably need to drill pilot holes when using them. Fine work is always done that way anyway.

I'd go with Bob Mainly's and Grant Sarver's suggestion and see about the feasibility of bronze.
Pilot holes would of course be a must, the ID of the pilot holes likely being very close to the OD of the nails due to the hardness of oak. I once built a treestand for deer hunting with kiln dried maple and had a real bear of a time driving 16p nails even with pilot holes, they were bending like they were made of rubber, hard hard stuff! I wound up forsaking the nails and bolting everything together.
I can remember when I was a kid in the 70's rowing around in an old wooden boat at a lake where my grandparents had a cottage. My great grandfather bought the cottage in 1907, the boat was his and dates from the 1800's, a lot like an Adirondack guide boat. That was about the only type of boat on Chautauqua lake in those early days. The boat today is still there in rough condition stored in the rafters of my cousin's carriage house a few streets away from the cottage. It has lots of bronze nails in it and other bronze fittings. They have a patina but no weep lines into the wood as would be seen with steel. That old boat saw an awful lot of use for probably the better part of eighty years. In the winter it was simply placed upside down in the yard on pieces of split cordwood, no tarp or anything covering it and it got a coat of varnish every now and then. Through all of that there is no staining of the bronze into the wood.
Link to comment
Share on other sites


I'd go with Bob Mainly's and Grant Sarver's suggestion and see about the feasibility of bronze.
Pilot holes would of course be a must, the ID of the pilot holes likely being very close to the OD of the nails due to the hardness of oak. I once built a treestand for deer hunting with kiln dried maple and had a real bear of a time driving 16p nails even with pilot holes, they were bending like they were made of rubber, hard hard stuff! I wound up forsaking the nails and bolting everything together.
I can remember when I was a kid in the 70's rowing around in an old wooden boat at a lake where my grandparents had a cottage. My great grandfather bought the cottage in 1907, the boat was his and dates from the 1800's, a lot like an Adirondack guide boat. That was about the only type of boat on Chautauqua lake in those early days. The boat today is still there in rough condition stored in the rafters of my cousin's carriage house a few streets away from the cottage. It has lots of bronze nails in it and other bronze fittings. They have a patina but no weep lines into the wood as would be seen with steel. That old boat saw an awful lot of use for probably the better part of eighty years. In the winter it was simply placed upside down in the yard on pieces of split cordwood, no tarp or anything covering it and it got a coat of varnish every now and then. Through all of that there is no staining of the bronze into the wood.

Yes, I drill my oak before nailing, it would split, bend the nail, or both! Even when drilled, once the nail is in it won't come out without a fight. My customers like the look of rose head nails but don't like the stains <_<
I don't know anything of bronze. Is there a type best suited for nails?
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You can get silicone bronze rod at just about any welding supply. Work in very low light, might get away with just a propane torch. You only want a dull red heat. I'd just heat the last 1/2" and forge the point and then square the shank cold if you want it square. I'd make a grip die to use in the vise to forge the head. Might be able to head it cold or even annealed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...