power hammer anvil height

[bigfish]

hello all, ok so two friends and i are starting on a treadlehammer build so far we have scrounged up a piece of steel plate 1"x24"x52" and a 1hp motor i found a piece of 7"diameter round stock @ the junkyard so my question is i read somewhere that a good working height on a anvil is approximately the from the ground to your knuckles when making a fist w/arms straight down which is about where our anvil on a stump is so does the same rule genarally apply to a powerhammer?

any input would be greatly appreciated

[CurlyGeorge]

My regular anvil is a little taller than that. I don't like stooping to hammer. My old back doesn't do that very well, any more. I'm making a tire hammer, right now, and the top of the anvil is about 31". The dies are 1 1/2" tall, on top of the anvil. That's a comfortable height for me. You may be taller or shorter than me. but that works for mine. This should give you a starting point, anyway. :)

[bigfish]

thanks curly i thought it might be a little low we were thinking between 30 36 inches

[JNewman]

My big hammer is 28" high and it is lower than I like. I recently raised my small power hammer to 34" and I am going to be building a new base for it soon and I will definately be raising it to 36" or even 38", I am just over 5'10".

[bigfish]

thanks j i and my buddy are both around 5'9" so we were thinking around 32" w/2"dies plus the 1"base=35"overall
trying to upload some dad gummed pics of some blades i'm working on but it won't let me says i've used 4.27MB of 4.88MBglobal upload quota do i need to delete other pics? if so how?

CONFUSED

[bigfish]

also found a piece of 4x4 stock thought would make a nice hammer we were thinking about 18" long that should give me about an 80# hammer most of what i've read says between 50-120 pounds so it seems about right

I LOVE THIS PLACE

thanx a-lot guys

[bigfish]

ok i'll try these pics again well i guess i could only get one up, anyways got some new buffing compound- very happy!

[BryanWillman]

Bigfish - here's a naive observation -

When you hammer on an anvil, you standing above it, and your hammering arm is doing the work. So the height is whatever works best for the ergonomics of your arm.

When you use a power hammer, you are instead holding one or more sets of tongs/tools/etc. under the hammer. The ergonomics of hammering don't apply here (the machine does that), rather, the ergonomics of holding onto things being hit by a big hammer apply.

So I'll bet that power hammer anvils are almost always set up higher than hand anvils, because of this difference.

[bigfish]

thanks for the input bryan

but my thoughts on the ergonomics of it are this

try holding your arms straight out for a length of time or down or @ an angle seems like they would get tired faster straight out [i know this from a certain midddle school teacher whose fav. punishment was holding a stack of books in each hand outstretched] lol

just trying to think of all the angles b4 i have my anvil cut

thanks all

[Mainely,Bob]

So Bigfish,what are you and Curly aiming for,about belt buckle height at the top of the dies?I`m wondering because I too am collecting parts for a tire hammer.
I was planning on either square tube if I can find it or pipe for the anvil upright.Do either of you think it would be worthwhile filling the anvil pipe with something? if so what do you suggest.

[bigfish]

i think about belt height would be pretty close but once again i'm the newbie
the anvil i found is 7" diameter solid stock
but we had talked about using say 5"tube filled w/sand or something capped w/a block of solid steel
don't know if thats a good idea either
hopefully someone w/the knowhow chimes in
keep me informed of your anvil build too please the more ideas the better
thanks

scott

[arftist]

Most power hammer users recommend that the top of the sow block (anvil) be level with the users waist. This does not mean that the stock used for the anvil needs to be that long though, as it is good to build a wood base for a powerhammer and height adjustment can be accomodated there.

As to a hollow anvil, generaly not a good idea, as anvil mass relative to tup (hammer) weight determines overall effiency. A good ratio to shoot for is ten to one (minimum), with fifteen to one be closer to ideal.

There are many discussions of anvil height, solid versus hollow anvils and all other aspects of hammer construction on this site. Try the search feature.

[Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver]

Have you ever seen someone forging in a small hammer? Doesn't matter what the anvil height, they are reaching out in front of themselves. In order to hold your arms down, the work would have to be rather long to reach the die. When you're working small stuff you turn the work with your wrist, this requires your forearm to be very nearly level. That's how the bones in your forearm work, they allow rotation.

After almost forty years of mounting my hammers higher and higher I have settled on a little strong of 1/2 my height, I'm 6 foot and I like 36-38 inches.

Now, it's a whole different thing with larger hand-held work, say over 50 pounds. There you want your arm pretty much straight down at you side.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

[John Larson]

I build my hammers with 36" to 37" height of the bottom die face. Be sure to practice keeping the work pieces level when hammering and if possible keep your elbows tucked in. All this tends to become self-evident once you get going. If in doubt, take a video of yourself from the side as you're working so that you see what your stance and work movement are accomplishing.

[Jamesrjohnson]

On my 165 Anyang, the anvil height is just above my waist. I'm usually forging heavy bar stock (anywhere from 3x3 up to 6x6). With my smaller hammers (33 Anyang) the anvil height is much taller.

Heavy forging=shorter anvil height. I like to keep the weight around waist height- so I'm using more of my larger muscles legs/back, not my shoulders/bicipe.

Light forging=taller anvil height, so that I'm not hunched over, trying to watch the forging- straining my lower back.

My anvils are also set up like this. My 450 Nimba is around waist height, but I have much smaller tin smithing anvils that are set up at about chest height. For more smaller/more detailed work I like to keep the work piece closer to my upper body so I can clearly see every hammer blow.

Even my work tables, benches, and vises vary in height. It all depends on what kind of forging I'm doing.

[CurlyGeorge]

Bigfish, I got my dies welded up and measured to get an exact height. My base is 2" thick, the anvil and pedastal is 33" and the bottom die is 1 1/2" for a total height of 36 1/2" from the floor. I used to be 5'12" tall. But with age, they tell me I am now only 5" 10 1/2-11" tall. Anyway, I think that height will work just fine for me. :D

[bigfish]

ok thanks all working a smaller piece @ or just above waist high makes a lot of sense please excuse the occasional dumb question as this is all pretty new to me it looks like we have decided on around 36-38 inches total at this point not planning to work anything to large but i'm sure that will change too :]
but as to putting a wood base would this be for a vibration damper? if so i have some native oak 2x6 planks i think would work
also thinking about 10-1 or 15-1 anvil/hammer ratio since my anvil will be around 400# i guess that would work out to be 7-9"4x4 hammer
also trying to figure out the search feature to look up some questions but still trying to figure it out

i would like to thank you all for taking the time to help out a lowly amateur such as myself :D

[Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver]

There are no "lowly amateurs” around here. We're all just "lowly blacksmiths".

[bigfish]

i like that

[bigfish]

but i don't know if i would call myself a blacksmith yet

maybe just

a guy who heats things up and beats the heck out of em'


or blacksmith has a nice ring to it [pun intended]

[SGropp]

The original question was about the best height for the anvil on a treadle hammer. Keep in mind that unlike a power hammer you need room to raise your knee to crank the treadle to strike a blow. My treadle hammer was made from the old ABANA plans and the anvil is at 39", any bottom tooling puts it even higher. Any lower and you would run the risk of hitting the work or a handheld tool with your knee on a vigorous up stroke on the hammer treadle.

Treadle hammers are great tools, ready to strike a hard or soft single or multiple blows. They would be a bit laborious,however to do much drawing. They are easy to use with all those top tools you've been collecting but that are too tall to safely use under a power hammer. They are also a great substitute for that hired or volunteer striker who is off to lunch or somewhere else. Mine has an 85# solid steel head .

The dies on my power hammers are at 36-37 " and I am 5'11" on a good day. Make an adjustable height stock rest with a heavy stable base to hold long work at die height. Put a hardy hole the same size as in your shop anvil in the treadle hammer anvil and you can use all your bottom tools interchangeably

[Dragons lair]

Just had to ask, How tall on a bad day?
Ken

[ThomasPowers]

How bad a day? Been several times myself that I've come in from the shop feeling like I could walk under the dog's belly without ducking. (and a few times where I feel like I should duck when I go past the trusses that are set at 10'...)

[bigfish]

thanks guys i hadn't thought of the hardy hole, gd idea :rolleyes: