Countryforge Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 HI I just purchased a Hypona gas forge. I made some burners, got some fire brick. The home made works well. But for the use, a lot of gas was used. I called on a place that sells all the ones you mentioned but he directed me to this, as one that burns 2/3 less gas. I told him he better be correct or it will be in the papers the next day. This forge was amazing for economy,great heat, great variability, but some limitations to size of material, try looking it up. Can't hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Trez Cole Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 mankle is the way to go. if you are doing production you need one with a blower Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Martin Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Another one for any of the diamondbackironworks forges. I have the two burner knifemaker. Forge at 4psi, and weld at 6psi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
looper567 Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 I have used NC Tool, Forgemaster and Mankel forges professionally, and I have to say, the Mankel was the worst performing forge I have ever seen. Even with a brand new liner, which required actually cutting the forge apart to install, making it an all day headache, it still could not touch the Forgemaster or NC Tool units, not even close. It used massive amounts of fuel to deliver lack-luster results. People think those blown burners are efficient because of the lower pressures they run, but when you factor in the huge gas orifice size, fuel usage, even at lower pressures, is much greater. The Hypona Forges I would like to see run. there is nothing really new about that design. Those burners were developed and are still used by Valley Forge on their Quantum series forges. Only difference I see is the vents machined into the inlets at the forge shell. With the shell being insulated with plain old Kaowool, and using the lightly modified Quantum burners, I can not seem to fathom the 2/3 less fuel claim which defies all laws of physics. I wonder what the comparison is being made to? A forge of similar interior dimensions, with similar exhaust openings and insulation, running a standard type naturally aspirated burner, I would be willing to bet would be within a couple percent on the fuel usuage scale. I bet they were comparing it to a Mankel. Sorry, just my professional observation based on my first hand experience over the years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quenchcrack Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Another one for any of the diamondbackironworks forges. I have the two burner knifemaker. Forge at 4psi, and weld at 6psi. You can weld at 6 psi? How long does it take the forge to heat up to reach welding heat? I have run the forge at 15 psi and it really roars but it does not need to run anywhere near that pressure just to forge. Do you protect the hearth with SS or anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oak Hill Forge Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Hey looper567, is this your experience with your unit ? "Another one for any of the diamondbackironworks forges. I have the two burner knifemaker. Forge at 4psi, and weld at 6psi. " What pressure do you find necessary with your forges to "weld". I think that's a reletive term also cause I'm sure it depends on whether you are trying to weld razor blades or 1" bar stock. That sounds impressive, but. I'm new to blacksmithing and even newer to gas forges, but that sounds optimistic to me ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Martin Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 I welded up my last damascus billet, 1"x1"x5" and welded at 6psi. It doesn't matter what size stock, you just have to let the stock soak up the heat... Mine is very efficient. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quenchcrack Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 I coated my new DB 2 Burner BS forge with ITC 100 before I used it. Not sure if it helps but I had some left over from the rehab job on my Whisper Baby. 6 psi seems plenty of heat to forge with but I have yet to try a weld. Too hot to forge in Houston today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
looper567 Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Hey looper567, is this your experience with your unit ? "Another one for any of the diamondbackironworks forges. I have the two burner knifemaker. Forge at 4psi, and weld at 6psi. " What pressure do you find necessary with your forges to "weld". I think that's a reletive term also cause I'm sure it depends on whether you are trying to weld razor blades or 1" bar stock. That sounds impressive, but. I'm new to blacksmithing and even newer to gas forges, but that sounds optimistic to me ? It depends on the unit. The Knifemaker Forges are the most efficient in the lineup. The Blacksmith models will require more pressure and the Metal Artist will require the most. 15 PSI should do the trick with the Blacksmith Models, actually, 10 would probably do it, depending on conditions and your experience. Like with everything else, experience is the biggest factor. As far as the welding at 6PSI, I have spoken to many customers that weld in that range with the Knifemaker models. I actually had one customer call with the forge running in the background. The day after he received it he was welding Damascus at 6PSI and wanted to let me know how impressed he was with it. That said, I can't make a weld at 6PSI, but I don't have alot of experience forge welding, my background was Architectural Ironwork... I'm like a fish out of water with Damascus, but I'll get there! Until then, I'll rely on my trusty old 5160 for my blades! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avadon Posted June 3, 2009 Author Share Posted June 3, 2009 Only the ceiling of the chiliforges are exposed kaowool and ICT, all the other sides are ceramic plates which also come with optional ceramic plugs if you want to reduce the opening. They also have a little wider and taller port then the 3 burner diamondback and no door means they won't be losing any heat on a side or sufferig from a lack of insulation/ceramic plate on a side. Of course that means you'll have to have a seperate setup for large pieces. But I think for it's use its the best forge on the market, even better then the $1000.00 NC Forges. The frame body of their forges are actually built just for chiliforge. Sounds like they're doing pretty good business. There is actually a waiting list I had to get on and this isn't just some side job/hobby for them, Chili forge is all these people do. Plus no political proselytizing! The only problem I have is holding out to get the forge before the anticipation kills me. Thinking of building one of those swing-arm stands for the forge in the meantime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlotte Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 (edited) Frankly, If I were to buy a commercial forge I would buy a Chiliforge. I happen to think that the design of the forge and the Hybrid Burner they use are the best available. That said, I still prefer my own quirky way of doing things. :) Edited June 3, 2009 by Charlotte insert word Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avadon Posted June 3, 2009 Author Share Posted June 3, 2009 hehe... what is your quirky way of doing things? I am pretty much willing to build every tool I need except for the machinery but I find the older I get the more realistic I am time vs money. Sometimes it is just easier to pay someone who has all the materials and is an expert at it then it is to reinvent the wheel. At least that's my excuse for not wanting to dive in this time and build my own. I figure i'll build a custom forge down the road of I need something specific. I also want to build a burner assembly with a downward cowl over it for hitting sheet metal for armour. Hopefully I can even make it foot activated somehow. Saw a cool design for this and decided I have to have it. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlotte Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Avadon, to explain how and why I build my forges would take pages. I built my first gas forge in December 1987. The burner I use breaks all the rules set out by Michael Porter in "Gas Burners". I start by drilling my own jets with number drills in mild steel and go from there. Yes I understand the trade offs between buy and make. For most people I recommend buying a gas forge. I've had very frustrating experiences trying to teach people about the dynamics of a gas forge and how to pursue the many alternatives to the same goal. You may have noted here the amout of discussion it takes to get new gas forge going the way the builder wants it. I fully sympathize with, and endorse, your choice. My choice revolves around a midset that is as intrested in the technology of blacksmithing as in the production. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avadon Posted June 4, 2009 Author Share Posted June 4, 2009 I'm very much that same way when it comes to specific things. For some reason I got heavily invested in steel anvil stands and set out to build a stand that would rival Hofi's famous stands. In fact I may have even gone a little further then even the people who really pushed the limits thus far. I'll have to show everyone shortly. But I spent probably a month and a half on the thing, and it is just so overkill but for some reason I got into the construction of it. Of course if I were to spend that kind effort with each thing in m shop i'd probably never build anything, just have excellent tools, so I have to catch myself when I start losing to much time. With your experience you should write a manual or even make some blueprints for the site. I know I, as well as many others are always interested in new techniques. I think this site is all about doing it smarter and easier then doing it harder. I also try to head towards practical information and further away from theoretical simply because i'm a fabricator and not an engineer. The most 'engineering' I do is calipers. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ActionBastard Posted December 12, 2010 Share Posted December 12, 2010 I have done a good bit of research and read a number of reviews on Diamondback's products as a whole. Overall every review and all the technical information as well as videos are stellar ratings and excellence. The explanation of the features for each forge on his webpage are extremely helpful and led me to do better research by giving me terms and concepts to learn more about as well as links to supporting information. That said, I have no direct experience with his product(s). Regardless, his clear and factual replies here as well as the many good reviews have convinced me to spend my money with him. There is a sale at his webpage and this is a Christmas gift, so I'm winning 3 fold with this deal. However, it wasn't just the facts that sold me on his product. The attitude of the owner of Diamondback (loopy, yes?) is A+ in my opinion and the fact he is willing to put his reputation and business on the line to voice something he feels passionately about speaks VOLUMES about his courage and dedication to his morals and ideals. Companies and individuals who lack extreme dedication to something so central and core as ideals and morals cannot be expected to have extreme dedication to their work 100% of the time. This is not to say they cannot make outstanding products without such displays of their dedication, but I believe it to be good marketing to show you believe in something and commit to it. Thank you for all of your helpful information on this thread. It has assured me that the product I am buying is made well and by a person I can respect. I hope you all find the same satisfaction with whatever products you do decide to buy. Disagree, but don't knock a man's product because you don't agree with his politics. Doing it in such a manner as to appear innocent is just low. That's my own two nickels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braedon Posted December 12, 2010 Share Posted December 12, 2010 After A few months of research and hemming and hawing whether to build one myself, decided to go with Diamondback's product,,I got the 2 burner econo, which will suit me just fine for damascus,,should be here early to middle this week,,also a christmas present from the little woman ,,bless her,,That being said it also gives me great satisfaction to know I am not buying this product from a "guy" just out ta make a buck,,It's his business,,his website,,and if he has a platform like that that is his, he can say what he likes (and i'm not just sayin that cause I agree with him)..by the way I completley agree with Ron Paul's quote, "truth is treason in an empire of lies". That pretty well sums it up I have done a good bit of research and read a number of reviews on Diamondback's products as a whole. Overall every review and all the technical information as well as videos are stellar ratings and excellence. The explanation of the features for each forge on his webpage are extremely helpful and led me to do better research by giving me terms and concepts to learn more about as well as links to supporting information. That said, I have no direct experience with his product(s). Regardless, his clear and factual replies here as well as the many good reviews have convinced me to spend my money with him. There is a sale at his webpage and this is a Christmas gift, so I'm winning 3 fold with this deal. However, it wasn't just the facts that sold me on his product. The attitude of the owner of Diamondback (loopy, yes?) is A+ in my opinion and the fact he is willing to put his reputation and business on the line to voice something he feels passionately about speaks VOLUMES about his courage and dedication to his morals and ideals. Companies and individuals who lack extreme dedication to something so central and core as ideals and morals cannot be expected to have extreme dedication to their work 100% of the time. This is not to say they cannot make outstanding products without such displays of their dedication, but I believe it to be good marketing to show you believe in something and commit to it. Thank you for all of your helpful information on this thread. It has assured me that the product I am buying is made well and by a person I can respect. I hope you all find the same satisfaction with whatever products you do decide to buy. Disagree, but don't knock a man's product because you don't agree with his politics. Doing it in such a manner as to appear innocent is just low. That's my own two nickels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peacock Posted December 12, 2010 Share Posted December 12, 2010 Yesterday I used a diamondback and a chili forge. i was able to easily weld in both. I own an NC as welll as 2 other home built all of those also reach welding temp with ease. But in my opinion my Swan forge is the best you can buy. I have owned it 12 years still on the first liner very easy on gas, has pass thru, large door for chunkier stuff, heats quickly. Now the down side it takes alot of money to get one, but it has paid for it's self many times over. If you are on a tight budget it may not be for you. If want a great forge that you can use for years with no trouble, easy on gas, and a pleasure to use, my vote is the Swan Euro-fitter. P.S. mine has the flame trimmer but will run fine without it. The trimmer lets you tune for a netural flame (almost no scale) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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