Attempting to Melting Copper in a Keg Furnace

[Blueprint222]

I'm new here and fairly new to melting and casting aluminum.  I built a keg furnace (for lack of a better term) a few months ago and have had no trouble melting aluminum.

The keg is lined with refractory cement top, bottom and sides.  The interior dimension is 10" diameter, 13" tall

The furnace is fired by a Mathewson Metals propane burner.

So now I'm attempting to melt copper.  I've tried small pieces of smashed pipe and wire of various gauges with no success. Everything just gets cherry red, no melt.

I'm considering adding a second burner.  My question is should I install the second above the existing burner or at the same level, 180 degrees off.

[Frosty]

Welcome aboard Blueprint, glad to have you.

What is the name of the refractory "cement" you're using and how much insulation is between the "cement" and shell (keg)?

Is the burner you're using the one pictured below? 

Aluminum is a low melt metal and easy to melt. Copper on the other hand is a high temp metal at approx. 1983f. with the other attendant requirements. Without an insulating layer there is no chance of getting a melter the size of yours up to the 2,000f range. 

I highly discommend spending more money on the below pictured burners, the pic from their site shows a weak poorly built burner, the choke sleeve is wide open and it's running on the rich side. If you have a drill press and modest shop skills building a much better burner isn't difficult at all.

First though you might need to build a proper melter.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Blueprint222]

Frosty, the cement is DIY, portland, fire clay, perlite and silica. It’s solid cement, no insulation blanket. 
Yes, that is the burner I have. I was wondering if slotting the tube between the drilled vent holes would allow better breathing.

I’ve seen so many “perfect”  burner designs I’m not sure where to go next.  Is there one you would recommend.

My wife says I have every tool known to man. (For the young guys, tool purchases are balanced with carrots.) So I’m confident I can build the “perfect burner”. LOL.

 

[swedefiddle]

Good Morning 222,

I think what Frosty is saying, he can't see the jet. The air holes are generally behind the end of the jet, to make it work right.

Neil

[Frosty]

Blueprint: You're lucky it didn't get very hot, that's not a suitable high temp material at all, it's a fire place bed or firepit is about the limit of that kind of mix. Did you get it from an old book or article? I've seen similar, even tried it a couple times I still have most of a 50lb sack of fire clay in fact. Perlite is insulating but has a melting temp close enough to 2,000f it would've started breaking down if you'd gotten it hot enough to melt copper. 

Building a good melter is a whole nother post or three of it's own and there are better casters here than I. I've only dabbled years ago.

No Neil, that's not what I was saying at all. If the jet had been so far back it wasn't visible it would be burning so lean with the chole wide open it probably wouldn't stay lit. It's a bad knock off of a Porter burner, just one of many burners made and sold by guys who don't know what they're doing. Do a web search for "Frosty T burners for sale" sometime, I do once in a great while and you rarely see one made to the basic ratios.

No 222 there are no perfect burners or anything for that matter but there sure are better burners than the one you bought. The "burners 101" section of Iforge has literally thousands of posts discussing burners of both types, gun (blown) and NA (Naturally Aspirated). There are a number of proven home build burner designs there too. The one I did is pinned it's far from the strongest, most efficient or effective I developed one that's reasonably effective but requires minimum shop tools and skills. If a person can measure accurately, drill a straight hole and tap it s/he's golden. Building a Mikey takes more skill and some special tooling but it's a hotter burner. I believe his plans are posted or at least linked here too. And we're the old guard there are burners being made now that make ours look pretty wimpy.

If you stay with the dimensions you're building a pretty big melter and might need two NA burners or a gun burner, they have to push the flame through a pretty narrow gap between crucible and melter wall.  

I need to knock off now or I'll ramble aimlessly. The basics of building a melter are the same as a propane forge only vertical with an insulated floor and drain hole. Burner(s) mount differently and such but another time okay? I'm more of a burner guy.

Frosty The Lucky.