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I Forge Iron

Pros / cons of socket type top die


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I'm starting a tire hammer build.

Torbjörn åhman shows what he named an abno power hammer, where the top die slips inside a socket in the tup, and the force looks like it is transferred via the collar of the die.

I think this is similar to some folks' flypress tooling as well.

I can't think why this is a better system than bolt on, but it seems so elegant I'm drawn to it.

Thoughts?

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On 2/5/2019 at 1:23 AM, shrike said:

 

The point with that socket type is for easy die change, from what I can see. Is this something you need? I think people find extra dies are superfluent. One set of flat dies and one set of combination/drawing dies is all that most need. Also those dies are a pain to fabricate, and the receiving parts on the hammer likewise.

Another advantage of the Abno no.1 dies may be that they can be rotated for better access. But the lower die can't be rotated so forget that point. If rotation was important then the 800 pound air hammers would be total failures...

If you want easy socket change then make your own dovetails. It shouldn't be that hard with careful angle grinding.

I have bolted flat dies on my home built airhammer and have plans for spring tools to hold in my left hand. You can have all your additional dies in your hands instead. That! Is elegant! Take a look at Brent Bailey's youtube videos. It'll change your outlook.

I think one set of flat dies and one set of either combination dies or drawing dies is all you need. On flat dies you can put all kinds of saddle tools and also top tools and spring tools. Abno socket dies may be overdoing it.

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Pro's- I'm a lazy and would much rather not have to deal with traditional power hammer die changes, plus it would be a cool project to build. And like arftist mentioned, production work... but ain't nobody got time for that with a day job. 

Con's- You spend a bunch of time building a die change system only to find out what you built is a garbage design.

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No, I don't do production work. There doesn't seem to be much activity on these forums (from what I can see) so I thought giving my opinion to bounce ideas on was better than nothing.

Quick change dies is always a pro, but everyone I see on instagram and youtube use saddle tools or other types of tools on top of flat dies. Unless it's axe making, it seems to be flat dies all the way.

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I was a machinist in a blacksmith shop with a fair amount of work. In the year I spent there I made at least three sets of dies and they already had many.

Yes, you can do a lot with hand held tooling and flat dies, but if you want to make a lot of pieces fast and have them be good, then special tooling pays.

I do 90% of my work with just combo dies which is why I like them so much, but for some jobs I must be able to change dies to be profitable. 

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