If you were running a blacksmith school...

[yesteryearforge]

Good post and train of thought HW

Mike Tanner

[Hofi]

Heving A Schhol In Israel For The Last 20 Yeas And Teaching In The Usa ,in Germany In Holland And In Japan ,more The 3000 Student Came To My Classes.
I Want To Reffer Only To On Subject '' The European Apprentice System''
Many Times This Phrase Is Mentioned In The Internet Talks About Studing Blacksmithing.
Ther Is No One ''european Style System'' The Franch ''la Companion'' The German , The English Two Different Systemes For Fariers And Blacksmith, The Italien Style In Venice And The Late Tony Beneton Sccools Are Complitly Different In Their Aproch To The Teaching And In Zcheck Ripublic It Is Eaven More Different. It Very Much Deppends On The Tredition And The Cultuer Of The Country.
In Germany For Instence U Can Not Open A Warkshop Unless U Have A ''muster Degree'' To Gain It Trough The German System U Must Go Through The ''lerling Gissele To The Muster Degree'' All This Takes Between 5 -7 Years And The Muster Exams Cost Is 15000$ ,i Do Not See Any American Going Through This System . For Me It Was Very Emotional To Come And To Teach In Berlin In A Proffetion School In The Forging Dipartment With All The Strong Treditional Burden. I Hed A Meeting With 10 Blacksmith Musters Of Berlin That Every One Of Them Is Having A Very Big Workshop And They Have ''journy Men'' Studing With Them ,in The Meeting I Said I Do Not Want To Change The German System I Just Want To Add To It Another Layer,you Masters Are Not Heving Time To Teach U Are Busy With Planning Mony Bussness And All This Stuff You Send Your Student To Me And I''ll Teach Them ,and This Is How It Works To Day,the Berlin Musters Are Sending Theit Students To My Classe In Berlin And They Also Pay For It , And Because I Teach Basic, Advance ,tool Forging And Free Form Air Hammer Thechnic I Can See The Same Student That Are Coming To Take All The Classes.
In Short What I Wanted To Say Is ;after I Have Initieted 4 Scools In America(the Forth One Is Now Been Astablished In Potland Oregon) And Teaching And Demonstrating In America The Last 10 Years That ''the Europien Style'' Is Only A Wishfull Thinking And May Be A Dream,because It Is Complitly Against The American Individual Treddition.
Hofi

[Ten Hammers]

Well, I guess someone has to have the honor of following you Mr. Hofi. I very much appreciate your years of experience and thank you for your sharing of knowledge. I think that for the young folk here, the opportunity is incredible. It is humbling to have the opportunity to drink from the same well as some of the posters on this thread ( yes this includes you Rich). Rhetoric and composition has never really been my strong suit so an English major may perhaps disect my post but that's ok too. Rising to a challenge has never really been a problem to me. I have a fair amount in common with HW's post ( some key skills done fairly fast in a production environment but other skills lacking ).

Were I to teach ( and I have not and do not) I would start with the very basic. Shop safety ( personal in nature, eye and hearing protection and the difference between hard and soft states in metals). Anvil height ( and again basic for ME - London Pattern anvil ). Next I would ( I suspect ) speak about building, maintaining and using a coal fire and the availability of coal and my expereince with different types and grades of coal. I have expereince in using charcoal and would cover this. Crank blowers, power blowers ( and airgates ) and bellows that I have used would be covered. I suspect that the next really important ( and final for this post ) point would be what the look and characteristic of the stock ( mild steel ) is for me when I forge ( hand or power hammer). This look is a nice bright orange to yellow with free loose scale. Below welding heat. Until someone has forged at this heat ( and also burned a few pieces ) they cannot ( in my opinion) learn to appreciate the lesser temperatures that steel will move and forge at. Once you learn what the high end of the heat spectrum is and how to achieve it ( again mild steel) you can learn to maintain timing in the fire in relationship to timing on the anvil. When you have lost enough heats ( and or burned enough pieces that have been forged thin) you will learn timing in and out of the fire. this is in a controlled light environment inside the shop. Outside in the daylight things are different. I sincerely believe that Farriers tools ( inc anvils ) should be not only considered but discussed in this basic (first exposure for some students) training. Thank you for your time. I wish to thank Junior Strasil, Jens Butler, Bill Printy, Steve White, Larry Crow and Gene Pippin for their help in the past ( this is personal hands on in the shop help). I could have a major long list from online help but will not mention at this time.

[Johannes]

I would first start a theoratical course about metals, aloys working tempratures carbon grades...
next I would give some art history and then some aplied to blacksmithing art history (design architecture armory ...)
Then i would have a course in shapes constructions and 3d design.
afther this a theoratical on the forge, the tools, the techniques.
when this is over I would give a theoratical and a practical aboud saftey and have everrybody take a mandatory first aid course.
Then we would go to the shop and start the basic techniques over and over again until your boddy knows them, after this, where aboud 2 years in course now, we would start advanced techniques and projects as discribed above.
The course would end with a verbal theoratical exam, a mandatory work piece, and a free work piece (masterpiece).
it would be a 3 year course..

or am I overdoing it?