Hillbillysmith Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 And besides, he's not doing nuclear work he's just looking to weld up an anvil..... I would bet a years worth of wages that i could do the job he's wanting to accomplish with the equipment he has available and it will pass x-ray and last for generations to come!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 If you guys wanna play swords, just remember it's not a nuclear missile silo were talking about here... I appreciate the guidance, and value it greatly... I just needed something to pound on.... j If you throw meat to the tigers they're gonna fight over it. That's one of the benifits of this forum, you get it all and take what you need. My biggest concern with this weld is the welding of alloy steel with common mig wire aside from the mass of it. In my experience this is likely to fail esp when you throw impact into the mix. Welding a wood chipper frame made of mild steel is way different. I hope all your welds never fail and if this one does or dosen't (say on the anniversary of this thread) let us know, I've been wrong before..... :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Sells Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 my old 175+ burned up, (not while I was using it) and since at the time money was tight, I got a used century 90 for $100, as a replacement mig, so that and a 120v buzz box are all I have other than the 400 amp diesel I can borrow. its fine for most things but if I can get good welds with more than 3/8 stock I want to know :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I have seen welds my brother has done in 1/2 inch mild plate with a Hobart 135 running self shielding flux core. PPP's Lincoln 135 will, eventually, get it done. Weld 2 minutes, wait 8 minutes...no fun...time consuming...weld, peen, wait... weld, peen, wait...weld, peen, wait... or if you do shorter welds: weld, peen, weld, peen, wait...weld peen weld peen wait... Lots of time consuming not very fun. Use a bigger machine if it is available! I don't know if your 90A machine will do this. Try it and see. For putting a solid 1 inch stem on a hardy tool it probably will do it just fine. For joining larger pieces together...maybe, maybe not. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulsepushthepopulace Posted August 17, 2012 Author Share Posted August 17, 2012 If you throw meat to the tigers they're gonna fight over it. That's one of the benifits of this forum, you get it all and take what you need. My biggest concern with this weld is the welding of alloy steel with common mig wire aside from the mass of it. In my experience this is likely to fail esp when you throw impact into the mix. Welding a wood chipper frame made of mild steel is way different. I hope all your welds never fail and if this one does or dosen't (say on the anniversary of this thread) let us know, I've been wrong before..... :) I'll be running into a tombstone welder here shortly, and I WILL MOST CERTAINLY re-weld this anvil in due time... I'm sure the only real reason why It's a catastrophic failure is because the anvil is relatively small and gets nice and warm on my first heat... Also, I'm also focusing on the sweet spot and not leveraging much work elsewhere... my old 175+ burned up, (not while I was using it) and since at the time money was tight, I got a used century 90 for $100, as a replacement mig, so that and a 120v buzz box are all I have other than the 400 amp diesel I can borrow. its fine for most things but if I can get good welds with more than 3/8 stock I want to know :) I'll take a picture for educational purposes when I cut and reweld with the bigger welder... It might look right as rain, or it might look like bugger nuggets... Then you can site this thread on how it can or shouldn't be done, with examples explaining why... Learning doesn't really give me a soap box to stand on, so for now all of you whom don't think its a good weld, you're probably right... It'l hold until something better... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillbillysmith Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 I have NEVER had a weld fail yet, test or in real life.... I am all too familiar with the risks associated with the work i do in this particular application. My buddy welded in some plates on the main drum where the blades are located and they came flying out like gossamer, punched holes through the barn walls, and almost punched out windows in the house (45 yards away)..... There's an extreme amount of rotational inertia as well as momentum. With the speeds he was running, i roughly calculated that the plates were traveling approximately 389.7mph..... So, needless to say, I'm aware. -Hillbilly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bam Bam 1 Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 i've welded 100% x-ray welds in steel mill blast furneces.and hammer mills with .35 wire and 3/32 stick.it all depends on prep work and procedure.with high sress welds less is more.your first weld does all the penatration.or root weld as it is called.once you have a good pre heat.and remember the welding machine is also produceing heat.and maintaining what is called the interpass[ temp at core of weld].when you weld in mutiple layers you will produce a stonger weld than a fat hogger weave.think of braided steel cable vs solid steel of same size.our smithing math some times is miss placed with our welding math. i am finding my welding and metal working exp. at odds with my smithing quite often.same animal just a different breed.bull dog vs poodle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bam Bam 1 Posted September 11, 2012 Share Posted September 11, 2012 a few things to remember.if you have to weld thick steel or iron of what ever flavor a bevel is needed to produce penetration.other wise you are just putting duct tape over a crack in a brick wall.chip out crack fill with mortar all the way thru.bevel steel weld all the way thu.mortar flush to brick.weld fush to thickness of steel.1/2" thick plate with a bevel fill bevel weld to top rule to remember cap weld is nickle wide and dime high.(dime thick not tall).at suface of parent metal.high pressure welds in nuke plates are welded with 3/32 tig roots and 3/32 stick caps at 80amps.100% x-ray and hold 10,000 psi when tested.yes.. i do this for a living. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldchisel Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 just have someone hit it with some 5/32 7018 at about160 -170amps.done in a fraction of the time and much less a chance of the weld failing.works for me dude Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillbillysmith Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 Bam Bam 1, you are right. I understand everything that you've explained perfectly clear. I, too, do this for a living.... Keep in mind that i am NOT the one who welded in the plates that came flying out. -Hillbilly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillbillysmith Posted September 12, 2012 Share Posted September 12, 2012 Also, bearing in mind, the weld beads need to be very close to equal size seeing as i am dealing with a 750lb object spinning at over 3,000rpm with sharp blades inside. -Hillbilly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulsepushthepopulace Posted September 14, 2012 Author Share Posted September 14, 2012 These are all very informative posts! Thank you all for your help... Almost have the DialArc 250 set up... This past week has been all about getting the electrical sorted... Tomorrow, I fire her up!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillbillysmith Posted September 14, 2012 Share Posted September 14, 2012 Best of luck to you Pulsepushthepopulace!! Remember, non of us who weld (especially for a living) learned the skill over night. Never get discouraged, always try new things, and above all have fun! Be sure to be safe (sounds repetitive, i know) because when working with metal, its either sharp or hot if not both. Plus, electrical current isn't a joke....... Any other questions, curiosities, thoughts, or opinions, just ask. I'm sure i speak for everybody when i say we'll be more than glad to help with what we can. Post pix of your welds! :) -Hillbilly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RGraff Posted September 22, 2012 Share Posted September 22, 2012 I agree with those who said it can be done, assuming machine is properly set and your technique is correct. With that flux core, take extra care to make sure you've gotten every bit of slag gone prior to your next pass. Joint prep and root pass are paramount when welding with a "small" machine and watch that duty cycle. Joint prep, in this case, determines penetration or, more accurately, depth of weld. A bit of pre and post heating won't hurt a thing either. Taking your time and not rushing the job will go a long way towards a product that lasts. How about a pic or two? :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulsepushthepopulace Posted September 23, 2012 Author Share Posted September 23, 2012 I agree with those who said it can be done, assuming machine is properly set and your technique is correct. With that flux core, take extra care to make sure you've gotten every bit of slag gone prior to your next pass. Joint prep and root pass are paramount when welding with a "small" machine and watch that duty cycle. Joint prep, in this case, determines penetration or, more accurately, depth of weld. A bit of pre and post heating won't hurt a thing either. Taking your time and not rushing the job will go a long way towards a product that lasts. How about a pic or two? :) Just got a miller dialarc 250, as soon as I get done with the current anvil build, I'm gonna cut and re-weld this with some 7018... I'm much more confident in the stick process, having burned through some boxes now I just like the way it lays a bead... I will post pics for sure > when I cut through it, because I want to see for myself where I did or did not mess up... I'm without a band saw at the moment though... :unsure: My process was bevel the metal to to a point where I was essentially welding about a 1/4" material together; sandwiched 1/4"stock as a spacer in the middle, tack the outside edges, preheat, then laid a bead as neatly and as close to the center as possible, and went to the other side and built upon that with another bead, then finally joined it all with a third bead that hit the top parent metal... I filleted my way out, using a pound of wire... deslag and wire brushed between passes... I'l throw up a pick next time I'm out in the barn though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigred Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 I too have spent many years in high quality x-ray welding in fact I served my apprenticeship doing it and, while I agree that it can be stuck together as described, I wouldn't say that it was a right-job. Even though you are preping it, MIG just doesn't have the depth of penetration so there will be HAZ cracking under impact. Whether this cracking would lead to catastrophic failure or not is moot - it's about doing a right job on summat that's important. i agree with all of those who reco 7018 stick - 5 mins to do the job right as opposed to hours of perhaps wasted work if it fails. MHO anyway TIE br Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RGraff Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Didn't mean to imply that it was the right way, only that it could be done given the limited experience and minimal equipment at the OP's disposal. I will admit to questionable "fixes" in the past myself, done with the intent of getting back to work, making the proper repairs when time and funds allowed. My bad...should have been more clear. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigred Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Sorrry if I sounded a bit 'school ma'am-ish'. TBH I never rated MIG as anything other than a semi-skilled (good thing) means of doing light fab not requiring top quality mechanical properties. The notable exception being in the heavy fab sector where the machinery is now able to compete with MMA for quality. Apart from the relatively low skill level reqd to produce adequet welds MMA, TIG and even oxy /acet (for brass brazing and hard-facing)are more versatile and produce far higher quality results. At least in the UK, gas and consummable costs make a MIG more expensive to run, and they are rubbish on-site in a gentle breeze (even with flux cored). Ooops - my welders' antipathy for the ubiquitous MIG is showing - i'd better buzz off ;) TIE br Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigred Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Failte McB B) see from your prof we share a love of the water of life - I am lucky enough to have a son who works at the distillery who make 'Highland park', 'The Macallan' and 'The glenrothes' - pity you didn't live a little closer mate ;) TIE br Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Failte McB B) see from your prof we share a love of the water of life - I am lucky enough to have a son who works at the distillery who make 'Highland park', 'The Macallan' and 'The glenrothes' - pity you didn't live a little closer mate ;) TIE br Macallan is my favorite..... :wub: :wub: :wub: ......I sip 50 year old in my dreams and 12 yr old once or thrice a year (had to cool it)................ I was in Edinburgh in 06 and it could happen again.....You're not a Cambell by chance are you?....... :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigred Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Nah - I come from a far older line of scots called Douglas - originally from the south west. There are still places in the North where I wouldn't admit being a Campbell - even if I was one :o I have a boxed 50 yr old from North British distilleries - waiting on my 1st grandchild (Jan '13 another Capricorn <_< ), at which time it will be 'couped' :blink: I will post a pic of the offending bottle when I work out the mechanics of posting it. One of life's greatest pleasures is sipping the amber and swapping BS stories with like minded metal bashers - we are a dying breed - thank the gods for places like IFI. TIE br Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ten Hammers Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Bigred, welcome aboard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigred Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Thx TH, Great site, great people, wish we had summat similar this side of the pond. TIE br Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Thx TH, Great site, great people, wish we had summat similar this side of the pond. TIE br I think Glenn was in the right place at the right time when he created this site and it's global now and has been for some time. The diversity of the members is huge compared to some smaller sites I visit. I mean, I don't really care if someone is hosting a hammer in somewhere in the Outback but it's kinda neat to know we're OUT there..... B).....If I were traveling to Oz and knew about it who knows, I just might show up. Where else can you find that kind of info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ten Hammers Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 The connections made on the site are ( to say the least ) astounding. I have met many. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.