Thurstan Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Hi I'm looking to buy a forge for knife making and sword making. Problem is I do not have a clue on what forge would be best. What would you guys suggest? Solid fuel or gas? And what type do you guys prefer to use? Greetings from belgium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caius Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 it depends on how much space you have available. personally i use a coal forge, made from a semi-truck brake drum. i've had some good knives come out of it and the makings of a decent enough looking sword. coal is relatively cheap ($35/100lb in Covington, LA) although it takes a little bit more maintenance than a gas forge. you dont need a large forge for swordsmithing as it is detrimental to progress to heat more steel than you can work at one time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
son_of_bluegrass Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 From the nature of the question, I'm assuming you have little to no experience with a forge. So there are a number of questions that need answering. What is the cheaper fuel for you. The best you'll be able to do is compare based on price per BTU as BTU usage will vary from forge to forge. Which is easier to get? How much time are you willing to invest in learning to maintain the fire? A gas forge is close to "light it and go" but a coal forge is "light it, coke off (unless you have coke), feed and clean while going". Both will work and work well. Coal is dirtier (smokier, smellier, coal dust, clinker). Gas can be dangerous. Coal has nostalgia if that matters. A coal forge is easier to cobble together with stuff that is lying around. Seeing as you're in Belgium, there may be local ordinances that restrict coal burning and make gas a lot less hassle. If you go gas, you'll need one that you can pass long blades through to heat the area you're working. Gas forges have limits on what size they can heat, you can't expect to fit something like a breast plate or gate section into most gas forges, not a problem with coal. ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 I'd look into going with gas; *unless* you need a historical sword smithing set up and then coal or even charcoal would be more accurate, (coal came into smithing use about the High Middle Ages according to Gies & Gies in "Cathedral Forge and Waterwheel", charcoal was in use from the start of forging up to *now*!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southernforge Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 UTube has a bunch of videos that you might wish to look at before choosing a forge. It is a matter of finding the type of forge that fits your need: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurstan Posted February 23, 2011 Author Share Posted February 23, 2011 Well space is not a problem, i have enough space to put a coal forge or a gas forge. For a coal forge, how long does it take to make a good fire? Also for knifes and swords etc, do both gas and coal give the same good results? Or is for example gas forges better for these things? And how big do these forges get? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 For a coal forge, how long does it take to make a good fire? Depends on your firemaking skills and method used. You will also need fire management skills to keep the fire a "good" fire or it will burn out, or smoke a great deal if you don't practice fire management skills. Also for knifes and swords etc, do both gas and coal give the same good results? Or is for example gas forges better for these things? And how big do these forges get? Results depend on the skill of the smith more than the type of fire. A coal or gas forge can be as large or as small as you construct one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 How long from cold to a working fire in a coal forge? 5 minutes to 30+ minutes *depending*. I like to leave a good heap of breeze so I can get re-started easily and be working while letting the new coal coke on the outside. My students tend to like to burn it down all the way to the grate and then have to take an excessively smokey long time before they can even start a non-blade project while waiting to get a clean fire. Quality of coal makes a big difference too. Coal fires are generally better to localize a heat but learning to "work" the fire is a skill to be mastered along with how to use it to forge with. My students tend to burn up a lot more work with coal. Propane is generally "easy"; light it, adjust it, forge with no problem of burning up work, turn it off. They can be more oxidizing *IFF* you don't have one properly designed and adjusted. (weed burner forges tend to be way oxidizing for example). There are some dangers to propane; but usually the same ones you'd have with a propane BBQ. The biggest danger is that while all but induction forges produce hazardous fumes, most other fuels let you *know* that bad stuff is around---coal in particular puts off smoke that just looking at it you have a gut feeling you DON'T want to breath that! Propane (and charcoal) emit invisible and odorless fumes. Not a problem with proper venting and air flow; but people tend to skimp on make up air when it gets cold. Forges tend to emit more or less CO cold, warming up or at full heat; why I suggest tuning the forge as you go along. A CO detector is *CHEAP* insurance. We get a lot of "I have a window open, is that enough?" questions to which I reply I have 2 10' x 10' roll up doors open on opposing sides of the shop along the prevailing wind direction and I don't close them any until anvils start blowing over... Also I can buy propane at 9pm on a Sunday about 3 places in our small town; decent smithing coal is a 4 hour round trip with arrangements made ahead of time. Note that almost any coal forge can be used for forge welding; but a gas forge really needs to be engineered for it and using refractories that resist borax erosion. Many bladesmiths will have several forges designed for different purposes: general forging, billet welding, heat treating (especially for large blades!) What is best is what is best for you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurstan Posted February 25, 2011 Author Share Posted February 25, 2011 Thx alot with al the advice, i think ill go for a coal forge. Since i want to make a hobby of blacksmithing and when i do it i have time to kill. + my parents still have a old stockpile with ALOT of coal. Is there a good tutorial guide around on how to make a descent fire? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don A Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Try this:how-to-start-a-forge-fire-video Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Hall Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 I like coal myself, but I just recently finished building my first gas forge and I have been using it a lot lately. look around in your area and see if u can find any smiths local to you. Then bug the crap out of them , most of us love having someone around who is interested in it anyway...... chances are they will let you use some of their equipment and then you can kinda get a feel for what you do and do not like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Countryboy39067 Posted February 27, 2011 Share Posted February 27, 2011 Brake drum forges as well as other home built or store bought forges will allow you to forge a knife and sword. You work section by section from the point to hilt when making these items. Heating this one section at a time is the normal process. The forge size becomes an issue when you heat treat the near finished blade. Most smiths build a specific forge for this that will heat the entire blade at one time for hardening and tempering. Pictures and articles that cover this are all over the Internet. You also can purchase books or videos to help you. My personal favorites include The $50 Knifeshop and The Complete Bladesmith by Dr. Jim Hirsoulas (forgive the spelling JPH) he is known as JPH here on iforgeiron. Happy Hammering!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the bear Posted April 22, 2011 Share Posted April 22, 2011 Hi I'm looking to buy a forge for knife making and sword making. Problem is I do not have a clue on what forge would be best. What would you guys suggest? Solid fuel or gas? And what type do you guys prefer to use? Greetings from belgium Hi there Thurstan, Greetings from a coolish autumny South Africa, I started off getting knife making training which has been the best investment I ever made.Within a year I had built two gas forges,a standard dragons breath tube type and a stand up post box type.Both worked very well and I made a dozen big hunting knives on them before I fell for the lure of artist blacksmithing. Now, every blacksmith should make a sword at least once in his career and once you start, this is where you will end up. The lure of knowing you can do it will just become too strong.I used my post office type forge, which is nothing but a 25 cm steel pipe,about 30cm high, standing upright and closed on top with two 75mm x 75mm windows cut in across from each other about three quarter way up and lined with 1600 degree Celsius refractory cement.I heated the 5160 spring steel section by section and hammered out an 90 centimetre double edged blade, which came out beautifully. Problem came as was mentioned when I had to heat treat.The maximum lenght my Dragons Breath could accomodate was about 300mm. Fortunately I had moved to a location where I have a lot more space and was able to build me a fully functional workshop, which included two coal forges, one specifically for long objects. And with that the problem was solved. I am presently busy with two machetes for a friend who does Missionary work in Africa, for which I got a nice 80kg anvil in exchange. Once you start you cannot stop. Blacksmiths greetings Herman The BEAR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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