David Browne Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 I picked up a used SM-50 last week. Got it moved into the shop yesterday, wired it up today. Need to replace the belts and tighten everything up, but so far seems like a pretty cool machine. It came with 7 sets of dies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Hammer Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 I think you are going to like that! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 I picked up a used SM-50 last week. Got it moved into the shop yesterday, wired it up today. Need to replace the belts and tighten everything up, but so far seems like a pretty cool machine. It came with 7 sets of dies. 7 sets of dies? Shoot thats got to be $3500+ worth of tooling... Does this machine have a 10HP motor? V belts? What size is the motor pulley? My understanding is the Say Mak hammers all run with a cogged belt and a smaller motor (5HP on the 50 kg) and the main reason is because a pulley small enough to get the correct speed slips with V belts... So on the Sahinler they used a much bigger than necessary motor to make up for HP loss at the belts.. Always been curious if that's really whats going on or if there is some other reason for the much larger motor.. But yeah I think you will really enjoy this little guy... My experience has been they are a very versatile machine and having a second operation hammer always speeds up forging (and its just fun :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dillon Sculpture Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 Nice David, I have the same hammer, replaced that steel base with wood. We had a taper race with 1 1/4" square at my old shop during a Alex Bealer meeting. SM-50 vrs. 250 Murray vrs. 750 Niles, all at the same time, I figure you can guess who won. Show us the dies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Browne Posted February 7, 2010 Author Share Posted February 7, 2010 7 sets of dies? Shoot thats got to be $3500+ worth of tooling... Does this machine have a 10HP motor? V belts? What size is the motor pulley? Larry, Yeah, pretty crazy with all those S-7 Dies. It feels like I bought the dies and they threw in the hammer for free. I think a cogged belt would make a lot of sense. I contacted Brian Russell regarding the belts and he said Sahinler has gone to a notched belt that gives much better power transmission. I picked up a set, just need to put them in. The smooth V belts in this hammer are pretty thrashed and loose as well. I'll get into it this week. The motor is a 10hp, not sure of the pulley size, but it looked pretty small. Danger, I'll get a shot of the dies when I get back in the shop. As I recall it had 2 sets double combo, 2sets triple combo, 1 large drawing (unused), 1 small flat (unused) and 1 set of bark texture dies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 Larry, Yeah, pretty crazy with all those S-7 Dies. It feels like I bought the dies and they threw in the hammer for free. I think a cogged belt would make a lot of sense. I contacted Brian Russell regarding the belts and he said Sahinler has gone to a notched belt that gives much better power transmission. I picked up a set, just need to put them in. The smooth V belts in this hammer are pretty thrashed and loose as well. I'll get into it this week. The motor is a 10hp, not sure of the pulley size, but it looked pretty small. Danger, I'll get a shot of the dies when I get back in the shop. As I recall it had 2 sets double combo, 2sets triple combo, 1 large drawing (unused), 1 small flat (unused) and 1 set of bark texture dies. If you end up selling off some of the double die sets I would be interested... I think the notched belt is a really great plan.... One thing to keep in mind with the notched belts is its really critical to get the motor square to the flywheel... if its off just a little bit the flange on the pulleys will destroy the belt... Also you can use a amp clamp to set the belt tension... once your all square put the amp clamp on one of the incoming power wires ... run the hammer so the ram is coming almost to the lower die (most work the hammer will do, much harder on the motor than if it lands the blow) and you should be drawing withing 10-15% either way of the motors rated amp draw for your voltage. If its more than 20% less the belts are two loose, more than 20% over and the belts are two tight.... Thats if the motor is sized about right for the load... If the motor is way overkill with the more efficient power transmitting of the notched belts you may be drawing less amperage with the belts good-en-tite... Its a bugger to put belts on one of these... You have to pull the rod loose from the crank to get the belts over and be real careful not to let the piston drop too far down while you have it apart... its REALLY hard to get the rings compressed and the piston re installed from the bottom.... I ended up pulling the whole top end of the compressor apart and putting the piston in from the top after fighting with it for an hour or so... Its a 2-3 hour job to change the belts and readjust the hammer, since you have to do the motor pulley too I would plan on a day when you could devote 4 hours at least... But it will be worth it ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryce Masuk Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 Sweet deal she still looks like new if sure you will get your money worth of out that puppy (if you already havent) you do some nice work mr dave browne my uncle lives in the san diego area I can picture the kinds of jobs you get down there the houses are pretty amazing before the iron is on them... lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Browne Posted February 7, 2010 Author Share Posted February 7, 2010 If you end up selling off some of the double die sets I would be interested... I think the notched belt is a really great plan.... One thing to keep in mind with the notched belts is its really critical to get the motor square to the flywheel... if its off just a little bit the flange on the pulleys will destroy the belt... Also you can use a amp clamp to set the belt tension... once your all square put the amp clamp on one of the incoming power wires ... run the hammer so the ram is coming almost to the lower die (most work the hammer will do, much harder on the motor than if it lands the blow) and you should be drawing withing 10-15% either way of the motors rated amp draw for your voltage. If its more than 20% less the belts are two loose, more than 20% over and the belts are two tight.... Thats if the motor is sized about right for the load... If the motor is way overkill with the more efficient power transmitting of the notched belts you may be drawing less amperage with the belts good-en-tite... Its a bugger to put belts on one of these... You have to pull the rod loose from the crank to get the belts over and be real careful not to let the piston drop too far down while you have it apart... its REALLY hard to get the rings compressed and the piston re installed from the bottom.... I ended up pulling the whole top end of the compressor apart and putting the piston in from the top after fighting with it for an hour or so... Its a 2-3 hour job to change the belts and readjust the hammer, since you have to do the motor pulley too I would plan on a day when you could devote 4 hours at least... But it will be worth it Larry, Thank you for the info. I really appreciate it. I'm looking forward to getting to know this hammer a little better...:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plain ol Bill Posted February 7, 2010 Share Posted February 7, 2010 Dave I have one just like it and it will behoove you when you change belts and unbolt the rod from the flywheel to put NEW nylon lock nuts on when you put it back together and recheck for tightness after an hour or so of use. I used the old ones and it all came apart a couple of weeks later in use. That was an expensive lesson learned! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Browne Posted February 8, 2010 Author Share Posted February 8, 2010 Dave I have one just like it and it will behoove you when you change belts and unbolt the rod from the flywheel to put NEW nylon lock nuts on when you put it back together and recheck for tightness after an hour or so of use. I used the old ones and it all came apart a couple of weeks later in use. That was an expensive lesson learned! Bill, Message received and duly noted. That can not have been a nice sound when the rod let loose... -DB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plain ol Bill Posted February 8, 2010 Share Posted February 8, 2010 Dave trade you a set of flat dies in great shape for a set of combo's. I have two set of flats for my hammer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bentiron1946 Posted February 8, 2010 Share Posted February 8, 2010 Nice acquisition for your shop but I think the next you need to acquire is more space or a bigger shoe horn. I had the pleasure of using one for a piece I did and it sure makes short work of heavy forging, lucky man you are for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Browne Posted February 8, 2010 Author Share Posted February 8, 2010 OK, here's the dies that came with it. I almost had it right earlier... I forgot about the set of dimple dies that were with it also. Sorry guys, only one set of duplicates- that is the triple combo's and I'm keeping the extra set to re-profile them myself. It appears someone used them to break down the corners on cold bar and worked over the drawing section of the dies. If you're wondering where the 7th set is, they're in the hammer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plain ol Bill Posted February 8, 2010 Share Posted February 8, 2010 Love the shot of the shop helper. That bed shows love and caring. Sure makes me wish my old helper was still around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew T Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 David, Nice work, and photography, on your website. I have the same 100lb Bradley. I would be very interested in hearing a comparison of the two hammers after you give the Sahinler a good workout. Things like power, control, capacity, versatility, joy of use, noise, oil mist inhalation, etc. Two things I like better on the air hammer are the taller dies that are set on a 45 deg angle to the frame, more clearance all around. IIRC the ram with die on my Bradley weighs 130-140lbs. Andrew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Browne Posted February 9, 2010 Author Share Posted February 9, 2010 David, Nice work, and photography, on your website. I have the same 100lb Bradley. I would be very interested in hearing a comparison of the two hammers after you give the Sahinler a good workout. Things like power, control, capacity, versatility, joy of use, noise, oil mist inhalation, etc. Two things I like better on the air hammer are the taller dies that are set on a 45 deg angle to the frame, more clearance all around. IIRC the ram with die on my Bradley weighs 130-140lbs. Andrew Andrew, Oil mist inhalation, huh?...that must be an air hammer thing. I can't wait. I'm more accustomed to burning bar oil inhalation (I guess I'm old fashioned). I'll give a full report after I get some mileage on the hammer. -DB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bentiron1946 Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 When you get some time show us that wave texture die on some steel, sure looks interesting along with that dimple die. Nice dog you got there too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted February 10, 2010 Share Posted February 10, 2010 OK, here's the dies that came with it. I almost had it right earlier... I forgot about the set of dimple dies that were with it also. Sorry guys, only one set of duplicates- that is the triple combo's and I'm keeping the extra set to re-profile them myself. It appears someone used them to break down the corners on cold bar and worked over the drawing section of the dies. If you're wondering where the 7th set is, they're in the hammer. It sure looks to me like who ever owned that thing was more in love with owning a hammer than being a powerhammer operator... Based on what the machine and dies look like you basically got a demo machine... My experience has been that those texture dies are for big hammers in production shops where they put texture on tons and tons of stock... Not to say you couldn't get a fence or gate job that they would make short work of, but texture paddles work so well and are much more adaptable my guess is if you could find someone to sell those to and buy a set of high crown "Hofi" style dies and some aggressive fulluring dies you would get more use out of them... It only takes one job though and you'll wish you still had them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Browne Posted February 11, 2010 Author Share Posted February 11, 2010 Its a 2-3 hour job to change the belts and readjust the hammer, since you have to do the motor pulley too I would plan on a day when you could devote 4 hours at least... But it will be worth it Larry- Your estimate was right on the money. It was a little tight in there (and oily!!!), but belts changed. The old ones were really shot (take a look). The motor pulley was completely out of alignment as well. Just for kicks, I'm gonna borrow my buddies amp clamp and test amp draw under load when I get a chance. I'm curious... Plain Old Bill- I used the old nylocks again, but I made sure to put on some loctite. -DB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dillon Sculpture Posted February 11, 2010 Share Posted February 11, 2010 Ahh... just like working on an old truck motor shoved in a VW. I'm surprised it was running at all, I replaced same kind of belt bits on mine, also had a large crag of rust in the compression cylinder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted February 11, 2010 Share Posted February 11, 2010 Larry- Your estimate was right on the money. It was a little tight in there (and oily!!!), but belts changed. The old ones were really shot (take a look). The motor pulley was completely out of alignment as well. Just for kicks, I'm gonna borrow my buddies amp clamp and test amp draw under load when I get a chance. I'm curious... Plain Old Bill- I used the old nylocks again, but I made sure to put on some loctite. -DB Man! They got the moneys worth out of those and yet that hammer looks brand new! My guess is out of time plus loose ate them up, I dont think you'll ever have to change the belts again barring something coming loose or going wonky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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