jayco

Is there a mathmatical way to predict or measure the grip of tong jaws?
Is it as simple as a ratio?

What I mean is; if you have tongs with 10 inch handles, and one inch long jaws(or bits), is the pressure put forth on the jaws roughly 10 times the pressure put on the handles(or reins)?
(allowing that it was possible to put all the gripping pressure exactly at the 10 inch point on the handles)

Would a 10:1 ratio be correct on this?

I'm just thinking out loud on this........but, what do you guys think?

James

I know I'm straying far from the subject of making lye soap, but did you know that pigs will EAT coal?
It used to be common practice among old timers to throw a couple handfuls to their pigs occasionally.
I no longer remember if the coal was meant as a mineral suppliment, or as a 'dewormer'.
Not only will they eat it.......They like it!
There's nothing quite like seeing a 500 lb. hog munch a fist-sized lump of coal as if it were a piece of candy.

I think it was Ice Czar who pointed out that charcoal scraps were beneficial in the garden.I had known that wood ashes worked sort of like diluted lime and helped control soil acidity. The wood ashes also puts a small amount of nutrients in the soil..a quite safe and natural fertilizer.

I only recently learned of the benefits provided by the bits of charcoal.It 'lightens' heavy clay soils in much the same way as peat moss or even compost.

I've never made any soap, so I can't comment anything useful on that subject.

As far as coal ashes are concerned, all the gardening books I've ever read warned not to put coal ashes in the garden,........and I never have. But I do offer this observation...........that around old coal piles or old ash piles I often see rasberry briars or walnut trees.
Around here, for more than 50 years, coal was the fuel of choice for home heating. Almost every house had a 'coal pile' somewhere in the back yard. The ashes were usually discarded somewhere nearby.
There's something( probably sulphur), in coal, which rasberries and walnuts like.
James

Thanks, Mark..........and yeah, I did have a good birthday.
I got to do a little 'fun forging ' in my shop this morning.
Had the kids and grandson over for cake and ice cream........

I was kidding my grandson about how his grandpaw was old enough to remember when you had to get up to change the channels on the tv.
He's 8 years old.......not sure if he believed me.........

Yeah, it's been a good day!
James

TZONOQUA, your point about round stock tending to roll is well taken.
It's important that whatever one uses as 'tongs' holds the work properly.

As this is a recent idea for me, I haven't done a lot of testing yet as to the gripping abilty of these tongs, but I have done some.

I have learned this much: Some of the traditional jaw shapes we're used to don't work well without a fixed(riveted) pivot.

These tongs are meant to be 'quick and easy'. If a lot of forging,bending, and twisting is required to make them grip something, then.......the purpose is defeated. I completely MANGLED a couple pieces of 3/8 in. rebar today,trying to create a jaw shape to securely hold a railroad spike.
See pic; This seems to work.

If anyone tries these tongs, BE CAREFULL! test them with a cold piece of metal first. Make sure they are holding.
James

Hi Phil, if you found that chunk of iron near the site of one of those old 'iron ore ' furnaces, you probably already know that the iron they made in those was called( ironically) PIG IRON.

From what I can gather about the history of those furnaces, the name came from the shape of the molds they tapped the molten metal into, which resembled a sow with pigs.

I have pics of our local 'Laurel Furnace' in the Gallery.
I think pig iron is a close relative to cast iron, as it was quite brittle and had to be further refined to produce maleable iron.

So you went pig hunting and found pig iron.........that's cool!
James Flannery

Thanks for all the comments, guys!

Farmer Phil, you're right, I was thinking of chop sticks, tweezers, scissors, and other pivoting/gripping tools when I came up with this idea.

What really got me thinking about tongs, was frustration with having to make new tongs to hold different shapes. I made a hammer this past week, and was dissatisfied with how nothing in tong collection actually held as I wanted them to. I have more than 30 pair!

As far as the tongs in the pics go.........I didn't actually make anything........once I got the idea, I just picked up 2 pieces of likely 'scrap'.

These could be made from heavier stock. The round rod could be heavier.....could be flattened on the end, (for flat-jawed tongs).

It also would work to use 2 pieces of flat stock.........and cut a slot in one to create the 'pivot point'.

If anyone has ideas , please share them..........That's how we all learn!

James

I've been making tongs, rivets for tongs, etc.
While making these tongs, I got to thinking about what actually constitutes "tongs".

Anyway, I got the idea that if you take a piece of flat stock, put a hole about 2 or 3 inches from one end, bend the the section with the hole to 45 degrees and insert a round rod in the hole.........it sorta works like tongs.

The pics explain it better than my words.
I'm sure some ancient smith invented this a long time ago.........but what is this?.....What is it called?
James

Rest in Peace, Ruben..........

Welcome to IFI, Bill
There's lots of discussion of both blacksmithing and welding here....lots of info!
I haven't been to Dayton in a long time, but I've got relatives up your way.
Anyway, welcome to the site......ENJOY!

Welcome to IforgeIron, Pa.Dutchman!
With your background, sounds like you've probably picked up a lot of metalworking knowledge. Your expertise could come in handy!
There's lots of information here , and lots of friendly folks.
Enjoy!

Philip,you might consider thin pieces of scrap sheetmetal(roofing metal,old bucket lids, etc.) placed around the firepot. Consider the sheet metal as a 'consumable', and replace it from time to time.

Zigblackwind......Welcome to IforgeIron!
Looks like you've got some tools together for smithing. Reminds me of when I started hobby/smithing many years ago.

By the way, there's a bunch of bladesmiths at IFI to learn from.
There are links on the 'Home' page to help you get started.
Enjoy!

Steve, you're absolutely right about solid copper wire NOT being a proper extension cord for a welder( or anything else , for that matter). It should be braided/cable wire of proper size and current carrying capability for it's intended usage.

I've 'gotten by' with the solid 3 x 8 simply because I'm careful not to roll it up too tightly........and I don't use it often.
I figure at some point it will fail......and I'll have to get the right cable for the job.
Of course, the reason I used it at all was because.......It was free.

Like Ted said...Welcome to Iforgeiron!
I saw the pics of some of your work........NICE!
We're just now getting started with woodworking....so......you'll fit right in!
James

I'm kind of anxious to learn something from this thread since I've noticed a definite lighting problem in my little shop this winter.

But first, I must say that 'how well you see' probably has much to do with light requirements in your shop.

I use reading glasses.....slightly far sighted.....my arms aren't long enough to read the newspaper without them.

I 'boxed up' my 8ft. x8ft. forging area for winter. No windows.....so....very little natural light.
Even though I have 4 100 watt light bulbs and a 48in. flourescent light in there, I still don't see well at times.

I can read the newspaper in natural light,(without the reading glasses), but artificial light doesn't work so well for me.

More than once this winter, I've finished a piece inside the shop and thought I had done a decent job, but when I take the finished piece outside I realize that there were little blems and hammermarks I hadn't seen!

I have a new shop planned for spring,( with IMPROVED lighting), so I'm interested in this thread.
James

Although I've seen lots of guys extend their welding leads, I use a 50 ft. extension cord,and move the welder closer to the work. The cord is 3 *8 solid copper wire(the same wire used in a home to connect your electric range to the breaker box.) It's connected to a 50 amp breaker. If I recall correctly, 50 ft. of no. 8 wire.....at 50 amps is about the limit as to what is recomended to operate my Lincoln AC 225.
Your welder may have different power requirements.

By the way, I put a range/electric cookstove plug on my extension cord so I could take my welder to jobs away from my shop. I've had a call or two to bring my welder to a neighbor's home and repair something that could not be easily brought to the shop.
I have unplugged someone's stove,and ran the extension cord through the kitchen window to get power.

welcome to Iforgeiron, LITTLEJOHN!
If you don't already know your way around this site, there are links on the 'Home' page to help you navigate this site and to help you get started in blacksmithing.

There's a lot of information here.........ENJOY!

I was 'rescueing' a few nice, large sheets of heavy cardboard from a local dumpster behind an appliance store one day, when it occurred to me that if anyone happened to see me, they might think that I was crazy!

Since only TRUE recyclers understand the thrill and challenge of finding useful stuff in trash,........I dumpster-dive when no one is looking!......well.......unless I happen to spot something REALLY good!

James

I don't know any thing about art, but I already see clear advantages to incorporating 'negative spaces' into pieces.

Apparently, from the examples shown, negative spaces are weightless....and cost us nothing at the steel yard.
James

This 'Champion blower I.D." thing has been more difficult than I thought it would. WOW!

Though I don't have any catalogs or any other reference materials for Champion blowers, here are a couple guesses.

Remember these are GUESSES, and might turn out to be wrong.

Hammerkid, I think the red Champion blower you have is like my smaller one. I,m guessing they made the same blower in a 'legless' version for smaller 'rivet' type forges and also a freestanding version(like mine) on a 3 legged stand. As near as I can tell, the fan and gearbox is the same.
They just changed the FAN housing to create two different models.

I remember seeing one other like mine.......I think Tryin-it has one. I will ask what he knows about them.

I still don't know what model we're talking about yet, but maybe that info will come.
All this 'not knowing' just makes me all the more curious.........this is like a detective's case!

Thanks to all who have helped on this thread......didn't mean to cause a lot of research and hard work!

Here's some pics of 'the mystery blower',.......these pics aren't that good and the old machine needs a good cleaning.......maybe some red paint?
James

Dan, a lot of the old timers were very picky about what kind of wood they used for a particular task.

Since they used cross-cut saws, axes,froes, and wedges as their tools, they probably only wanted to do it once....if possible.

Fred, welcome to Iforgeiron.
So your shop sits high on Bethel Ridge? I've never been there, but I've heard of it.
I'm on the other side of the Ohio river in N/E Ky.
On the opening page of IFI there are links to help you navigate this site.
(This is a large site with lots of information and friendly folks)
Enjoy!

Borz,welcome to Iforgeiron!
There are links on the opening page to help you find your way around the site.
This is a big place with lots of information and friendly folks too.
If you have questions, just ask.
Enjoy!

Thanks Keykeeper......PM sent your way.
James