youngdylan

oh I'd say round about 1pound 15ounces 15drams and 26grains real good advert for the "convenience" of the imperial system that there grain; 1/7000th of a pounds. WTF!

Hey, and I used to respect your precision engineering skills 90.909 kg if you please.

heard that word somewhere before, now remind me?

Yeah, I'll go with a lot that. What really got my goat wasn't so much the busines side of things (2 sides to every story), it was the bullying tone of "attack" in the letter, that is to Mr Monster, other people in the hammer world and geeks like me on this forum.

... said to the sound of spitting feathers ..... but I'm on a blacksmiths forum, aren't I supposed to be a "weapon obsessed beardie weardie swords and scorcery macho wannabe "outlaw" Conan the Barbarian type" Loving this thread but gotta get some chores done! Didn't realise what what a bottomless pit of time this this forum stuff is. Kinda quite addictive.

I like! Might well use it, but kinda think it might be handing my "fans" a weapon to get me banned. NOt that I need any help, I'm usually quite good at doing that all by myself. Hey, I can even tie my shoe laces up myself. Still tempted to use it though. oops ...... nearly forgot to say psychobabble

South, yeah I did notice you got a few of the midge bites as well. ThomasPowers has got nearly as many as me (40 at the last count). I don't know the guy from Adam but I can't see anthing to take umbrage with in the posts of his I've read. It is kinda fishy because they often come in bursts of three. Someone with multiple identities??? If you're curious, I kinda think it goes back to the thread "Members reputation ratings" http://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/15098-memebers-reputation-rating/ What did you say to upset the good Captain? Hey, can I say psychobabble again?

Always the best thing to do. That said, did you read the original post that this all goes back to. It was only there for a few hours before Glenn pulled it. It was VERY revealing.

South Look at the radius at he top of the cross section view (right photo) then look where at the radius is on the plan view (left photo) ..... kinda makes me think it's on the underneath. I'll try to remember to take some photos of the pin set up on my Anyang. You run a SayMak don't you? does this have these pins?

Kinda suspect it's related to my responses to a post by Captain Unicorn. Guess I'm being zapped by the same people who bumped the good Captain upto 240 !!@@!!???**???!! Hey, I've found that whenever I put the word "psychobabble" in a post I get a dose of zapping by the midges Now what should I do with all my (-)'s

Hey, check out my reputation

Possibly I'm giving an explanation to a question that wasn't asked. I've never used a mechanical but the consensus is they hit harder. I'll go with that given that the tup in Kinyon is being cushioned by the air in the cylinder as it hits the work. What I was trying to explain was how the pilot position affects the optimum height of the work being done. Using a long stoke cylinder and adjustable pilot gives a lot of versatility. I'll typically have my Kinyon set for say 25mm thick work but with a quick tap on my lever that lifts the pilot and I can be working 100mm by 12mm edge on with no loss of impact. Using the 400mm cylinder I can work 150mm edge on with still quite effective blows. Kinda curious if mechanicals can cover such a wide range of work thickness? Guess the question really is what do you wanna do with your hammer. If it's mainly drawing out hard and fast build a mechanical. If it's a wide range of applications from drawing through to punching and sliting build a Kinyon. Better still if you're a tinkerer at heart, with time and space to spare, have a go at both. Might be worth you having a look at some of the videos on the Pheonix site to see how versatile Kinyons with a tall cylinders are. I'm not totally up on the valving but it's still a Kinyon at heart http://www.phoenixha...hoenix_demo.htm

....light dainty and nimble ?

Now that a question I simply daren't ask my girlfiend

South What's this Clifton Ralph dvd. Sounds like its worth a look. Where can I get one. UK based but guess that wont be a problem

Clinton The groove is on the underside of the die right? If so, it's to keep the top or bottom dies from moving sideways when driving the wedges in. There should be holes in the tup and sow block that "pins" fit into and these grooves locate with these pins. It's very useful when fitting any dies but especially combination dies where misalignment is more of a problem. It keeps the dies lining up side to side AND fore and aft. It's useful when first wedging up the dies and will also stop any tendancy of the dies to drift sideways if the dies have a large sideways components to the forces they recieve/apply. If there are no holes in your tup/ sow block, it could be that the dies are adapted from another hammer. My Anyang 40kg uses these pins and they are very useful

I really do think for the sake of balance and fairness, Larry should be allowed to repost the original posts that were taken down. They do contain Mr Wallace's own words after all. People who haven't read them won't really be able to make sense of this thread. I have. It would also appear that some lines have subsequently been removed from Mr Wallace's first post; the ones reflecting his attitude to blogging for instance.

Just realised that all the above doesn't actually say where the pilot is. It's the small roller (usually) air "switch" that the tup passes on it way up/down. A cam on the tup activates. The height is usually set so that when the tup is about 2-3 inches or lower from the work it is not "pressed". When the tup rises up by about 2-3 inches or higher it does press the "pilot"

Maybe you aren't, maybe you are ? but it does seem like there some thinly veiled digs at some genuine air hammer experts who post a LOT of useful information on this forum. I've always avoided this whole forum malarky like the plague in the past, but joined because of the wealth of information people post here, despite some of the more "misguided" knowledge. To be honest your first post does come across, to me as, a long advert to yourself. If you've joined this "community" for genuine reasons and not just to repair any damage to your reputation from having (temporarily) had some dirty laundry aired in public, why not start some new threads up dedicated to dispersing some of the knowledge I'm sure you've picked as a "Master Blacksmith" and "Nazel Authority".

Often wondered how they deliver something like that to site. Don't tell me they drive that down public roads! They can't exactly drive it onto the back of a low loader either. Do they bring it as a pile of bits and assemble it on site? The grease stored on those things probably weighs way more than my Landrover.

what Bob said

I LIKE this forum, its real useful ..... Brownie points all round to Grant Steve G and Judson. Kinda looks like there's mileage in spring/spring or rubber/rubber system. Till now, I'd just accepted the cylinder rods as essentially consumables. Been planning to revamp my Kinyon sometime using twin "pushing" cylinders besides the tup guides. I might now go for using a tup in box section + UHMW bushing (as per bigBLUR) and have a play with the spring/spring thingy. On a related topic, has anyone got any views on using a real long, say 4 or 6" rebound spring so the tup slams into it soon after passing the pilot, it stores a lot of the "up" energy then returns it on the down stroke. My limited way of thinking wonders if it would shorten the up part of the stroke (hence speeding the cycle rate) but still allowing a long enough down stroke to develop ooomph.

Hey, I'm collecting dontcha know

I hope this explanation doesn't patronise, or if this (excess) verbiage doesn't help, I'll have go a doing a sketch over the weekend. Remind me if I forget! I guess it's kinda difficult to explain in words, mean time here's a couple of nuggets that may/may not help. The pilot is really just like an electrical relay, it switches a bigger valve. It's the bigger valve that does the switching of the air to the cylinder. The pilot just sends a "signal" to the main valve to switch over "states" The valve can be in one of 2 states: STATE 1 air pressure is on top of the piston forcing the tup down and the bottom "chamber" of the cylinder is exhausting any air in it STATE 2 air pressure is below the piston forcing the tup up and the top chamber of the cylinder is exhausting any air in it As the hammer moves up/down the valve is continually switching between these 2 states. What causes it to switch states is a bit subtle. When it clicks for you it'll click for you but here's my attempt at an explanation. Stroke length is inherent to the design. In essence the buffer at the top of the cylinder (there's none at the bottom) doesn't control the stroke. It can influence it but that'll just complicate things at this point. Note, as far as I understand it, it's just there to stop the top of the piston (in the air cylinder) crashing into the top of the cylinder. It does however store energy from the tup on its up stroke and returns it on the down stroke. Right then lets get down to the meat of this stroke malarky. 1. Lets assume the tup is going down and has passed the pilot. This is state 2. In this state, the valve is set so the air so wants to force the tup up BUT (and this is important) the "momentum" of the tup means it keeps going down (but its slowing down ) 2. Eventually the air pressure overcomes the momentum of the tup and it begins to move up. This point would be the bottom of the stroke if it hadn't hit any hot steel on the way. 3. As the hammer moves up it passes the pilot which sends a signal to the main valve which now switches to state 1. Now the air wants to push the hammer back down BUT the momentum of the tup keeps it going (but its slowing down again) 4. Eventually the air pressure overcomes the momentum of the tup and it begins to move down. This is the top of the stroke. 5. As it moves down it passes the pilot which sends a signal to the main valve to switch back to to state 2. ............ now we're back to point 1. above and the whole thing begins again. It's this continuous "trade off" of air pressure and momentum that controls the stroke and speed of the tup. Note, this is just the basic Kinyon valving. I'm sure there's others being used. The modifications I mentioned in previous posts still don't alter the principle. I hardly know how steam hammers work but I think it's a similar principle. Self contained hammers use a VERY DIFFERENT PRINCIPLE. So what controls the speed I hear you ask? Well if the exhaust system is blocked, the air in it stops the hammer moving up or down. For the above cycle to work it's imporant that the cylinder "chamber" that does not have air pressure applied can vent any air that is trapped in it. The less air it can vent, the slower the above cycle goes. The exhaust "closure" is controlled by the throttle. Note Kinyons behave like mechanicals in that they speed up as the throttle is pressed unlike self contained which run at constant speed. Right then, that's got be enough for you to mull over for now. I wanna kick back drink beer and relax. Note, I'm a s** with typo's, chances are I've put one in just the wrong place. I'll proof read later

HWHII has posted some in the thread "narrowing the PH field". Looks intriguing