Thinking about trying a pattern welded knife.

[kraythe]

I have been tuning my forge welding skills and I can pretty much nail welding two pieces of flatstock together every time. So I am wondering if I might give some thought to going the next step to create a pattern welded knife. In a beautiful world I would be able to replace all my chef knives with pattern welded, hand crafted knives. I think the easiest one to start with is the 10 inch chef's knife. I like pretty much standard german chef knife form so it should be a relatively flat blade with a curved tip. That being said, Id like to run some questions and ideas past you guys.

For steel I debated getting some cable. I thought about doing stainless cable but that may be a bit too hard for a first knife. So what variants of steel will give me the best corrosion resistance for a chef knife? Or should I actually try to do stainless?

If I were to go high carbon cable steel, is there anything i should be looking for especially?

Have any of you tried to weld stainless cable? If so, can you provide any lessons learned that I might find useful?

When it comes to the grind, I thought it might be great to have the blade be hollow ground on the first half an inch or so and then flat ground from there to the back of the blade. Do you think that is a workable plan?

EDIT:

When I get a couple knives under my belt I would like to try a cable pattern welded filleting knife but what I was wondering is what would be the best process to get the required flex in the blade? A filleting knife should be able to bend 90 degrees over its 6 inch length and be thin.

I have some Elk antler lieing about and was thinking of making the handle out of that with three rivets holding it to the tang (set cold with a pneumatic hammer). Any thoughts there ?

Thanks

[Rich Hale]

It almost seems that you have more questions than space will allow answers for but let me give my short view of the things you ask: Yes you can make damascus baldes and yes you can make them from stainless. Gee that seems just wayyyy to simple for an answer from me. So let me add somethings to it. You say yoiu can hit a forge weld almost every time. Good start.. Think ahead a little bit and picture forging a carbon steel billet and then spending maybe a week hand filling and sanding it to make the size and shape of blade you envision. And then you find a flaw in the blade? Maybe its and inclusion or a poor weld. Still an issue for the blade. Soemtimes cutting down the size of the blade will remove it. Or would it be better to get some high carbon steel and just do welds and bend them. cut them open, twist them..anything to see that you are up to the task. About the hollow and convex grinds on one blade. Do you think you can do both of the grinds you wish with the ability and equipment you have?
Stainless cable. you have to find high carbon stainless cable. Someone on here may know of a source. You need a different kind of flux to weld stainless and if you should inhale the fumes from it you may suffer permanent damage. Stainless also needs special heat treat methods and for the most part is hard to do in a forge. (there are some advanced makers that can do it). By now I bet you have even more questions,,Get all the knowledge you can find on line and in reference material. I consider the best for wot you wish to be The Complete Bladesmith by Jim Hrousilas. He also put out a two tape instructional video on makeing a damascus knife from start to finish that is excellent. The book will give you a bench top reference that will be at hand and you can reach for it when ever another item pops up that needs study time. And have fun

[kraythe]

I heard from another site that is a knife maker that stainless can be welded inside a capsule of carbon steel to exclude o2 and then grind off the carbon steel.

http://www.aescustomknives.com/docs/tutorial16.htm

I havent tried it but it looks intriguing. Much better than horribly toxic flux.

As for the welds I have spent a bunch of time welding and testing via destructive methods. Im not jumping in blind here.

[Jacob Tkalec]

I heard from another site that is a knife maker that stainless can be welded inside a capsule of carbon steel to exclude o2 and then grind off the carbon steel.

http://www.aescustomknives.com/docs/tutorial16.htm

I havent tried it but it looks intriguing. Much better than horribly toxic flux.

As for the welds I have spent a bunch of time welding and testing via destructive methods. Im not jumping in blind here.

That sir is a very interesting method. I like the WD-40 and paper towel trick as well.

[Randy Jr. HHH Knives]

Now dont take this the wrong way, because im not a pro or anything ive only been making damascus for about 8 months now but...
I dont know if you have made stainless or cable damascus before ( i havent yet either) but from what i have read and been told cable damascus is harder than straight laminates, and then if you add stainless to that it makes it even more challenging.
with that said i think you should keep going with what youve practiced and build a stack from flat stock. I use 1095 and 15n20 to make my billets.
as far as corrosion, many kitchen knives are made with high carbon steels so as long as you regularly maintenance your knife it should be fine.
The grind, you could hollow grind the edge i suppose, but you will have less drag on the cutting edge if you use a flat or convex grind making it much more user friendly.
well now that i have said that ask me how i really feel
Hope i could help
Good luck with whichever method you go for and please post pics of your progress i would love to see it

[brucegodlesky]

If things don't turn out as expected, then start asking questions......
You are allowed to make mistakes , ya know. They are good learning tools:-)
Start out with a simple layered pattern. leave the complex patterns for when you know a little more.

[Robert Mayo]

I'm with Bruce on this one go ahead and give it a go.When i first started out there was no internet and i just did it sometimes it worked other times it was a complete failure.
The thing is i learned valuable lessons trying.
But start with the smallest knife in the set you plan on making it will give you a chance to see how it goes then move up to bigger knives.
Do you have a power hammer? If not you had better bulk up .

Bob

[Chuck Richards]

OK lets give this a go. Stainless cable is normally 300 series and does not make a good knife. Cannot be hardened and does not weld good in an open environment. It can be welded in an inert atmosphere. A sealed canister is a great method. It is the way I do almost all my damascus. Cable can be problematic. It has lots of voids and crap in the strands that cause inclusions. What I have found to work best is cable in a can. I pack as much cable into a box with one end sealed off. Once I have all the cable I can pack in the can I fill the voids with HC Nickel bearing powder. I make sure it is vibrated down and filled in as much as possible. I then weld a cap on the open end. Then forge weld this as you would any other billet. Work it down and pattern it as you see fit. Comes out pretty nice and it can be manipulated differently than regular cable. Make sure you cable is HC steel. Much of it is just mild steel and will not harden. Do a practice HT on a small piece you forge welded. Also make sure you get as much carp out of it as possible. I burn out my cable then take it apart, at least the major strands. I then either wire brush the remaining burned grease off or sandblast it off. Then reassemble and make up the billet. Also try to avoid the cable with rope centers or remove the rope. I have also seen cable with plastic sheathing in the middle. Avoid this also it will cause you nothing but grief. PLEASE STAY AWAY FROM GALVANIZED CABLE. It is TOXIC when burned. Good luck and whatever you do have fun.