blacksmith777 Posted July 24, 2010 Share Posted July 24, 2010 It is one of the best items that I've made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryce Masuk Posted July 24, 2010 Share Posted July 24, 2010 Looks good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beth Posted July 24, 2010 Share Posted July 24, 2010 the roses look great! i like how the petals are nicely curved over. thanks for showing the work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacksmith777 Posted July 27, 2010 Author Share Posted July 27, 2010 the roses look great! i like how the petals are nicely curved over. thanks for showing the work! They are cured over by small scroll tongs. My scroll tongs is get from my father, not made by myself. Actuality, I will make a pair of big ones for bending works. I have some questions. As you see, the camera flash is on ,the rust comes out. Why? I supply two finishing for my clients: bees wax finishing and clear lacquer after wire brushed. What kind finishing will you choose on this candlestick? Why? How? THANKS!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted July 27, 2010 Share Posted July 27, 2010 I have some questions. As you see, the camera flash is on ,the rust comes out. Why? I supply two finishing for my clients: bees wax finishing and clear lacquer after wire brushed. What kind finishing will you choose on this candlestick? Why? How? THANKS! IMHO That could depend on how you make them, and how you attach the petals, If you attach the petals with screws, I would lacquer them before and after assembly, or you could wax them and then lacquer over the wax and assemble and relacquer. The reason being the finish will last longer and will be easier to clean or dust off The wax finish tends to hold dust particles, unless sealed. Another option would be to warm the petals slightly, spray with WD40 and then lacquer, assemble and lacquer again. As for the rusting particles in the pictures, Probably because you are not seeing it with the naked eye and the wire brush has not got into all the recesses where you have distressed the petals Nice job by the way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacksmith777 Posted July 28, 2010 Author Share Posted July 28, 2010 IMHO That could depend on how you make them, and how you attach the petals, If you attach the petals with screws, I would lacquer them before and after assembly, or you could wax them and then lacquer over the wax and assemble and relacquer. The reason being the finish will last longer and will be easier to clean or dust off The wax finish tends to hold dust particles, unless sealed. Another option would be to warm the petals slightly, spray with WD40 and then lacquer, assemble and lacquer again. As for the rusting particles in the pictures, Probably because you are not seeing it with the naked eye and the wire brush has not got into all the recesses where you have distressed the petals Nice job by the way THANK YOU! Great help for me! I attach the petals by tenon from the stem not screw. I love traditional blacksmithing techniques very much. I have made a guillotine tool for tenon making, necking, etc. It is hold in my leg vise while striking. Wax and then lacquer over and relacquer? Formerly I thought they couldn't combine well for wax is soft and lacquer is hard and they would come off when touched. Wax finishing makes beautiful surface but non waterproof and the ironworks will rust quickly. It puzzled me a lot. None of our clients like the rust on ironworks, maybe some of us not. I like the red rust because it is Fe3O4 and I don't like the yellowish-brown rust because it is Fe2O3. Fe3O4 is stable and Fe2O3 not. I seached WD-40 on the internet. Is it a metal cleaner? I’ll try it. THANKS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted July 28, 2010 Share Posted July 28, 2010 THANK YOU! Great help for me! I attach the petals by tenon from the stem not screw. I love traditional blacksmithing techniques very much. I have made a guillotine tool for tenon making, necking, etc. It is hold in my leg vise while striking. Wax and then lacquer over and relacquer? Formerly I thought they couldn't combine well for wax is soft and lacquer is hard and they would come off when touched. Wax finishing makes beautiful surface but non waterproof and the ironworks will rust quickly. It puzzled me a lot. None of our clients like the rust on ironworks, maybe some of us not. I like the red rust because it is Fe3O4 and I don't like the yellowish-brown rust because it is Fe2O3. Fe3O4 is stable and Fe2O3 not. I seached WD-40 on the internet. Is it a metal cleaner? I’ll try it. THANKS! WD40 is a fish oil based aerosol powered spray with many many uses, water displacement being one of them, and despite the first reaction that it won't work, try it, you will be surprised, If you are using wax, then apply wax when article is warm, then wipe/buff off excess, then apply lacquer. I apply the wax, then lacquer whilst unassembled, then relacquer the whole after it is assembled, that way if there are any damaged surface areas, these will be resealed, it also helps give a deeper finish, you can get lacquers in matt, semi matt and gloss finishes. If you are making tenons, then get a die and screwthread the tenon (That is also a traditional way), you could then make a "nut" to hold the petals in place, this nut can be the shape for the centre of the rose, a ball or domed shape with distressing marks on if you want, (If you are using the roses as candle cups then a relatively flat one can be used, or pointed for a pricket). Glad to be able to help you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurlyGeorge Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 Good job on the roses. They look very nice. I have a question about WD40. Do you apply it while the metal is still black hot or wait until it's cooled down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted August 10, 2010 Share Posted August 10, 2010 Good job on the roses. They look very nice. I have a question about WD40. Do you apply it while the metal is still black hot or wait until it's cooled down? Either but warm is better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacksmith777 Posted August 18, 2010 Author Share Posted August 18, 2010 Good job on the roses. They look very nice. I have a question about WD40. Do you apply it while the metal is still black hot or wait until it's cooled down? Thanks. I have the same question and another. Either but warm is better Today, I get WD40 and spray it on my hand hammers and anvil while cold after wire brushed. It work well! Next I'll apply it while black hot then bees wax or warm. Show my new scrolling tongs made from coil spring. Thanks, John B, I planned to make it from mild steel until visiting your web site. The belt buckle is the first one I made. The 3 lb. hammer is ordered from a master blacksmith near to me. I grind the face and peen, then put the handle on it. And the iron braid handle.... not too ugly, isn't it? :0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenebrocity Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 Beautiful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainely,Bob Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 IMHO That could depend on how you make them, and how you attach the petals, If you attach the petals with screws, I would lacquer them before and after assembly, or you could wax them and then lacquer over the wax and assemble and relacquer. The reason being the finish will last longer and will be easier to clean or dust off The wax finish tends to hold dust particles, unless sealed. Another option would be to warm the petals slightly, spray with WD40 and then lacquer, assemble and lacquer again. As for the rusting particles in the pictures, Probably because you are not seeing it with the naked eye and the wire brush has not got into all the recesses where you have distressed the petals Nice job by the way John,I was always taught that any surface was to be absolutely clean before lacquer was applied or the lacquer would not bond and it would just flake off. The wax would act to keep most any film forming coating from bonding to the base metal and we use it as a resist for everything from epoxy resin to paint. WD-40 is supposedly just mineral oil and stoddard solvent so you are just oiling the surface and the oil would keep the lacquer from bonding once again. It`s been my experience that the surface must be mechanically cleaned(usually blasted or sanded)to remove any rust,scale,etc then cleaned with an appropriate solvent(usually Lacquer thinner)to remove any oils and other contaminates.The lacquer is then applied and sanded between coats for a mechanical bond.Once the lacquer has cured and hardened wax can be used as a water repellant top coat. Can`t really picture oiling or waxing my car`s bare metal body before I painted it with lacquer or any other spray on coating.Next time I took a cloth to it the coating would end up coming off in flakes on the cloth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 John,I was always taught that any surface was to be absolutely clean before lacquer was applied or the lacquer would not bond and it would just flake off. The wax would act to keep most any film forming coating from bonding to the base metal and we use it as a resist for everything from epoxy resin to paint. WD-40 is supposedly just mineral oil and stoddard solvent so you are just oiling the surface and the oil would keep the lacquer from bonding once again. It`s been my experience that the surface must be mechanically cleaned(usually blasted or sanded)to remove any rust,scale,etc then cleaned with an appropriate solvent(usually Lacquer thinner)to remove any oils and other contaminates.The lacquer is then applied and sanded between coats for a mechanical bond.Once the lacquer has cured and hardened wax can be used as a water repellant top coat. Can`t really picture oiling or waxing my car`s bare metal body before I painted it with lacquer or any other spray on coating.Next time I took a cloth to it the coating would end up coming off in flakes on the cloth. Yep, I agree entirely, except that when I tried it it worked, ignorance can be bliss, (or dangerous)but in this instance, whether it was because the wax or whatever was put on when the workpiece was still hot (warm and black) and before lacquering, I have no idea. I found it worked I dont know why, but I have key rings and other items that have lasted for years with this finish on, (Feel a bit like the old Bumble Bee, according to the experts they should not be capable of flight, obviously nobody communicated with the bees otherwise there would be a market for little Bee Boots and shoes, climbing gear etc) After forging, clean up, wire brush off any scale etc, apply wax/WD40 whilst still warm, or warm the workpiece if it has cooled, then apply lacquer and leave to dry off and harden before use. This weekend I was taking part in a live competition and used this finish, only got a first place with the piece so it must pass muster. All I can say is try it for yourself and see what happens, you may be surprised, I know I was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainely,Bob Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Yep, I agree entirely, except that when I tried it it worked, ignorance can be bliss, (or dangerous)but in this instance, whether it was because the wax or whatever was put on when the workpiece was still hot (warm and black) and before lacquering, I have no idea. I found it worked I dont know why, but I have key rings and other items that have lasted for years with this finish on, (Feel a bit like the old Bumble Bee, according to the experts they should not be capable of flight, obviously nobody communicated with the bees otherwise there would be a market for little Bee Boots and shoes, climbing gear etc) After forging, clean up, wire brush off any scale etc, apply wax/WD40 whilst still warm, or warm the workpiece if it has cooled, then apply lacquer and leave to dry off and harden before use. This weekend I was taking part in a live competition and used this finish, only got a first place with the piece so it must pass muster. All I can say is try it for yourself and see what happens, you may be surprised, I know I was. I shall give it a go and hope I have the same results. In any arena,nothing trumps success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 I shall give it a go and hope I have the same results. In any arena,nothing trumps success. Look forward to hearing your results I usually lacquer it while still warm, not hot or it will give a wrinkle finish, but warm or cold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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