JNewman

I am reffering to business efficiency but also partially thermal efficiency. Yes I agree that if you are going to use the forge for only a short period of time having a forge that heats up quickly will save you gas, because the forge is on less time. I still think the idle circuit is a big waste of time and expensive plumbing fittings. The forge temperature cycles up and down as you put fresh pieces of steel into the forge and then they heat up, you want the temperature to rise in the forge while your stock is being worked so that the stock reheats quickly when it is returned to the forge. Yes I often leave the blower running when I am using a coal fire and I am forging for exactly the same reason, the fire cools down while I am forging. You do have to be careful if there are more than one irons in the fire and sometimes rely on the eyes in the back of your head to watch it. Good to hear that your forge is coming together.

I would argue that idle circuits often WASTE gas. I installed one on my first gas forge so I have used one. When you idle the forge the forge temperature drops so that when you put your steel back in and turn the forge up you have to heat the forge back up before you heat the steel. The steel then takes longer to heat up so you have the forge running for 5 hours instead of 4 which uses more gas. While the forge is doing the 30 minute initial heat up I can be checking my email, cleaning up and organizing the day before's work or even cleaning up the shop. Any time spent standing waiting for a piece to reheat is wasted time. I also find that an idle circuit is a waste as well because most of the time that I am using a gas forge I have more than one iron in the fire, when do you turn it down?

Biggundoctor next time you have a file in your hand sight down the length of it you will probably find a very slight bend in it.

One thing I have never seen mentioned about filing is that most files have a slight bend to them, probably warping from heat treatment. When you are doing the final flattening of a large area you should make sure you are using the convex side or you will allways end up rounding things off. I found this out when I worked for a company that repaired a lot of printing press cylinders, we used to go through boxes of files. Because we were fiing a small spot that we had built up with plating in the middle of an area that we did not want to cut we would use the convex side of the file and then throw it away when that side was dull.

For some ornamental work I use a lead hammer, which is soft and heavy. To cast it I took toilet paper tube, stuck my handle in the side of the tube. I then put sand around the outside of the paper tube and poured my lead into the tube. Put a weight on top of the tube before pouring or it will float up. Melt and pour the lead outside because of the toxicity of the lead.

I have the 133 johnson. If I get a chance this week I am going to borrow my neighbors forklift and move things around in my yard and bring in the forge so I can check things out.

I think the title sums it up. I made the assumption that it was this weekend as meetings are normally the 2nd saturday but it is the third saturday this month.

The OABA annual general meeting is this Saturday at Jim Wallace's shop in Goderich. The morning will be taken up with the boring but neccesary business meeting and election of the executive. The afternoon demonstrators have not been announced but I am sure that Jim will show us the things he is working on in his shop and will probably demo something himself. Jim is one of the founding members of OABA and is a very accomplished proffesional Smith. I would really encourage any beginner smiths here in Ontario to come out to this or future meetings. I realize that the meetings are often a long drive as this is a big province but when you are starting out you can learn a lot by watching others. If you are having a problem with something often asking around at a meeting you can get someone to show you how to do what you are having problems with.

When you mention putting the lid to the back Grant do you mean so that the front of the trench is open with nothing above it? Quite a few of the jobs I have been doing are short bars 3-4" long, do they get put down in the trench?

As most who are self employed I am often here on a Saturday but it is hit and miss. If you want to make sure I am here it is best to call ahead. I often work till about 6:00pm if you want to drop by after work, again though it is best to call if you want to be sure to get me here.

Frosty, the pipe sweeps are weld on ones I got from Ralph when I visited him in his shop. The length of the pipes is longer than 9xdia (11.5") but I am pretty sure that it is the length in Ralphs plans. As I said, I have welded out of the forge but I want a little more heat for heavier stock and high volume parts. I may be wrong but I think I can get more heat out of some blown burners. I may put that Johnson in but it means some major rearanging because of the size of it and the fact that it will not be portable like the current forge. I will probably have to get rid of my flypress and maybe replace my big post vice with a large machinist vice mounted on my platen table. It takes up the spot I was going to put my new belt sander and my buffing wheel in. It may involve a larger gas meter as well. Although having it hooked up to natural gas will elminate the running out of propane in the middle of a big job. The advantage of the permanent location is it is next to my windows, so it would be easy to add a nice big powered exhaust hood.

Here is the the gas forge I currently use. The top moves up and down using the trailer jack on the side. Bricks are piled around the sides to adjust the size and openings.

My forge will get up to a welding heat, but when I start sticking 3" round or 40 1" round bars in it, it does take a long time to get up to temperature. When I make a really small chamber or block off the opening too much the forge really pumps out the CO. These are the reasons I am thinking of changing to blown burners. I think I will try blown burners in that forge first because that will be easier than building a new lid for the Johnson.

What do you think of the big Johnson forges Grant? I have one out in the shed that I picked up at an auction for $40 acouple of years ago. I am currently using a forge I built using Ralph Sprouls sidewinder design but slightly modified. I do like this forge in that I can make it small to save fuel and get it hotter, or I can lift the roof and move the brick out and make it up to about 24"x14"x12". What I don't like about it is that the flame blows straight down on top of the work and that it could be a little hotter. I have been thinking of picking up a blower from the Kaynes at Quadstate and changing the forge to blown burners. Possibly changing them to ribbon burners, tipping them or putting some sort of splitter in the outlet. I was contemplating moving things around in the shop the other day and my dad said to me why don't you replace the gas forge with the one in the shed. I am not sure that the Johnson will give me the versatility of the current forge but I could be wrong. Unfortunately I dont have room to install both.

Unfortunately I don't have the blacksmith tools on the website yet. I have 3 sizes of swage blocks, 8 different swage stakes, firepots, and cone mandrels. I also have forged dishing forms and roughed out tong blanks. At the moment have a couple of cutoff hardies that I made to sell but I don't think I am going to make more.

One way to do this is to use round bar for your spring. Drill a SLIGHTLY undersized hole in your swage pieces, heat them up and drive them onto the spring ends. You should taper the ends of the spring before heating the swages. If you have spent a lot of time making your swage pieces you should practice this on some scraps as this is a one chance process. If the swage spring attachment loosens up you can punch around the hole with a center punch to tighten things up.

Any metal lathe can be used to work wood. It is common practice in a lot of pattern shops. The only problem is some of the older metal lathes do not go fast enough for smaller diameter work. If you want to do freehand turning you can make a toolrest that mounts on the toolpost, I have even used the toolbit holder as a toolrest when I have needed to just do a little freehand work on a turning. I have two wood lathes in my shop. One is a Pattern lathe, which looks like a metal lathe only is not quite as heavy duty and runs faster. My other lathe is a faceplate lathe also known as a post lathe. It is a home built (not by me) lathe built out of 1/2" plate with a gearbox in it and two 3" pillow blocks with a shaft and a cast iron faceplate. The rest mounted to a heavy stand that sits on the floor. This type of lathe can turn extremely large turnings, although it can get quite dangerous for very large turnings.

The links didn't come through on my message here is the origional post http://www.iforgeiron.com/forum/f7/fire-irons-set-13429/index2.html

Here is a re-posting of some Ontario Blacksmiths that teach. There are lots of Ontario smiths who teach courses. Lloyd Johnston http://www.ontarioblacksmiths.ca/sal...on-Courses.pdf Darrell Markewitz the Wareham Forge, Artisan Blacksmith Darrell Markewitz of Ontario Canada, Hand forged custom designs for garden, architecture, knives plus courses and DVD David Robertson Ontario Artist Blacksmith David Robertson Rob Martin Thak the Blacksmith &Armourer- Ontario, Canada Sandra Dunn TWO SMITHS These are all accomplished full time blacksmiths. I know some people who have taken the Haliburton course and really liked it there are others that did not. Much of the course is more metal sculpture than Blacksmithing from what I have heard. You should join OABA Ontario Artist Blacksmith Association - (OABA) Artisan Blacksmiths and Artistic Metalworkers of hand forged iron work in Ontario Canada. Wrought Iron gates, grills, railings, knives, original designs and you can meet some of those people who teach and others that have taken the Haliburton Course. You are welcome to come to a meeting and you can join there or even later.

A couple of suggestons for your next pair. Start with a little heavier stock and draw the reins down. This will allow you to have a wider hinge area. Work on keeping that hinge area as wide as possible. Because you are using light stock for the tongs and you are working by hand try making your bits shorter. Bolt style tongs are more versatile but straight v or round tongs are easier to make and give you a stronger grip because you have more leverage, you can spend the time you spent drawing the bits out drawing the reins out. You can make bolt style tongs as you need them as you get more experience Don't be afraid to drill the holes for your rivet, punching the hole in the right spot with no striker or power or treadle hammer can be tricky. Wrecking the tongs after all the that work can be very discouraging. When making a different style of tongs I often draw them full size on a steel bench or even the floor with a piece of soapstone so that I know what each piece looks like before I start forging, and I can compare the pieces to the drawing as I forge them As a last step hold a piece of the stock you want to hold in the tongs and do any final adjusting.

There you go Frosty saying what I just said, just much more elequently and without the sarcasm.;)

Your right from now on I will only call items that I forge by hitting with my fist or squeezing with my fingers hand made.

4140, 4340, or 1045 all make good swages. More the first two if you have sharp parts in the dies. The H13 will make good dies but is overkill and is much harder to both machine and forge. I have quite a bit of 4140 and some 4340 I would be willing to trade with you for some H13. I have over 30 pieces roughly 1" square 3" long 4340 you or anyone who wants to pick them up can have. These are hot cut off pieces that are a little rough but could be quite usefull. What sizes and shapes would you be getting?

That would be a good price, that is per 3' piece of 1 1/8". They did have 12' lengths in smaller diameters. I would think that Sudbury must have some steel suppliers to service machine shops that supply the mines.

While I would agree that forging tongs is an important skill that a blacksmith should have, but when you are starting out having a few pair of good tongs can really help you out. The tongs that Grant (Nakedanvil) makes are inexpensive and well made and provide a benchmark for you when you make your own. They are available at most of the blacksmith suppliers.