Fe-Wood Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 I have a set of fullering dies that came with my power hammer. They are a one way fullering die set that has been eased on one end. I am working on a design that needs two way fullering dies. I need to be able to work around organic shapes without to long of a flat in the middle. I would like to see how everyone makes or modifies their own. At Western States in 2011 Jeffery Funk had a nice set. I cant remember how much of a radius he had on the long axis. If you have them, Please show me pictures of your dies and how you like them and what further modifications you would like to do for the next set. Looking for ideas that work... Here is a picture of mine as they are now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lupiphile Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 Hello there, Jef's dies had less of a slope over the long axis, he's a big advocate of about an 1/8 of an inch crown(making a quarter inch gap on the edges between the two) over the the length of the die, That being said his dies were about 4 inches long, and according to him he rarely works anything over an inch in his little hammer. Being that he has five power hammers all with different dies, this is not a problem. At least thats all the info I gleaned from him about the very same subject at the very same conference.You might want to just match the crown with the other side and try that? Hope this helps, Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JNewman Posted December 20, 2013 Share Posted December 20, 2013 Making shapes like that freehand is best done one axis at a time. I would grind the long radius on the die first. Templates made of masonite sheet metal or even stiff posterboard are helpful for making matching shapes. Once you have the long radius done take a marker and draw a line down the center. You now shape your other radius being careful not to grind off your center line, again a few templates can be very useful here. Once your major grinding is done flap discs can be helpful for blending away hard corners. When you are matching existing rads like you will be a helpful way to make the templates is to cut your template close. Then lightly oil or wax your existing die, mix up some bodyfiller and squish some bodyfiller between your template and die. Once the bodyfiller hardens it will release from the die and you will have a perfect match. Grind the filler that squeezed out the sides off so you have a narrow template that can be used to check one axis at a time. These are techniques used to freehand shape wooden pattern pieces accurately all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fe-Wood Posted December 20, 2013 Author Share Posted December 20, 2013 Thanks John! Great tip about the bondo. I used to cut shaper knives for reproduction moldings and thats how we made the pattern for those. lupiphile, I was thinking the cut was to deep. Not sure what I'm going to do with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fe-Wood Posted December 22, 2013 Author Share Posted December 22, 2013 Just thinking about the 2 way fullering dies... It seems to me one would want the curvature on the long axis to be slightly more than the dies can penetrate the steel under full power. They should also have a length of flat in the middle of the dies so one could fuller along a straight line without to much unintended distortion along the edge of the work.... Any thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wroughton Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Play with it as you go. Feather back the edges of the landing in the beginning. You'll be able to do different things with and without the landing. I have modified dies that came with my Stryker and I've used the fullering dies that came with a Saymak SM50 in another shop. Both were good for fullering down the length of pipe and tubing without leaving a big divot. A full, but shallow radius will give you a working center. Fullering dies like this draw metal out FAST once you get used to them. Depending on how tight you leave the landing you can fairly replicate the blow of a rounding hammer on both sides on solid stock. I drilled holes through my flat dies for saddles and started experimenting with different radi and landings by forming mild steel into shape. Some didn't work, were ground wrong, or were just generally "wonky", but you'll find some that will steer you in a direction that you can refine using harder die stock. Cutting 2" (the short dimension of my 55lb Stryker dies) round stock in half, lengthwise and welding them to a saddle in place on the hammer is the easiest and quick way to make fullering dies. You can experiment with the long radius. Then you're experimenting with just tops or bottoms. We'll see if the remember button is working for taking pictures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fe-Wood Posted December 23, 2013 Author Share Posted December 23, 2013 whroughton- I have 2 set of fullering dies that came with the anyang. One is about 3/4" diameter and the other is about 2" diameter. The one pictured is 3/4". those are way steep on the landing. I'm not looking forward to that grinding job.... Cutting 2" (the short dimension of my 55lb Stryker dies) round stock in half, lengthwise and welding them to a saddle in place on the hammer is the easiest and quick way to make fullering dies. You can experiment with the long radius. Then you're experimenting with just tops or bottoms. Thats a great idea! I was looking at of a set of fullering saddles Jake James uses on his hammer. I'm thinking this would be a nice inexpensive and fast change over way to use fullering dies. Have you taken pictures of yours? I'd really like to see them. My little anyang 33 is the perfect size for this kind of experimentation/learning because it is so small the dies are cheep in comparison to my Bradley. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wroughton Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Trying this from my phone. Did a good job on smoking my laptop screen with a fire poker! Pictures are said dies. The round stock is obvious. Smaller round stock I squishd In the press. Textured dies for bark and forging bark onto pipe and tubing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fe-Wood Posted December 24, 2013 Author Share Posted December 24, 2013 Nice set up! How big are they? I was looking at the sahindler site and they had a similar bolt on saddle. I'm thinking I'll just go this rout, without reworking the dies I have. My reasoning is that they look much easier to change than driving out the wedge each time I want to change dies... A friend has a set up with a flat die set that has a dovetail cut in it so he can make smaller insert dies that are held in with the wedge. That seemed a bit involved for the kind of forging I'm thinking about. I want a veriety of fuller sizes and make them easy to change. Do you have 2 bolt holes so they wont rock or what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wroughton Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 Yes, two 1/2" bolts. I tightened them down before. Now I use a lock nut and just worry about keeping them in place instead of really tight. The saddle itself keeps them aligned. I don't invest a lot in new dies and the saddles make it easy to test new combinations without getting crazy. If your material is forging hot even mild steel dies like this make it quite a while. They are 2" x 4" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fe-Wood Posted December 27, 2013 Author Share Posted December 27, 2013 So I made my first set of dies today. Simple is all I can say! :) I'm making these for an anyang 33 so the flat dies are only 1 5/8"X2 3/4". I used a piece of 3/16 wall 2x3 tube and cut it to fit. Used a single 3/8" bolt with a nylock. I took a piece of 3/4" round 4140 and forged it to about 1/2" thick, leaving the radius along 2 edges, then I split the piece on the band saw and welded them on the saddle. Can't wait to make some more.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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