the_sandy_creek_forge

If, your gonna put something in the bed of your truck, always account for the TRUE weight being 50% more that the ESTIMATED weight the seller gives you.

If it looks like a bad idea....it probably is!

-Aaron @ the SCF

Great work is produced with somewhat little effort, because you're letting your skill and practice do the work for you.

How could you say such a thing Julian?!?! Great work is an arduous and tiring toil worthy of at least $75 per hour. And then of course the skill and practice is worth an additional $25 dollars per hour Now if I could just find clients that would believe that......

But, yes to all that's been said above (especially the wannamakasword kids). I was lucky to start out with a riveters forge, an honest-to-goodness anvil (the London pattern type, not the almost as good block of steel honest-to-goodness type), a few assorted tools, a LARGE "resource center" and Weygers "The Complete Modern Blacksmith." While not the BEST beginners blacksmith book out there, it at least took me from a crawl to a somewhat bumbling stumble. Lacking these basic resources, I probably would have gotten creative and made something work sooner or later. If you can't be creative enough to get yourself started, this whole thing is gonna be more of a chore than a hobby.

I've also read every blacksmith book that I could get my grubby hands on, printed out the pdfs for some I couldn't get my hands on (and believe you me, I got my worth outta that "technology fee" while I was in college!), and tried to keep up with all that's happening here and across the street (although with the influx of posts as of late it's getting harder to keep up!).

I do understand though that there's some questions that just really need to be put in layman's terms to be understood. Asking for a complete treatise on how to make a sword in five easy steps is NOT such a question. Each of us has our specialties. If someone were to ask me what would be minimum of defining elements (in my opinion) for something to be considered art deco, I would gladly share what knowledge I have (hey, those art history classes are gonna have to come in handy sooner or later). If I can't decipher what all those numbers mean on the MSDS for some kind of surface prep etching chemical, I am gonna try to find an answer, then come here, or there, or somewhere and ask someone who can give me a straightforward answer so I know I'm not gonna blow myself up.

However, asking why the ends of your tapers are splitting (while it is a quick and easy answer) has been asked everywhere at least once; multiple times at most places. A little bit of research would save everyone else typing the same thing they've probably typed before. BUT... I shouldn't really speak as I've asked my fair share of dumb questions before (just don't let my wife know I admitted to that!).

-Aaron @ the SCF
(just wanted to throw in another set of parenthesis, since I didn't quite meet my quota in the above message).... ( )

How they (used to) cut it... as told by the retired railman that now runs the "antique barn sale" outside of small central illinois town:

As I was pondering the complexities of using a 20" long cold cut that had a 36" long handle, the gentleman who owns the antique barns explained to me that the cold cut was run into rail all the way around with a few HEAVY strikes. The rail was laid across two supports with the cut in the center, and force was applied with a jack (I am here assuming some kind of jig/vise type device was used). The track would break off "nice and smart right along the scored lines." I guess kinda like the trick of snapping a scored shaft under a BIG power hammer? I would wager the contemporary preferred method is a big chop saw...

-Aaron @ the SCF

AH HAH!! So they do get sent to a scrap place (or at least yours do). My uncle works for Iowa Interstate (who it seems contracts ALL of there work out so getting a lead is that much harder). I mentioned getting a piece of axle to him once, and he remembered hearing a Rumor that the bigger RR's rerolled them to make spikes and such (which is logical even though the quality of spikes doesn't really indicate axles as the parent stock). Hm.... I might have to look up that Grossman company. One of those axles would be well worth the drive from central IL down to Missouri if it's of the correct size...thanks sstreckfuss!

-Aaron @ the SCF

Design Fees:
I charge anywhere from $0 (like for a sketch of some free form fireplace tools) up to around $60 (for the railing project where the client changes his/her mind and opinion no less than ten times before I can even get one decent sketch off the drawing board). I retain ALL copyright of my designs.

And then, if you wanna get technical (or if you have a client of somewhat sketchy character) at the very bottom of the design sketches write "COPYRIGHT (your name here) (date)." As far as I understand (and I am NOT a lawyer) as soon as you put the idea/design in a tangible form (a sketch) it is protected as a copyrighted work of art. To be doubly sure, I would take the original up to city hall and have it notarized by the city clerk (who in my small town is always happy to have an excuse to notarize something, anything, really!). Now it's your design. You have a witness that it is your design. And if anyone wants to argue, hopefully they'll realize that a notarized original is much more legally binding than the xeroxed copy they have pinned to the wall A custom watermark on your drafting paper would probably be cool also, but that's just pipe-dreams for me

I haven't had to take anything to that extreme yet, and hope I never do. But all the same, it's good to cover my backside, just in case.

Whilst on the subject. I just picked up a railing job. Prefabbed components, free-form design, all artsy fartsy and stuff. Just the way I like it. And the prefabbed components will save me a lot of time I don't have, and I can still keep up a reputation for delivering as promised. Now as long as the client agrees with my labor rates....

-Aaron @ the SCF

Put "1 dremel tool kit" and "1 set small detail files" on the Christmas list. Spend about 10 hours trying to grind your own. Decide after 10 hours that you have built enough character, then order from one of the above suppliers
-Aaron @ the SCF

Hm.... and I had always figured it would be cheaper to replace the tracks than a train wheel. Learn something new everyday.

Alternately.... Sstreckfuss, you work for a railroad? Like have access to the old, worn out massive chunks of round stock scrap that are also know as train axles, all for the price of scrap?? If so, you might find many, many, many, good friends here

-Aaron @ the SCF

I found my great-grandpa's anvil and rivet forge stashed in the back of one of the sheds. That jogged Dad's memory enough to remind him he had a blacksmithing book somewhere. I cut a door opening in one of the old grain bins that we no longer used and set up shop.
-Aaron @ the SCF

Cost of materials and design fees up front.
Everything else upon delivery/installation (unless it's someone I know well, then I can set up 2 or 3 payments if need be)
-Aaron @ the SCF

From what I can see in the pictures, the one on the left looks like it might be a good blade for what your talking about. As far as the one on the right, I have two thoughts:
1) the weld globs are from where high carbon/carbide tips had been but are no longer
or
2) your right in figuring that someone tried welding them up to get more life out of them.

I know most of the large sawmill blades have the clip on blade tips (either high carbon or carbide now). But these blade don't look to be that type.
Good luck and probably an experimental heat treat/etch will tell more than anything.
-Aaron @ the SCF

I think I've mentioned it before on here, but we made a couple of "boy scout" tomahawks outta them when I was a kid (living on a farm meant PLENTY of worn out disc blades.) Just gas-axe the general shape, grind to perfection, heat up the shank, bend around a mandrel to form an eye and then weld by your preferred method. They generally won't hold a keen edge like for a hatchet, but they are VERY tough and will stick in the end grain of a nice chunk of wood (provided it is set up in a properly safe manner).

Another project I'd been wanting to try is to cut a broad-ax shape out, keeping the curved edge that's already present. I'll heat it up, hammer it flat and form up a socket out of whatever I leave as a shank. Attach an old broom handle and presto-chango, I'll have (hopefully) a manually operated edger to trim the sod off at the curb. Just sit the curved blade on the ground and stomp it in.

-Aaron @ the SCF (whose getting sick of using the grubbing hoe to edge his lawn but is just TOO thrifty to go buy an edger )

Don,
Don't worry about the pay at first. As long as you get a couple little dudes to come by and leave with the "that's totally awesome" look on their faces it was well worth it. THEN worry about the pay. I do one demo in the spring at my alma mater, it kinda kills my week and that Saturday, but it's a really family oriented fine arts fair/festival, so there's always plenty of kids running around and standing mesmerized while they try to contemplate just how hot 1600 degrees actually is The real trick to that particular festival is, that as long as I am performing a live demo, I don't have to pay the exhibitors fee, and I've made some pretty decent contacts in the uppity-uppity central Illinois fine art's community. Not necessarily the type I associate with on a regular basis, but they ARE the ones that have other contacts with people who can still afford commissioned work.

-Aaron @ the SCF (is still waiting for his ship to come in...)

I don't know about cooking the neighbors, but a couple dozen of those would make one heck of a Burmese neighbor-kids.....er...i mean Tiger, trap.

That really is some inspiring work though.
-Aaron @ the SCF

Hey M,
As far as my experience goes, axles are not tool steel, but they usually are some grade of medium to high carbon steel, possibly low alloy content. But yes, many people have made hammers from them. I've been wanting to forge a couple hammers sooner or later.

Unfortunately, my access to free scrapped axle stock is either through my dad, who works on HEAVY machinery and semis, or through my brother (mostly skid loader and small tractor axles). Either way, the thought of working 1.75" up to 2.5" axles by hand is still a little intimidating for me. They'll be on hold till a power hammer (or a cheap sledge swinger) comes along
-Aaron @ the SCF

Hey John N.
What's your opinion on cobalt bits. I've used them before but didn't really notice any difference between them and TiN. Then again I was only drilling 1/4" holes in 1/4" HR stock IIRC and was using a press, not a hand drill. Any advice.

I've had decent success with the TiN coated HSS bits from harbor freight. I try to avoid the split points, as our drill doctor is a little older and doesn't quite sharpen them properly. Other than my brother breaking a couple of the smaller bits when he was trying to drill a Grade 5 bolt for a castle nut (mechanic does NOT equal machinist in any way, shape, or form), I really have no qualms with the HF bits, at least on a hobbyist level.
-Aaron @ the SCF

for an anvil, i've used a railroad piece, the part that the tie itself lays on and is nailed to, not the wood, obviously.

Hey M,
Not sure if I am thinking of the same thing you have (and not sure that someone hasn't mentioned it yet) but if I AM thinking of what you are using, it is a piece of plate about 5"x5" and maybe 1/2" thick. It has several square holes in it and two ridges that the track sits down in between? If so it's a trackplate. If that's what you're using, it's a little on the light side for an anvil.

If you have a local salvage yard that allows you to walk around and pick out what you want, go and find the biggest solid chunk of steel that you can find (or afford) and use it for an anvil. Alternately, take a little bit longer walk and see if maybe there isn't a chunk of rail laying somewhere. I know around here they usually leave the cutoffs laying where they fall. RR rail doesn't make the most ideal anvil, but it would a lot sturdier than a trackplate. I believe there is a blueprint here on IFI about alternatives to a "real" anvil. Remember, all an anvil is is something big, heavy, and steelish.
-Aaron @ the SCF

Candid: No problem. I too learned the hard way on a leg vise (which i ended up stripping back down when all was said and done and just oiling it after I'd burned half the paint off...)
The EPA is the main reason I didn't go with the chemical stripper. Disposal rates around here (as with the rest of the country i am sure) are outlandish. That and I try to stay away from large amounts of harmful chemicals as much as is possible.

Compressor should be up and going this Saturday. All the wiring is run, new motor is on it, and space is cleared out in the old cylindrical storage facility (unused grain bin), from where the air will be piped into the shop. It would of been in already, but the wife had to go into work Sunday afternoon, and I didn't have anyone to watch the daughter. For now, I am just gonna run a 1/2 hose from the bin to the shop until things slow down this fall and I can get a full weekend to do all the plumbing.
-Aaron @ the SCF

Candid: should have read "will at least have all the first coat laid down" (I'm gonna do three coats of primer and three of paint, just for good measure). Thinking one thing and typing another....again....
-Aaron @ the SCF

RainsFire: What you are seeing as old metal finish is actually a layer of dried out, caked on grease imbedded with metal shavings that is about a 16th of an inch thick. Under this is what is left of the original paint, and there isn't all that terrible much left. Luckily all that grease has kept any major rust and corrosion at bay, not so luckily you can barely touch the thing as it sits without embedding metal shaving in your hands.....

CQ: The restore is going....slowly...but it is going. When I got it, all we had was a little old 4.5 CFM air compressor, so sand blasting was out of the question. So far I've pretty well run the bearings outta a little hand drill using a wire brush, and that was just on one of the arms..... But! we just purchased a BIG ingersoll rand compressor this past weekend, and as soon as we get it set up with a single phase motor, I'll be able to blast to my hearts content. If it gets to looking like the compressors not gonna be running before it's too cold to paint (about late October/ early November around here) I have a guy locally that will blast it for me pretty cheap. I'm just not especially keen on loading up that 600-700 pound base to take it and get it blasted...

I did manage to pick out a paint system for it. I seriously considered repainting it the OE seafoam-ish green color....but then decided that since I am not restoring it for a museum, why not get creative.... a quick trip to Tractor Supply Company, and the decision to go with Valspar Tractor and Implement paint in Allis-Chalmers orange was set in stone! I might even get creative and pick up a quart of dark blue and do some flames on the base... but that will come a bit later.

So, in summary, the drill is coming. So far it is coming slowly, but hopefully with the decision to sandblast it will start moving a bit more quickly and I will at least have all the primer laid down before it gets to cold to paint.

-Aaron @ the SCF
(pictures to come soon. I finally figured out how to take smaller sized pictures with my camera:) )

I use this general rule of thumb. Put the daughter in the truck and turn up the stereo to what I would consider a safe volume for her little 4.5 year old ears. Anything consistently louder than that, I try to wear ear plugs. My brother has a pair of those fancy-schmancy auto-muffling earmuffs. I tried those once, but they gave me a headache wearing them (everything sounded like it was echoing through a half-blown out speaker). I like the plugs that are connected with a cord, string, whatever. Usually I just keep them around my neck, that way it only take me 10 minutes to find them instead of 20 :)
-Aaron @ the SCF

Thought this might make a better visual aid for anyone who is not sure what we might be talking about.



That's almost exactly like the one I'll use (except my door's a bit smaller and I don't think it's a Vogelsang.) The flues/heat exchanger/ stack robber will run through the upper barrel.

-Aaron @ the SCF

EDIT: oh yeh, and mine's not pretty grey. It's beautiful rusty brown ;)

Hm... never thought of the water heater tanks. Fortunately the barrel stove is already done and made for me (short of a heat exchanger).

I'd thought about the barrel-in-a-barrel heat exchanger (stack robber). So I did up some math just a bit ago to see how the numbers all compare (hold onto your seats kids. this might be an interesting ride!).

The following measurements are accurate to withing a few square inches (i didn't account for material thicknesses, just went with nominal size) and are figured based on a barrel stove using 36" long barrels top and bottom.

If I use a grease drum with a 15 inch diameter, inside of a 36" long barrel, i end up with the fan blowing over 1695 sq. inches of heated steel. If I use 17 pieces of 1" exhaust pipe, i get somewhere around 1921 sq. inches. Now if I bump up to using 2" exhaust pipe, I'll get 3843 sq. inches of heated surface, more than double the surface area of the grease-barrel-in-an-oil-barrel technique.

Using a pattern where the pipes are laid out with one pipe through the dead center, and two concentric circles of pipe working out towards the edge of the barrel with the pipes seperated by 45 degrees (hope that makes sense), i easily have enough room for 2" diameter pipe.

If I bump up to 3" diameter pipe i get a surface area of 5765 sq. inches. Now I have to stop and wonder. I can PROBABLY fit that many pipes in some type of pattern on the drum, but at what point do i start losing efficiency. If I draw off too much heat from the exhaust, will I still get enough draw up the chimney (without a ridiculously tall chimney)? Also at which point can the stove no longer pass enough heat through the heat exchanger to keep it hot? These are unfortunately questions that I don't really even know where to look for formulas to solve them with.

Knowing how much heat one of these stoves makes (ah, such fond memories of winter scout camp) and just standing back and looking at the whole of it, I think that I could still run the 2" pipe and keep some type of efficiency. The 3" flues I am not so sure about.

I do know that before I fire the stove up, I need to make a couple grates for the bottom and throw some sand in to keep it from burning through so quickly.

Some other thoughts I am pondering:
-a thermostat to kick the fan on and off when the flues reach certain temperatures.
-the louvers for directing the heat to where i am, maybe even two sets of louvers for vertical and horizontal adjustment (thanks for the idea on that one Frosty!)
-exactly what style of fireplace tools I want to forge to go along with my barrel stove

Thoughts anyone?

-Aaron @ the SCF

My hoist got doused in the slack tub. Now it's a bit MOIST
-Aaron @ the SCF

And I know what you mean about fabbing a firepot. I'll but a cast one before I try laying out, cutting, and welding that much 1" plate again (although hopefully with the 1" plate, I won't have to worry for quite a LONG time!)
-Aaron @ the SCF

One big double-barrel stove. Hopefully, before it gets cold this winter I'll be able to install 1" exhaust pipe flues in the upper barrel with a fan on the backside to blow the air around the shop and get everything all hooked up for it. Otherwise it'll be a salamander heater, warm bibs, and plenty of moving around.

-Aaron @ the SCF