macbruce

I spose there's a lesson to be learned here....I've got a perfectly good cordless grinder collecting dust in the shop and that puppy would have likely prevented this. Junkyard steel is allot cheaper, but I ASSumed it was the right stuff....... High Ho, back to school again.........mb

Just for grins, thought I'd add a couple of photos of the anvil. That took a while to weld those pieces together. Glad it was cold yesterday afternoon. After 5 passes it was giving off some heat. It sure doesn't look like anything, but it took a lot of time to make it.. I figure the total weight of the anvil is about 690lbs. It gets welded to a 1.5in thick base plate later. ... Aj

Disaster.......the 7"x29"anvil was some kind of cast iron. 7018,308ss,thermanite,mig all failed to weld it.all welds broke away from the boss metal and took out big hunks, bah....took it back to the salvage yard with some other junk and never looked back........Ryerson don't look so bad now! euirgfeiyucvyu8d

75#unleaded

I am looking for between 20 and 40 tonnes. and have 4" and 6" bore rams .working out the final tonnage for a given pump is not a problem. the thing I cant work out is how fast this is reached when changing from low to high pressure or in a single stage unit how fast pressure will build when the ram becomes under load.
thanks Owen

Dear all ,
I am about to start making a forging press and have a few questions about pressure transfer and how long pumps and systems take to build up pressure .
I have looked in the Batson book and on the pages of this forum and am left with a few questions .
I already have a working press .A mills 200tonne and it is a powerful tool but slow .It runs at just under 1/2 inch per second and slower return. It is a one way cylinder with spring return . I can happily use it to squash stuff and for a single forging action it is great. However its slow nature means that all the heat is drawn from the steel in that one operation .
I want to make a faster H frame press, however almost all the info I have seen on duel stage pumps seems to high lite to me how slow they are in the second stage high pressure phaze .
It seems all well and good having fast approach and retreat but what is a good forging speed for a press in the high pressure stage ?
another question I have is , when pressure builds up,how long does that take, by that I mean when the pump switches to high pressure from low how many seconds (or less )before the high pressure side of the system is at full pressure ?
now my assumptions around that are that length of hose and hose material must have an effect on this? my large press is a piston pump and seems to not really slow down when it engages hot steel , the motor just strains .
I want to make a press for punching and precision hot stamping and hot cutting as well as squaring damascus billets and to add context I already have power hammers, so do not need to duplicate that role .
I have accumulated various pumps /power packs rams lever valves and hose over the years and am ready to finally put something together in the new year .
so in summery :-
How fast does a press need to be during its high pressure stage in order to work for hot forging operations .
How long does perssure build up take in duel stage pumps when they switch over . are there any ways to minimise this?
would running a single stage pump and larger motor have advantages over duel stage ?
Do piston pumps have advantages over gear pumps?

thanks in antisipation .
Owen

Hey just forget the set screw thing just a thought. don't worry about filling the hole make the die big enough to bridge over it. It won't hurt a thing and you may want to use it later. Sorry for all the grief I caused you.

Nice work, Did you jump weld those ity bity thorns in the forge? If so, how?

I love the detail, and the bowl is really awesome. you must have welded it solid and then forged the depression?
Now did you end up keeping it or was it a gift for someone lucky?

Leave these babies out for the in-laws!

It's not tough when you have the right tools to do the job. In the end it is what works for you the best that matters.

Got some interesting results with my new Iron Kiss 75. Not sure where to set the stroke for the hardest hit so I just put it in the middle, air pressure was set at 60psi! In five blows I got .625 and on 10 blows I got .388!

I kinda think the five blow test shows that it's still just a 75 pound hammer, but the 10 blow test (I believe) shows the benefit of a 20:1 anvil. Even as the work spreads out and gets thinner it keeps driving into the work. That's right where light anvil hammers start to just bounce. My 750 Bell hammer had way too light an anvil, but worked great on juicy or thick material. As soon as the work cooled down a little or got thin that hammer would just bounce.

Gotta get used to this hammer and I'll report back. Interesting that it beat some hammers of twice the weight (and cost). As John mentioned, control is more important, but it ain't a trade-off. This hammer has great control, the little I've played with it.

Some of us fossils might remember the stuff in a can at the auto parts store that would re seal piston rings,I never bought any........As a stop gap the grease could work ok......mb

Can't be drilled? Sure it can. You can do a spot annealing , or use a carbide drill to get through. I routinely drill out HSS taps at work with carbide drills.

The LG anvils are holow. I drilled a 1 1/4 hole thru to the hollow in the bottom of the dovetail on a 50lber one time so I can forge the tee bolts. If I had it I would drill and tap a hole in from the side then make my dies with a round shank that fits the hole & hold them in with a big set screw. You could grind/mill flats on the side of the shank to index the die. might put the same design on the ram. Just a thought.

I dont know what Sam was talking about but what comes to my mind is upseting the end of a bar, you could build a "holder" die that was a pair of clamps, drop up to 30" of bar down the hole and then upset the end to your hearts content...


What ever you do I think its a great start, interesting to see the textured/flute exterior... Is this hammer for you or is it a commission?

I think Sam is talking about upsetting to make anvil tools: draw the shank, drop in the 'hardy' hole, upset working part of the tool, leave it in the hardy hole and forge in grooves for swages or whatever you like.

You shoulda left the hole, probably wouldn't have hurt too much. Then you coulda made some dies with a hardy hole for upsetting in the hammer!

There are advantages to having a hole in ones anvil if you can make change out dies so that one with a "hardy hole" can be placed over it and then your hardy tooling can be used on the hammer as well.

Off topic. I missed Clifton. I was Indian dancing at Tecumseh Lodge Powwow, Tipton Fairgrounds, September 4-5, 2010.

I tend to agree with the "heavy grease in the clutch bearing" theory. I have the same issue with a LG 25, especially when the shop is cold (whick it has been lately!!). Works better with a very light grade of grease in cold weather. Good luck, and let us know what works for you.

Actually I've been scrounging stuff for a treadle hammer for a while. My anvil is a solid chunk of 5.25"? round 4340, I may have to trim the length on it though.(It was sort of free: I bought 4 of them through a friend with access to his company's scrap pile at their scrapper rate and then sold 2 for twice that and so had 2 free ones. Gave one to a friend and have been sitting on mine.) Picked up some 1" plate for the base and am looking at something for the back upright.

Sounds like a great find on the fluted stuff!

I have a friend whose family used to make specialty systems for nuclear power plant repairs. He's very down on lead; says that just adding more steel to make up for the shielding difference generally works out much better than having to deal with lead. (I haven't told him that I cast wheel weight slabs for working steel for armourmaking...)

Gonna be odd with an anvil that is 7" thick ,and 36" in diameter

I used a single phase 220 5hp motor with a 3 inch double v belt pully on the motor to a 21 incn pully to a 15 drive pulley puts me close to 300 rpm to the drive pully on the hammer but I have the stroke shortened on the crank to give me the quicker action I want with this hammer I love the contol I have with this hammer the way I have it adjusted know it is very close to a quick air hammer action it is also very useful this way with some sping tooling I use
Here is a pic of the drive tower it is 5inch 3/8 wall square the supports for the pullys are 2inch 1/4 wall square and is very solid the belting is a canvas rubber composite, it drives the hammer very good the dive pully is directly above the hammer pully this way the idler falls away on its own Hollis Wooldridge gave me that idea. There are alot of little adustments you can make with this hammer that can make it hit hard ord or very fast and light I love this hammer and would love to have another one set up just for drawing.

That tube sounds like a dandy start for a treadle hammer anvil!