youngdylan

....I forgot .... we did have "Edge of the Anvil" over here, great book. Seems like there's a wealth of information available at your finger tips these days that you really had to hunt down not that many years ago. To me, one of the most inspiring "how to" books I've ever seen is Peter Parkinsons. I'd be years ahead in my "development" if that book was around when I started. It's kinda like Lillico's in that I go back to it again and again

Thats some pretty impressive videos there Brian, you really are a human power hammer.

Actually Thomas perhaps I should rephrase that as "I didn't have or know how to use a computer back then". I don't think either of the books you mentioned reached our shores until relatively recenetly, the book that really OPENED my eyes was "into the new iron age" by amina chatwin but I had to reverse engineer and experiment to find out how the good stuff was made.

Yeah, cutting plates suck. I quite reguarly use a 4lb copper faced hammer when cutting relatively thin work on the hardy, much quicker .... and so productive .. one or two wallops and its done. No tip tapping around.

One observation on US v UK anvil worship, over there you seem to know the maker and history of a lot of the anvils bougtht/sold .....or want to find them. Over here, as often as not anvils sold on ebay are just described as an "antique anvil", rarely is the maker given. A lot of them are still sold as garden ornaments. Heres a good example http://cgi.ebay.co.u...DefaultDomain_3 ..... calm down now :)

Sorta how I got into "contemporary smithing". I'd packed in my job as a teacher and was struggling to earn a living making silver jeweller. I needed an anvil to forge some heavy chain by making the chain, twisting it,and hammering the links flat. A 1/2 cwt would have been WAY more than I needed. Instead I found my 4cwt Brooks, in almost new condition and for £70. I HAD to find out what I could do with it. There was very little info on the web back them, there were no modern "how to" books with good colour pictures, I couldn't find out where to buy suitable coal so used my air/propane jewellers torch and some firebricks as a forge. I didn't get the time to go to forge-ins so teaching myself was VERY time consuming work. Hence the love of not following the rules and the dislike of people simply repeating dogma.... it's also why I ask dumb questions still. I spent years of welding "kit form" gates to fund a microscopic workshop to buy the tools I craved .... but making "good stuff" for my own use. Eventually I posted photos of some of this on my experimental (to me, back then) website, probably about 5 or 6 years ago and never looked back. BTW there was a serious point to my posting, a few people seem to pick up on it. One of the older (Hi Grant) guys we all respect did over on another forum. The modifications are a quick and easy way of making an anvil with very poor edges into a very useful tool, even more so with the heel bit. If people are prepared to see past history they can aquire a working tool very easily. The bit were I've gound away the sides to get a sharp edge near the HORN is FAR FAR FAR easier than refacing, you very rarely need more than a few inches length of sharp edge, and you only need to grind away the top 2 inches of the side. The rest of the edge having a varying radius is far more useful than a sharp edge. You take away very little mass but DO take away any historic value to a collector. In my eyes, so what? You've got yourself a working tool which is what it was meant to be when it was made. I do believe too many people get hung up on having sharp edges all over the face because they've been told that is "what you should have" and never question it.

... likewise yourself...and your apprentice Guess I was moving sideways with working conditions thing but it's something I bang on about any chance I get. Hey, I haven't even started ranting about the Conan the Barbarian wanna bee swordmakers yet:) oh so easily done on a forum ....... with all those missing but valuable non verbal clues from real life.

Hey, this is turning into a love in, pretty much with you there, especially about repecting the old time served guys. And on a good bit of debate/ controversy. Being too scared to tread on toes or challenge the authodoxy is the ultimate in sterility. That said I do kinda feel the whole "blacksmithing" thing is FAR too over romamanticised, usually by hobbist's, partimers, weekenders, the dress up crowd, wannabes etc. Me? someone earning there living from always sees things from a very differnt angle, usually without the rose tinted glasses. I'm lucky in having plenty of industrial archeology on my doorstep (Kelham Island was/is? something else) I go somewhere like that and not only fall in love what was done but I'm only too aware of the working conditions those people had. A lot of them were just used as commidities, burnt up, spat out and died at an early age or led a badly crippled old age. That ain't romantic to me. We're talking industrial smiths here but I certainly don't buy into that "village blacksmith" happy ever after mythology. Those guys (and it nearly always was guys ) had HARD HARD HARD lives and I'm quite sure they didn't worship their anvils. Respect them they probably did, but I'm sure they they'd have torn chunks of them if it made there working life easier.

Interesting thread with some noteworthy pearls of wisdom above. My tuppence is, you really have to understand how to market yor business, people ain't gonna come to you unless they know you're there. In my case my website changed EVERYTHING, I went from really struggling and more or less cut and welding gates to doing quite ok , this was only a few months after putting up my site. Some other business advice from experience is: KEEP YOUR OVERHEADS LOW was one of the best bit of business advice I was ever given. Makes it much easier to survive down times. I get by in 400 sq ft and am managing to take one some reasonbly sized architectural commissions. I've overun the space now but many years of getting by there has allowed to use the money saved to buy PLENTY of kit. A 1500 sq ft workshop would have probably stood me another £10,000 pounds UK a year. That's money a year that I've been able to buy new toys with When you're doing well ALWAYS keep your eye on what's going to be happening to you in few months or so, ALWAYS be looking for more work in the future even when you're overrun with ongoing work ..... ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS Have "backup" work. I used to more or less concentrate on just on piece of work but nearly got very badly burnt when one bit of work ground to to a halt because of nothing to do with me (dithering client and incompetent architect) I took me a few weeks to pull in some replacement work. Good job I wasn't drowning in overheads then

Tong in cheek there South. I'm never happier than when rattling cages or being irreverant. I can see your point, ...and respect it. But to me USING a tool outranks preserving history many times over.

I'm not really bothered about the mastery of blacksmith techniques, I more often than not avoid calling myself one, I certainly don't want to unimaginatively and boring keep repeating that past. I DO however adore USING and experimenting (and hence learning along MY own path) with metalworking tools, a lot of my life revolves around that. I would quite happily chop a mousehole anvil (whatever one of those is) in half if i thought it was furthering what I do.

A little to do with slope on the top South, but MUCH more to to do with the under cutting that means I can get at the inner curves of some acute angles on Art Nouveau curves and still have the stability that the mass of the anvil gives and it is at a far more convenient height than a stake in a vice, and it's always there on the end of the anvil whenever I need it, which I do a lot. No time wasted finding and setting up whatever the alternative is.

As ever Bob you're on the money there but especially so with especially so with the above.

Yeah I can go with all of that but to be honest I'd have done the same WHATEVER make it was. It was made as a tool to be used as tool and doing what I've done means it can still used a tool, only it's more useful than it was when it was new. It was not made just to be a part of history. EVERYTHING ever made is part of history. My mother had what I think was called a 17th century or 18th or something century post colonial 5 foot anvil ... or something like that. My old man found it in a pig sty and used it as a doorstop. My mum offered it to me when he passed away. I thought (and still do) it was as ugly as sin and no use to me as tool. She put it up on ebay. Dozens of bids, went for hundreds and one of you guys bought it. I stored in in a toilet (no rooom in workshop) for months until he came over here. He'd a shipping container and was hoovering up just about any relic he could find (dealer or something). When he came to my workhop he could NOT have been any less interested (just to discuss) the tools in my workhop or my workshop itself (too modern for the "wierdo" I guess). Red rag to bull there, what's worse he constantly kept forcing the conversation onto telling me to look out for any other old tools that may have been of interest to him. If I could have been bothered looking out for any, I'd have far rather sold them for scrap than passed them on to him. Who knows how helpful I could have been to him as working blacksmith with contacts and no interest in collecting things myself. If only he'd have at least feigned some interest in 20th centuary tools.

Anvils and their history really isn't my thing so I'm not really up on the different types but were steel faces only welded to wrought bodies or did they weld steel faces to cast bodies as well?. Yeah the bodies cast but I'm 99.9% sure the top is welded one. Before grinding out all the chunks missing from the edges you could see a clear line running all the way round the face about 1/2" below the top. It's still just about visible in photos 1-3

Nice bit of kit Larry .... just where DO you get the time?

I've got a Brooks 4 cwt in reasonable condition and was recently given an unknown (but looks like a Brooks) 1.25 cwt with a flat top but very ******d out edges (probably from a school) A lot of guys your side of the pond seem to worship anvils, buff them up, put them on pedastals, spend far too much time repairing them, get hung up on sharp edges, put them in museums, dance naked on a full moon around them..... etc etc etc. Me? they're just tools. Beast them, use them up, wear them out, get another. They're just tools, tools are used to earn my livelihood ... in the most cost effective way possible. I love tools. Second hand ones over here are plentiful and cheap. Sooooo .... an hour or two with a 9" grinder and I'd modified one used tool into another more useful tool. Ground a few massive radii on most of the edges. Under cut one of the sides to get a bit of small radius near the table. But most importantly of all ground that "funny" shape near the hardy hole. Yeah yeah yeah I know it's two piece anvil, yeah yeah yeah I know it weakens it .... but no-one really pounds on this area .... do they? ....They don't do they? It was just going to be an "occasional" anvil but to be honest I use far more than the 4cwt (I've got 3 power hammers). Those big and varying radiuses are so useful, much more so than the crisp edge bit. It's also good being only 64kg, I can boot it round the room as needs be. Hey, farriers anvils weigh very little .... and those guys do some serious forging. That bit on the end is just incredibly useful ...... If I only had one anvil I'd do that to it.

Did you buy it to use or display? If bought to use, do just that, it will keep the area used clean. So what if the body rusts a bit, it'll take a few hundred years to rust away. It is just a tool made to be used as a tool, used HARD at that. Back in it's day it's prime purpose was to earn someone their livelihood in the most cost effective way, I doubt very much if it saw any fancy oils or other treatment than a slap of paint on the sides. If rust does bother you I'd give it an occasional wipe with a rag soaked in WD40 or some such. I'm someone who does NOT worship anvils ... at all ... but I sure as ***** love using them.

?????????????????????????? Well respected as Hofi Is, It's been quite well revitalised in this country, and I suspect yours for quite a while before Hofi.

Nice work John. Good to see you're as good with the artistic side as you are with the jig/tool making. I love both aspects of creative metalwork.

Roy Thanks for the images/links. Am I doing something dumb but I couldn't find a way to see more pictures on the Saltfork site. What is the heat exchange method you use, how does opening the doors affect thing, especially a door at the back for long bars. I don't have much (any) experience of them but I'm fascinated by the concept. To me it just seems plain WRONG pumping all that heat in the exhaust gas into the room ... wrong on so many levels.

H. is that because opening and closing the door(s) alters the heat input ? Do you still use it, are they worth the time to build? I just can't bear the heat from mine at times.

I can't offer too much constructive but I can say that home brewed atmospherics DO work, there athousands of them in use all over the planet. When you do finally crack it (and you WILL) you'll love the concept. I've build about a dozen burners now, constantly modifying them as I go. All they are is a small tube squirting gas down a large tube and a bit of tuning, and can be knocked up in 1/2 hour. The whole concept of propane heating is so verastile, a pile of movable firbricks and as many heaters as needed and you can heat just about anything. I've got and induction hjeater coming and that combined with a large oxy-propane torch with hard firebricks and a few gas forges means I'm seriously thinking of getting rid of my coal forge to free up valuable real estate. Here's some more details http://blacksmith.org/forums/threads/404-Is-my-coal-forge-toast-....you-know-ancient-history Robert, keep perservring with the propane option. I've been in a tunnel like that many time when you think you're getting nowhere .... you're learning a LOT as you go go and that learning is always good, 9 time out of 10 you're sooner or later glad you've got that learning under you're belt Saftey is everything with propane forges, ventalation and flame failure devices are musts .... I only started using the later after I had a VERY LUCKY escape. I didn't switch the shut off valve off fully, just a tiny bit ajar without knowing it, left the workshop clapped out and out of focus after a long sweaty day ...... it's good job they add that smellt chemical to propane ......do I need to say more!

Ciladog, thanks for the diagram. I was vaguely aware of the book but think I'll get it now. Guess it's the same principle for a forge or kiln, instead of switching an electrical element on/ off you switch a gas valve on/off .... with a lot more sfety features. It would be useful for the forge cos I just tend to run it full tilt a lot and 3 burners gets unbearable in my shoebox of a workshop. I also want to get into forging bronze. Brad good point about the 3 ssr's and cooling fan. It's wired for sigle phase now but I might replace the elemnts for 3 phase wiring. It's a 6KW so thats a relatively large current draw on just one phase, better to spread the load over all 3 phases. A full set of new heating elemnts is only about £140 direct from the manufacture, seems pretty reasonabl all things considered. Yeah, I gues I'll go for a named brand controller, Even with postage a controller from YingTongTiddleEyePo is just too cheap at £4.95 http://cgi.ebay.co.u...=item335fcd9b82 Actually I've nothing against buying Chinese as long as the quality control is there. I've had an Anyang 40kg hammer for 5 faultless years now and I've got an induction heater on it's way. It's just that £5 is just too cheap. It's a long term project, Kilns just sat on my trailer buried in my garage till I find time to reorganise my workshop but I'm quite exicited about doing proper heat treating, no more looking at chicken blood under the light of a full moon. Controlled ramp would be good for annealing things like h13

Hofi tells you it is