New style Kinyon hammer "spring helve" substitute?

[Trip]

Hey yall,

 

ok, some of yall are probably going to be like "your STILL working on that thing???!!!??" LOL   

 

Yep, I'm still working on my power hammer, I did a little work on it yesterday.  My hammer frame (anvil post, base, and back bone) vary from what's called for in Ron Kinyon's new hammer design. So I'm concerned that the top spring helve thats called for in the plans won't work. so I was wondering if I could substitute the spring for a piece of HEAVY pipe steel.  Would that work, would it be harder on the air cylinder?

 

Thanks,

       Trip

[MLMartin]

You will not get good flex and whipping action out of a pipe. The whole reason there is a long flat spring used on the hammer design is to allow the head to move father up and down than the acual cylinder travels.

 

Pipes are not springs

[Trip]

You will not get good flex and whipping action out of a pipe. The whole reason there is a long flat spring used on the hammer design is to allow the head to move father up and down than the acual cylinder travels.

 

Pipes are not springs

ok, well wouldn't there be energy loss with the spring and whipping motion?

[MLMartin]

There may be some loss due to the spring pulling back as the hammer moves all the way down. But there is also some gained as the head travels higher and it is then slung down by the spring returning to flat. All commercial made mechanical hammers have some type of spring in them be it steel or even rubber. You have to have this spring action. If you did not and you stuck a large part to be forged in the hammer and the head did not make a full rotation because the travel distance was to short the hammer would jam.

 

Realistically a steel pipe will flex some but it will not perform like a proper heat treated steel spring.

 

Leaf springs can be had is all sizes.

 

Why do you believe that a leaf spring is not a good choice for your hammer?

 

Also I understand you are wanting to build a mechanical hammer that is air driven. So the idea of the hammer jamming from a short head stroke may not apply like it would a more conventional mechanical hammer.

I am sure drawing or pictures would help people give good advice.

But regardless of the type of machine I would not use a pipe in a area where a spring is designed to go

[jeremy k]

Trip - just for instance - if there was no springs in your truck all the road bumps would shake your truck apart and be a rough ride - same for the springs in a power hammer of all sorts of mechanicals. The head does not know what is moving it back and forth and doesn't care, but the shock of contact needs to be contained by the spring VS. going through the rest of the hammer.

[Trip]

ok, so I guess, I will forget that idea. LOL   Would a car/truck leaf spring work?  I have one in my shop, and I like to use what I have on hand.

[Backwoods Blacksmith]

The rolled eyes and the distance between them have to match the distance between the swivel point on the frame and the attachment on the tup shaft.  Too long and it will over stroke and too short it won't make up.  Rolling the eyes and proper heat treat are essential.   Either have the spring made at your local spring shop or order it as per the directions.  This is not the place to make a mistake.

Also,  do not use the shuttle valve suggested in the directions.  Use a 5 port 2 position glandless valve.[no o rings on the shuttle]  The Norgren valve is not designed for .5 second strokes.  You need one that is rated at 3.6 to 4.6 ccv.  They can be had for the same price as the o ring type.  Norgren does not make one rated for this application.