NovaScotianNorse

Darn it.. I thought I was editing that first reply, but it posted as a new one. I'm removing what was typed above. I could get solid flames on both burners at about 6-10 psi, depending on where I adjusted the air to, but I was able to get both burners to burn a consistently light blue.. although the back burner started quite green for awhile it got up to temp more, than it turned more blue. I noticed on it's side it was WAY more responsive to choke and gas changes, whereas upright it barely did much except respond to gas changes. Should I put the kaowool back around the burner ports? The smell was gone entirely when I ran it last night. I was cautious and was ready to shut down if I noticed anything odd, but it smelled just like a gas forge would, or what I know them to smell like. Also,I just want to confirm that the sound of the propane jets shooting into the tubes is normal. It's like a hissing noise but more resonating, so I know it's in the tubes (plus like I said I've triple checked all connections).

Would these be improved any if I removed the end "plate" with all the holes? I can always cut and file to remove that whole "plate" that covers the end of the nozzle, basically making it the same inner diameter all the way down that nozzle, instead of ending with that hole configuration.. just one big hole basically. I have no problem modifying things to work better if need be.. I tried the burners in the forge last night, on it's side. NO kaowool around the burner ports. Following Frosty's steps above, lighting at 6psi with chokes closed wouldn't light with paper, it kept blowing it out. Using a small hand torch to light it, 6psi put out a big puff of flames that would have singed some hair if I wasn't expecting it from previous experience and used the long stemmed one. Lighting at low psi seems to light a pillowy fire I can turn up. With no kaowool around the burners, ON IT'S SIDE, it won't let me close my firebrick doors. Before I could close to about half an inch or so. Like this if I close them more than part way, I get flames out around the burner ports. Now, the forge does have a back door for forging long stock, but I keep it pulled close. Should I have this cracked slightly? I don't forge long stock atm, so I've kept it close to avoid dragon's breath out the back of the forge.

No worries whatsoever. Language differences don't help matters, and translation is never perfect. I'll try to keep it simplified for translation purposes. Yeah, their info is nonexistent. And I did notice, while the forge was upright, that it had a LOT of dragon's breath that I couldn't avoid without making the burners huff, and it was always a yellowish breath, too. I could never get it any other colour. I have noticed though, that since it's on it's side, the dragon's breath is GREATLY reduced, and looks more like it would on anyone else's forge. Makes perfect sense. I do the 2 psi to light the first burner, with the choke just slightly open, because any higher and it created this giant burst of flames out the door, even with the choke closed off completely. If I did it with just 2psi, and a slight bit of air, it would light the first burner and give me a semi solid flame. I'd increase to about 6psi from there, open the choke on the other burner, and then the ball valve to give it gas. At this point I'd adjust air (with the forge upright, this meant just opening the chokes all the way). With the forge on it's side, I get less of a blast out the door lighting at higher psi. Again, perfect sense. Without the kaowool, even at 6psi, it would sputter flames up around the burner tubes. This would mean I'd need even more pressure, to make sure the flames stay down in the chamber? I hear a lot of people say they run NA burners at higher PSIs than what I've even tried with this (highest I've put the regulator to is ~12psi). I've always run it roughly around 6 because with the chokes full open, it felt like changing PSI meant nothing, and did nothing. Maybe that was my problem. I think I'm going to adapt the forge to run on it's side. Since it's basically just a long rectangle, it just makes it wider now instead of taller. It will keep the burner intakes out of the exhaust from the forge, and it will also help me reduce scaling, since upright the forge only lets me put my steel directly under the burners. On it's side it puts my steel UNDER the flames of the burner, which hit the far wall halfway up. I think this will also make it easier during heat treating, to avoid hot spot issues. Now, when I followed all those steps before.. at 6psi, lighting it would cause a big burst of flame out the door, but then settle into a big billowing orange flame, like a giant cigarette lighter upside down. The minute I open the choke TO ANY SETTING, the flame would go blue like in the pictures above. Changing the choke by any degree made no difference. Opening it all the way up, and keeping PSI to about 6psi gave me a good burn. If I closed off the chokes any, I usually had to very lightly nudge the propane down, but not even a full PSI. This is why I said I felt like the chokes had to be full open with no real benefit. Changing PSI any only made a difference if I turned it down too low without closing off the chokes some. At lower than 6psi, I had to reduce the air going in, or it would start 'huffing'. The only time I had the whistling sound, or any sort of flame popping into the chamber before igniting was once the forge started getting up to temp. At that point, I'd have to increase PSI a little, to keep the flames from doing that. Changing air made no difference, unless it went down TOO low, and then it would give me a billowy flame. I can retry these steps, though. I probably didn't follow this exact process and missed a step when I tried tuning before, so it wouldn't hurt to do it with the list infront of me. However, since I would prefer to adapt to run on it's side, are the steps the same? Or would tuning be different for being on it's side? I'd assume they'd be the same steps. Also, the kaowool around the burners.. still leave it out if it's running on it's side? I took the burners out of the forge, to try a suggestion from up above about the smell. With the burners out of the forge running, there is no 'kerosene' smell like there was with them running in the forge. I could assume the smell then is from volatiles in the forge body that are being burned off due to it being on it's side now, and not upright (heat dispersion different now). The hose from what I'm to understand is rated for propane. It has markings on it indicating an LPG hose. I'll attach a picture. Actually, I'll attach a couple of pictures. The hose and markings. The very end of the burner nozzle, showing Frosty the little holes I mentioned in it. And then some pictures of the burners running. Air chokes were open about a half inch, PSI was set to 10. Two videos of the burners outside of the forge. I'll put them back in later and go from there. This was to test the smell issue. I do notice that while the initial flames are blue and solid, that there's a faint blue-ish yellow "plume" that extends out from around the solid flames. It's very hard to see, so that's why took video. 20240921_170955.mp4 20240921_171117.mp4

Yeah, the galvanized hood shield came off just after those pictures. It was just a test to see if blocking off the exhaust from the forge doors from getting to the air intakes would make a difference, and it was the only piece of steel I had around that wasn't bar stock or 1/4" plate. It did help at the time, but I decided to turn the forge before building a new hood instead. I was wondering about the position of the nozzle in the chamber. I tried backing it off a little when it was upright, but then my flame would turn more billowy and less jet-like. I assumed the little flare in the refractory at the ports was messing with the fuel/air mixing. I can back them off a little now, though, that it's on it's side. They never got red hot, but may have gotten hot enough to burn off anything. I'm not sure exactly what they're made of, but I might guess stainless. The whole tube goes straight down to the nozzle end, but the nozzle end is a like.. step up, not a smooth flare, it has a ring of small holes around the main hole at the end of the nozzle. I think the tubes are 1", the nozzle end is probably 1.5" (I'd have to pull them out to measure). I've heard mixed answers about blocking off around the burner ports with kaowool. I tried without the kaowool when it was upright, but I would get flames up around the burners, so I put it back. Yes, I can close my doors until there's about an inch to an inch and half of a gap.. any further and she huffs out. The bricks are also like 1/4" from the actual front of the forge, so there's a gap at the sides and top as well (bricks are in a U channel). It leaves me enough room to move stock between them, only having to move them to get tongs through. I haven't tried with the doors closed on it's side yet. It would make sense that the odor came from other volatiles, as yes.. the run on its side got it WAY hotter than before (I doubted before if I could have got to forge welding temps, now I think I could easily). You're right though, I don't plan to frig around too much with a smell I can't pinpoint. I do *try* to be safe. ADHD brain doesn't help, but I do try lol

Thanks for answering, Frosty, and glad to be here. Odd that it's almost the exact same.. I'm positive I've never posted about this before. Silly doppelganger I guess. I have been through here a few times checking for various answers, but never really gave it a full dig. I'm stubborn, it's a toxic trait of mine. I'll go through that section with a fine toothed comb. Some clarification though? So I still have the original jet in it (although they sent a replacement set with it, was tempted to replace them and start new even though the ones on it when I got it are only darkened, not damaged). The regulator when I got the kit was fully 'closed' when I put the knob on it (aka, it was loose, and wouldn't allow any propane through). When you say to "open it up all the way, then half way", you mean the regulator? Or the air choke? Normally when I light, I light it at like 2psi with a little air, then increase both to get a flame on one burner, then open the valve and air to the second (second burner is connected THROUGH the first with a ball valve, they aren't two separate controls.. downside to a prefabbed burner and forge).. once the second burner is lit, I usually adjust propane and air until I got a steady flame. I always did have a yellow-ish flame plume around the blue flames when thr forge was initially upright. I don't get that now that it's on it's side.. just straight blue flames. Another question.. should I put it back upright, so the burners are on top again? Or leave it on it's side, with the burners going horizontally? This was the forge before I turned it on it's side. You can see the chokes on the burners are fully opened, and that's where they needed to be to run.. anything lower and she'd start sputtering and acting weird after a few minutes. Turning on it's side now allows me to choke off the air so much more than that and still keep a solid blue flame.

Okay, so I know what propane smells like (I know.. mercaptan). This isn't it. It smells like a kerosene lamp, or propane/kerosene heater. Some details. I bought a 'latchkey' forge off Amazon, Simond Store brand. Retangular, so it's taller than it is wide.. two burner, top down venturi design (the specific kind that has a screw down flat cover ontop of the intake bell that has the jet nozzle). Has a back door I keep closed. I've had issues with this since I got it, always feeling like I had to open the air chokes all the way, just to get it to run right. I usually run it at about 6-7 psi (otherwise it would sputter the burners), but the chokes were always pretty solidly open. I would also get a fair amount of backpressure at times, and had been messing with having and not having kaowool around the burner intakes, sealing them off. I tried reducing the height of the intake bell, since it was so tall, moving the air intake closer to the propane jet (It's a brass nozzle with a 0.035" hole.. I checked and it lets the same size welding wire slide through, barely). This seemed to help a little, and I could keep the burners running pretty good. I'd also hear this hissing sound from the burners, which I assumed was the sound of the propane jet shooting propane and doing it's thing. Yes, I've TRIPLE checked all my connections, valves, etc with soapy water. There are no leaks. Someone suggested I turn it on it's side, so that the burners were pointed horizontally instead of vertically, so I did. Well, right off the bat, I had to turn the propane down to about 3-4psi, and choke off a good portion of the air (otherwise it would shoot little balls of propane into the chamber and ignite it there), otherwise it was gonna sweat me out. The difference was night and day. This is where this new problem has started. The smell of 'kerosene'. I still hear the hissing noise from the jets, and if I put my noise right where the air intake choke is, and sniff hard, I can smell the mercaptan in the propane, but it's very faint. I assume it's a faint smell of the propane before it actually ignites in the tube. But everywhere else in the shop I smell that.. kerosene heater/lamp kind of smell. My 'shop' is a 12'x20' "portable garage", with all 4 windows open, the main door fully open, and the back door unzipped on one side. I have a fan that blows along the ceiling, and one on the ground/floor. Any thoughts? Normal? Dangerous? Should I just give up entirely? (not happening there, but I AM getting discouraged at doing more fiddling than forging). I can take pictures/videos of the forge tomorrow if it helps. My flames are both nice blue, solid. At the new psi/air intake, the extend about halfway across the chamber. There was some swirling orange flames when I first lit it, but I assumed that was the piece of paper I used to light it not fully combusting and burning off in the forge. Please let me know. Thanks, Nova