tim likuwit

7 hours ago, Glenn said:

To speed up your current process, make the product in batches, not one at a time.

They heat, bulge, punch, shape and cool down one end at the time. Currently they are punching and shaping using different machines. These tool changes that make the production slow.   Do one full days production with tooling set up #1. If you heat, bulge, punch, shape both ends with the same tooling, then do a full days production run on the left end, and the following day a full days production run on the right end. This should speed things up considerably as you are only doing one process. 

They are doing a batch production and they want less labour work with more efficient production. They are producing max of 1000 per batch and minimum of 200 per batch. They want to change this batch production as  much to flow production if possible. The whole process goes from  heating, forging, flash is removed and a hole is punched in the ends, bars are placed into furnace and then shaped to customer requirements, oil quenched, checked for quality, tempered and another quality control test,  coldwork to correct movement during heat treatment, shot-peened, painted, machined, bushed and packed. I'm focusing on the forging stage in this batch production. 

9 hours ago, Frosty said:

Tim: So far you've asked a very non specific question looking for a specific answer. That can't happen in any meaningful way. You are also avoiding telling us where you are., That's 2.

You keep repeating your question parsed slightly differently as if that makes a difference. That's 3

Right now you claim it takes 90 minutes to make one sway bar. Having read your posts to date I believe THAT is accurate.

You'd LIKE to reduce production time to 1 minute? Wouldn't anybody who builds parts as demanding as sway bars! #4

Look, we get what you're asking but there are a few problems giving you meaningful answers. Those are answers that have anything to do with reality or practicality. Something you can actually do.

The most advanced manufacturers on EARTH can't do what you want to, not without using metals so advanced the sway bars would cost more than the vehicle BEFORE it was made.

Yeah, you can do the hot forging on one machine. Learn what's actually involved in the process and take your pick, there are a number of possibilities. Unfortunately you don't know enough to ask questions that CAN be answered. You don't know enough to know how little you know. I think that's a summation so I won't mark it #5.

Adding up the obvious points I have to believe #1, In what ever country you live you do not have the technical base to manufacture high strength forgings competitively. #2, You personally don't have any real connection to whoever wants to try making a living making sway bars. It sounds more like a contest with a "grand Prize" awarded for whoever invents a needed thing. In this case a way to magically make sway bars in under 1 minute instead of 90 minutes. I know you said the "forging" but seem to think half an hour to cool properly isn't part of the forging process.

I'm not telling you to go away, I'm telling you what you ask can't be answered for the above reasons. First you won't reveal where you are so we MIGHT be able to point you in the right direction. Secondly You don't know enough to ask an answerable question nor enough to understand the answer if it dropped in your lap. Lastly you're asking for a virtual impossibility.

Like I say we'd like to help but we can't.

Frosty The Lucky.

 

Sorry I'm new to this. Sorry if my questions are not right.

17 minutes ago, jlpservicesinc said:

If you are doing one size rod.. all you need is 1 die with 3 stations (dies sunk) on it..    One for roughout, 2nd for punch and 3rd for flash.. You could get away with a 2 station die but you would need to figure out proper flow dynamics to do this and it would mean a larger hammer to do more work at one blow.. 

How much money does the company have to invest in new tooling?   A 3 station die on a large enough drop hammer would take less then a minute. 3 Hits and it would be finished..  Maybe 5 seconds total per end.. 

One of the problems with this kind of operation is the extra investment in tooling, furnaces, and man power.. 

What are the cycle times from start to finish now? 

What size are the bars?    Key factor missing.. 

There is no way to hand forge for production as fast as closed dies.. 

Its the process for solid sway bars which uses hot forging. I'm researching about their initial stage of their process. They're taking about 90 minutes for the whole process from start to finish. Finish as in until packaging. The forging process they're doing is slow because they heat, bulge, punch, shape and cool down one end at the time. The cooling time is about half an hour and they cool down both ends first before going to the next machine in the overall process.

55 minutes ago, Frosty said:

Welcome aboard Tim, glad to have you. If you'll put your general location in the header it will be a BIG help answering your questions.

You're obviously not asking as a hobbyist or a guy helping a friend make custom sway bars for his dune buggy. Sounds to me like you want to start a business maybe making custom sway bars.

What you describe is a job for a closed die forging hammer or press, a very serious piece of equipment with a long list of support equipment and tools necessary to put to work. Heck to do it right you need to start from below ground up that kind of hammer or press needs the right kind of foundation under it. Heck you have to be in the right place to even be considered for a permit to run such tools.

If you just want to make a set or two then learn to forge and learn the processes and techniques necessary to make what you want. 

Frosty The Lucky.

I'm actually helping out a factory to produce 1 sway bar per minute as my project at University. Currently they are punching and shaping using different machines. These tool changes that make the production slow. That is why I'm finding out if there is a machine that have tool changes with combined punching end hole and shaping the end. Both ends that is.

46 minutes ago, jlpservicesinc said:

For high performance sway bars most are hollow tube with heim joints on the ends or TIG welded assemblies.    If  your are looking because you have broken one.. Just go to the scrappers and pull one.. 

Ideally we all need more information to give you the best information.. 

This production is for solid sway bars which uses hot forging. The company wants to produce 1 sway bar per minute. Currently they are punching half way through to make a hole at the end, then remove the flash, and finally punch the hole all the way though. Is there a machine that have both processes combined (punching and shaping)? and does punching and shaping at the same time will damage the die? how can this be reduced?

Is there a machine that is both combined with punching hole and shaping the ends of sway bars process during hot forging? Where can I get this machine? What is the size dimensions of this machine?