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I Forge Iron

^MG

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  1. Well, I have found the author of the article on-line. I really didn't want to do something potentially illegal by scanning a copy of the article and posting it without the proper permission. I just got done e-mailing the gentleman and told him about the thread. I hope that he comes and checks it out and can possibly put up the article himself. I can tell you that the process of carburizing and heat treating on that anvil took place at Inland Northwest Metallurgical Services, Inc. It shows the business in the picture. From the looks of it, I'd say that they qualify as one of those places that has a lab with all that fancy equipment. Just a guess. Hopefully the author will visit this site so that all of the questions can be answered.
  2. After reading the thread concerning the $300 I beam for sale as an anvil, another thought has occurred to me. It is quite possible that the farrier anvils that I have been working on for years are made more hard that real anvils that real smiths use because it is expected that lug nuts like myself will beat the xxxx out of a good anvil LOL. Just kidding a bit, poking fun at myself.... last comment not meant to offend any anvil makers, farriers, or even real lug nuts for that matter.
  3. The article in particular that I am talking about is in the July/August 2006 issue of the Professional Farrier magazine. It is currently the official publication of the American Farriers Association. The article is titled "FIRE! A Shop, An Anvil, & Family Heirlooms", written by Scott Davidson, CJF. It might well be that after reading the article that you find that it might not have been necessary to carburize the anvil. After all, I am just a farrier myself, and wouldn't consider myself a smith. I am always looking to increase my skills on the anvil, as it is a huge portion of my job. In the farrier world, there are far better than myself at forgework. At the end of the day, this whole Q and A deal that I have been privileged to participate in has taught me much about anvils, metallurgy, and how not to treat an anvil. If you can get your hands on a copy of this article, I would be curious to hear your thoughts. It just happens that I try to keep all old magazines and journals associated with my trade and remembered this article in question. That is what got me to thinking about this whole thing. I now understand that my anvil doesn't need carburizing and I also understand why. The important thing is that I learned. Hope to hear from you soon Thanks Matt Grimm
  4. Thanks for the info, I am going to try to check these links out.
  5. I hear exactly what you are saying. I guess my fears about denting this anvil are partly due to the fact that I have been working on farrier style JHM's and Future anvils. I have found that I don't really have that many dings on either of those farrier style anvils after years of bending horseshoes. I am wondering if these PW are a bit softer than the other anvils that I have been working on, and thereby exposing my lack of hammer control. Just the thought that crosses my mind. thanks for the input Matt
  6. I like the way you look at things! Thanks Matt
  7. Thanks for the vinegar idea, it worked great. I put atatched some pictures to another reply that I made. The pictures aren't as clear as in real life, but you can kinda make out the line in the pics. As I replied to another gentleman on here, there is 3/8 of an inch of steel left on top of my anvil. That was very good news for me.
  8. Evidently, the anvil the article was written about had been so hot in the fire that the surface was decarbonized. That must have been the reason that the anvil was carburized and then subsequently heat treated. The article didn't say, but I'm betting that there was some coal close enough the the anvil in that fire to get it hot enough to cook the carbon out of the surface. I am positive however that this was the procedure used in the article. It has pictures of the entire process. Might I digress, I have some very good news (for me anyway). After wire wheeling the area where I thought there might be a face plate weld and subsequently pouring a little vinegar over that area there is a clear delineation of where there is most definitely face left. I will attach pics. The face that is left on it is approximately 3/8 of an inch thick. My initial reaction is that it is not ideal but ok. Now I have to figure out if I want to find out how much it would cost to get the thing heat treated to bring it back to a good level of hardness or try to get someone to help build up the face. Take a look at the pics and tell me what you think. If you think the face is too thin then I will go the latter route. If you feel that the face is sufficient then I will examine my options. My research has turned up a few places not too far from me that specialize in heat treating. Well anyway, take a look at these pics. Interestingly, there are numbers that have turned up on the feet of the anvil, all the way down at the bottom. On one side there is a number 3 on a foot and on the other side there is a number 7. Could this be from the casting when Peter made his anvils out of 2 pieces or do these marks have some other significance. Not really important in the grand scheme of things. I'd just like to know as much about this anvil as I can. Once again thanks for your time.
  9. I am in Lynchburg VA. As per the request of one of the other members that responded, I got in touch of my friend where my anvil is currently sleeping, and asked him to put a little vinegar at the point where we believe there may be some top plate left. I will have more answers for everyone once I know how much, if any, top plate is left. I suppose that I need to know that info before I proceed any further. I hope to have that info soon. Also, the next time that I get up to my buddies shop, I will take some pics. I have been reading several of the threads on anvil repair. Wow, there is a veritable cornucopia on info out there (he he I said cornucopia) on anvil repair. So much in fact that my head is kinda spinning. Thanks again to all that have responded, hope to hear from ya'll soon. Matt Grimm
  10. Well, my lack of knowledge here is catching up with me. I am hoping to get some clarification on your last suggestion. You though that my best bet would be to reface the anvil with hardfacing electrode. When you use the term "hardfacing electrode" are you referring to stick welding the anvil with hard facing rod over the entire face and then having it milled flat again, or is that another technique that I am not familiar with. Thanks for your time, I really appreciate it
  11. Well all, thanks all for your time and consideration of this matter. I hate like crazy that I may have hurt this anvil. I still have yet to determine if there is any face plate left on the anvil. I hope to do so the next time that I get a chance to go up to my buddy's shop where the anvil is currently sleeping. I am sure that it would be much easier and cheaper to just get another anvil. The crux of the matter is that the anvil was given to me by a dear friend in the confidence that I would keep it forever and take care of it. I feel a tremendous sense of responsibility to my friend, his grandfather, and the anvil itself. The whole idea of carburizing the anvil came to me in a journal article about a farrier from Wyoming that had had a real bad fire in his shop. The fire was so intensely hot that it softened his Hay Budden. He was able to get the anvil carburized to 50 rockwell and return it to its original hardness. I understand that my anvil situation is quite different than his. Not only are the anvils made of different raw materials, my face plate may be gone. Also, to answer the gentleman that asked if I had the anvil faced by a milling machine or had someone take a grinder to it, the answer is that a milling machine took the belly out until the face was flat and plainer. That was a friend of a friend that owed me a favor kind of situation. To answer the other question posed to me, "If there is still face plate left on top, why have it carburized when it is already carbon steel?" The answer to that question is because if there is some steel left on the face, it is soft. I dinged the face of the anvil 2 times as I was rounding some heel checks into a few horseshoes that I was making and it dimpled the face a bit. This suggests to me that the anvil is softer than my everyday anvil that I use to modify keg shoes. That anvil is 48 rockwell, and I haven't hardly hurt the surface at all after years of use. The PW that I would like to get working is far superior for hand making shoes than the flat horned everyday anvil that I use daily. Possibly I can come up with a resolution to this by continuing to read what all you folks have to say. Thanks to all that have replied to my post. Don't feel shy about pitching in a few more words that may help me.
  12. Ok so here's the deal. Years ago I was given, yes given, a Peter Wright anvil. It was given to me just as I completed horseshoeing school by a dear friend. You see, it was his grandfathers anvil. His grandfather must have turned hundreds of shoes on this anvil, because it had bellys in the horn. The face also had quite a belly in it. Not knowing proper anvil loving etiquette, I foolishly had the anvil faced. The level of the face is still above the steps but I can't seem to find a definite weld line as to where the top plate ends and the wroght begins. I can tell you that the face that exists today is pretty soft regardless of what material it is. A couple slight mis-strikes with a hammer yielded a couple nice dimples. I have been working on fixing the horn recently, and have been doing pretty well. I have not yet been able to get to the point where I can put a hard facing weld on it, as I am not that far along yet. My questions for the masses are 1) If there is still some steel from the top plate left and it is just simply soft, can I send it somewhere to be carburized, and 2) If the top plate was completely removed and now my face is only wrought iron, can the wrought iron face be carburized to a decent Rockwell hardness? My initial thought is that wrought iron is a ferrous metal so it should be able to be carburized, but I don't know how the silica in the iron will affect that process. I'd love to bring this anvil back to life after I foolishly hurt it. Any ideas gang?
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