wdoyle1980

I've checked online for some of those courses and did see the one in Prescott. Not much in the area of Santa Barbara, CA The university and city colleges have more wood-working than metal-machining. I don't think UCSB or SBCC have anything in the realm of machinist courses. Prescott's kinda far and would only work for me if they have a weekends-only course. My jewelry casting instructor has a lathe that he's let me use with him, but the mill is currently in storage. I'd be nice to be able to do some apprenticing under someone that is willing to help and foster good habits. As I said above, I wasn't against spending the $40 or so for gauges, nor do I think they're unnecessary. I guess I was just trying to opine that I didn't think they were 'as important' in a rimmed cartridge as they would be on a round that headspaces on the shoulder or casemouth.

Maybe I'm missing something. Is there some kind of 'old-world' definition of 'zip gun' you're operating off of, or just being crabby? This is a 'zip gun': Note the crude barrel, probably lacking rifling, < 2" barrel (again, probably no rifling, making this a smoothbore pistol firing a cartridge = illegal), and lack of a trigger/sear engagement area. This example is illegal and is the basis of the 'zip gun' definition for the BATF and most states that define 'zip gun' in their legislature. If you call anything I make a 'zip gun' again, when it is clearly not, you will force me to contact the administrators to have your posts removed. Are you merely saying that I suck and make crappy things and therefore == 'zip' guns? You're simply likening my crappy ability to cut metal as pretty as you do with some immigrant gangmember stuffing a 12ga shell into some plumbing pipe? awesome. I honestly don't see anything I'm doing as dangerous or illegal as to what you're hinting. Have a nice day, sir.

As promised: video of *scary* Weaponeer build. This is *not* my build, but compares how much safer mine is YouTube - BlowbAK Pistol

HAH - in fact, since you're a weaponeer fan, maybe I should show you a user's project where he made a nice AK-style 7.62x25 pistol that used 8x rubber bands as a recoil spring. I'm sure you'd feel a nice tightening in your chest after watching that one. You'd probably shart your jorts over that guy - make my project look like something popped out from JMBrowning.

Also, please for the love of god, do NOT call this a ZIP gun. It is NOT, by both Federal and State definitions. It is a full length, commercially/professionally rifled barrel, with a commercially manufactured bolt. It is a single-shot bolt action with a trigger/sear from a 'proven' action, like the MN9130. It's not a bic-pen with a spring and a 22lr loaded into it. Again, you seem to show your bias. I admit that I need more work (and more professional tools). Thank you for your concern and worry. I look forward to being able to say that I've been doing this for years, as well. I'm sure everyone started somewhere. Gunsmiths looking for apprentices seem to be fading out, as with most metalworking jobs being moved overseas or polit-pressure causing plants/workshops to shut down.

Rich, that is a good idea. While I would like to do the project, I'm not 'dead set' on doing it to spite anyone's opinions. I would like to have something in a larger, straight-cased, rimmed, caliber for ease in headspacing and design. What I liked about this cartridge is that the modern-production barrel will support both black powder and smokeless powder loads - giving me some versatility in my loads. The pressures listed by SAAMI seem to be in the 'safer' range, rather than something like .30-06 or 7.62x39/54. I would like to see a live-firing of the .45-70.

I guess you don't really hold back your opinions, huh? Well, the receiver tube is 1/4" hardened 4130 chromoly steel. The barrel and bolt are both factory (and factory headspaced and hardened - again, rimmed rounds are headspaced on the rim itself - it's more of a matter of 'hold it fcking hard against what it's butting into", but you know that already). While the finish is sloppy - yes, I used a HF drill as a 'mill' and that's about as blasphemous as it gets in a metalworking forum, but I live in a shiatty 1000sf apartment with access to minimum tooling. I use what I can. While it may be 'just a little rimfire', the chamber pressure of the 22wrf is 19,000psi and the 22wrm is 24,000psi. The 45/70 is rated for max pressure of 28,000psi. This roughly puts the 22wrm and 45/70 in the same 'ballpark', as opposed to the 45,000psi of the 7.62x39 and other rifle rounds. The 4130 at this thickness was more than enough for the 22 rimfire rounds and should be plenty for the 45/70. Even in an annealed state, the 4130 should give me a tensile strength of about 81,000psi and yield of 52,000psi. In my bolt action design, the bolt cams up very tight against the breech face. Yes, there is a big-ugly open spot in the weld where the tigger housing butts up to the receiver. I hope to fill that with weld and grind smooth. For the 45-70 I had purchased 2.5" solid 4140 rods to be drilled and tapped to accept the barrel. I assumed that at this rod-thickness, I can definitely get the amount of material needed to have a strong hold on the barrel and to hold the breech , whether a bolt with lugs or a falling/rolling block, in place. I strive to ensure a safe environment with my test-fires. Even with my welded-AK kit rifle, I sandbagged it and stood behind a solid wall to shield from shrapnel in case of KB, and fired by string. I'm not one of the 'nuts' running out to homedepot to buy galvanized fence posts and copper tubing out to make a rifle. It's a shame that you merely brushed off my attempt as just a kid's tinkering. I'm sorry that the work of this 'kid' doesn't match up to the rifles you have made when you were my age. If I were in your position, I might have been inclined to help with the project and offer some encouraging words and designs, while still enforcing strong safety policies. For someone that posts 'all the time' on weaponeer, I would have pegged you for that type. I didn't see this handle on that forum. I guess I should just hike down my pants, go watch some Kanye videos, and play with my iphone like you'd expect all us kids to do. It's no wonder the progressives are winning-over all them 'techie' kids who think gun-owners are crabby old republicans. Do you spray kids for running on your lawn, too? ;-)

Here is a link to my post on weaponeer.net (sorry for the cross-post): Weaponeer Forums It's a 22wmr bolt-action build. Used the barrel and bolt from an Armscor 22wmr, the trigger and sear from the MN9130, and a homemade walnut stock from 3x3" table leg blanks doweled, shaped, stained, and sealed. I have a few other projects going simultaneously over there, but not many pictures posted yet.

I'm meeting with my metal-casting instructor tonight and will ask him about putting some time in on his lathe and see if we can cut the threads to match that barrel.

I have welded kits before, that's not too biggy since it used commercial barrels and bolts/breeches. My last homebuilt project for weaponeer.net was a 22wmr/22wrf. All of my builds utilize commercial barrels. The 22wrm used commercial barrel+ bolt from armscor. This time, I am looking to do a homebuilt break-open or falling-block design, or a re-take on a Springfield trapdoor modeled from an original Trapdoor receiver and breechblock that I want to recreate in 4130/4140. I have ordered some 3" round 4140 Chromoly Steel from onlinemetals. I use 4130 or 4140 for all of my builds. They're saying about 35 Rockwell C hardness for their heat treating. that should be more than enough tensile and yield strength to hold the barrel in place during firing. The barrel is new-production, so it can handle both the blackpowder and smokeless power loads. The barrel is already chambered for the .45-70 and the resized cartridge seats its rim right up against the barrel-notch for it. There shouldn't bee a need to headspace that, but I don't have an aversion to picking up a $30 set of gauges. I should be able to design my bolt/breech to hold that cartridge in this position, up against the face of the barrel. I like rim headspaced cartridges for that reason Unlike 30-06 or 308s that headspace off of the shoulder. My line of questions stems from the fact that all of the barrels (new/old) I have worked with have National Fine or National Fine or National Coarse threading and typically of a standard tap size. I have limited lathe experience and limited to mostly contouring and squaring; threaded once, but with a tap locked in the tailstock. I don't think you're being crass/rude - this is a blacksmith forum, not a gunsmithing forum. You just see a person <30yrs old talking about making home-built rifles. I think you had a good reason for concern. My peeps over at weaponeer.net haven't been to helpful in getting me info regarding square-form threading assistance.

The receiver material I'm using (or planning to use) has been pre-treated. I'm not very good at heat treating, so I'd rather spend more time cutting (slowly) than to cut fast and have to be more certain of my heat-treating abilities. I'm pretty sure (and looking at the barrel+empty brass for .45-70) that the round headspaces on the rim, much like a 357mag. I don't have the go/no gos, but they're easy to get from Midway and might just pick them up in a bit to 'be certain'. I do not have the chamber reamer, no and shouldn't need it unless I need to change the whole rear of the barrel (cut-off then re-chamber the whole barrel). I'm not familiar with creating a tool bit for threading. I've only used taps/dies to create threads. I've used a lathe once (with my instructor) to bore a sleeve for another barrel for use in another single-shot build (.223 remington).

This is a 'new' repro barrel from numrich gun parts co. This is not an *original* 189X barrel - so i'm pretty sure this is a 'standard' threading (of SOME kind). I checked close with magnifying glass and they do not appear trapezoidal or angular (like in buttress). They appear pretty straight-wall Square Form. This is a new-production barrel labeled with Marlin script and model/caliber (45-70). There are no date stamps, but this barrel is in 'amazing' conditions and has no scratches in bore (it's new) and was like $40 on e-gunparts ;-) It's the weekend and I'm a bit lazy to try to call Marlin on the phone (they'll just tell me to call a 'smith, i'm sure ) . Maybe I'll try to bother them first thing Monday morning If I can't find the tap, and can't get the toolbit to do it on a lathe, I'll probably just lathe off the threads, drill a hole in my home-made receiver and press-fit and try to silver-solder it in place (or just rethread with an available die for barrel, tap for receiver

They don't have a posted email address on their 'contact us' page. I took down their ph # and maybe will give them a call during my lunch/breaks.

Yes. Good call. That thought came across to me this morning when I woke up I think I got your message via dream Thanks. I'll let you know how it turns out.

well, i measured from the barrel itself; it's in the first post. Pitch (1.00 / tpi ) == (1.00 / 12tpi) == 0.0833 I can't determine what tap size to get from the minor-diam @ 0.715" and where to find Square-form threads. These do not appear to be Acme threads or buttress (square on one side, angled on the other). I've only really had experience with the National Standard Coarse/Fine threads. I assume that I could use a tap from NSF/NSC but that it would need to be a bit bigger to allow for the square threads to engage as much as possible. I would need to do this if i couldn't locate a square-form tap or if I can't get anyone to lathe those threads for me. :(