Help! Mystery Substances

[mutant]

Hey everyone,
About ten years ago, I purchased a few different materials for my metal casting hobby and forgot to label them. Fast forward to the present day, and I want to build a propane forge. I could have sworn that I bought cast-able refractory, but I can't tell which of my mystery substances is just that. So far, it's been suggested that I add water to each substance and see how they react. I have a video up and would appreciate any insight.

I believe I have bentonite clay, fine sand, and cast-able refractory. What is what? I don't know.

Thanks!

-m

 

 

[Buzzkill]

My guess is B is your castable refractory, C is the bentonite clay.  A and D do not appear familiar to me.

However, testing is not too difficult.  Take a small amount of each, add water, and mix.   The castable refractory (assuming it's water setting) will set up fairly quickly - a few minutes to an hour.  The bentonite clay should distribute the water equally throughout the material and become mud-like.  It will not get hard or dry out quickly.  Sand should not give you hard substance or a mud.

Hope that helps.

[JHCC]

Remember also that castable refractory has a shelf life; once you open the bag, the clock is ticking. A lot depends on the specific material, but I believe the shelf life for Kastolite 30 is 12 months.

[Frosty]

Testing is easy, as John says mix a little of each with water and see. The refractory will set hard like concrete. 

Boy Buzz, is that a typo or are you just off this morning?

C appears to have an aggregate component making it the refractory.

A&B are probably different grades or types of bentonite, there are hundreds. Bentonite is a pretty common clay and is mined and processed to different standards in a number of countries. A common European pottery additive is called "Bentone" and has specific qualities. Broad categories are drill mud, green sand binders, ceramic or pottery clay conditioners, cosmetics, medicinal including animal feed, pond sealants. The uses are so varied a person could spend months or maybe years exploring them.

The smell raises my eyebrows but who knows, it could be the clay itself or maybe some happy organism living in the mine, processing plant, spilled chocolate milk, who knows. 

Buying off Ebay opens you up to products from people with zero knowledge of what they're selling. An enterprising person sees a sack of bentonite in the garden shed or uncle Fud's basement or a pottery shop and having seen folks selling it decides to offer it on Ebay. Anybody can make up an official sounding name. 

The drill mud I have most experience with ranged from very pale gray to a pale tan-ish gray. It has a distinct smell but not strong nor strange, mild earthy but distinct once you know it. 

So, my vote is A&B = bentonite. C= refractory and D= fine sand. Test C anyway, 1/4c and enough water to wet it and close it in a tupperware container for a couple hours.

Bentonite will be hard to get to mix unless you really drench it with water but given a couple few hours the moisture will even out. Get it very wet and it's the slimiest, slipperiest, smoothest stuff you've ever felt, think smooth gravy. Don't try it but you can get bentonite mud in your eyes with no discomfort or damage, it's mud wrestling mud for that reason. 

Frosty The Lucky.

[JHCC]

10 minutes ago, Frosty said:

Testing is easy, as John says

Credit where credit is due: that was Buzzkill, not me.

[Frosty]

ARGHH, Right you are! Sorry Buzz you suggested testing.

Frosty The Lucky.

[Irondragon Forge ClayWorks]

First of all I love your video. Welcome to my world of mystery stuff. I have 50 lb bags of different powder clay left over from our pottery days and have no idea which are which. My wife usually can ID it because she is the potter and blacksmith.

Like others have said A, does look like Bentonite to me. B, for some reason reminds me of Satanite a castable refractory and C, also looks like castable refractory, may be bubble alumina based. D, ya probably the fine sand also used in making fire clay. When we built our propane forge we used Satanite as a first layer of refractory with a coating of bubble alumina over that.

Like others have said testing is the best way to determine which is which.

Oh and don't write off the old Ford engine, if the Marvel Mystery oil doesn't free up the pistons. When I used to restore old Jeeps a friend of mine gave me an old CJ2a Hurricane engine that hadn't been run in decades and it was frozen up solid. I squirted Marvel Mystery oil in the spark plug holes and let it sit for about a week and it was still frozen. I then made a 50/50 mixture of Dexron II automatic transmission fluid and Acetone. I squirted a liberal amount in the spark plug holes and by the next day, I could bar the engine over from the crankshaft pulley. It was still a little stiff, so I repeated the procedure and let it sit for a couple of days. To make a long story short, that engine went into an old Jeep that needed an engine and with draining the crank case and new oil  it started right up.

[mutant]

Thanks Everyone for your suggestions. Is this all for naught? I had know idea that cast-able refractory has a shelf life. The stuff that I might have is a good 8-10 years old. I'll definitely do the water test since I was given that suggestion by several people commenting on the video as well.

 

Hey irondragon Thanks for the insight on what I can do to the seized engine. I did pull the valve covers, sprayed everything with Kroil and it's going to sit for another month. I was planning on doing  50/50 of diesel and ATF and pour it right down the carb next time but I'll give your recipe a shot. I don't know if you seen them but I have two videos about the truck. I pulled it from a collapsed barn.

Edited April 29, 2022 by Mod30
Remove @name tag

[Frosty]

Some do some don't, Kast O Lite's shelf life refers to industrial performance specs and not as relevant to home shop requirements. Still, it's not good forever. I don't know anything about the refractory you have, maybe see how the test batch stands up to a oxy acet torch. High yellow is about what you can expect in a propane forge so going hotter than that isn't helpful.

Frosty The Lucky.