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ToAuto 12KG Furnace, Heating Issues


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Just got some replacement parts from the company I ordered from as the first crucible was basically useless after 4 pours, and the torch was misaligned and not assembled correctly. Was getting aluminum up to temp to melt but taking approximately an hour to do so. It would "soften" brass and allow me to get a "mass" of brass at the bottom after giving up and cooling, luckily it came right out of the crucible after cooling. The new regulator they sent is faulty as it sounds funky xx xxx xxxx when hooked up, but I'm going to message them and hopefully get another replacement regulator. 

 

I will say they did throw in an extra 6kg crucible, Regulator Hose, 113ml Mold on top of the Replacement torch and crucible. So that made me happy. Maybe with tweaking I can re-align the first torch and fix the problem and make a second furnace. 

 

It would work the first time I set it up but since then it hasn't gotten to temp once properly.

If there is anyone in my area who could help I would definitely appreciate it.

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Edited by Mod30
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In my experience, not getting up to temp is either a burner issue, or propane pressure issue. What PSI are you running the propane? 
My God, that crucible is after four uses? I’d be pretty insistent on either returning it all, or being made “whole” somehow. 
 

I dig the overall design of the foundry, the port for the torch is a bit wonky, but that doesn’t mean it’s not functional. Burner aim is a very forgiving part of the whole equation. 
 

I’m thinking you’re getting about 10psi, or the air is really choked off. I’ve had the mass of brass after a three hour “melt” and it’s crazy frustrating. We can sort this out, I think. 

A couple questions:

1- Did you break in your crucible properly? Heat it up to red and let it cool organically. 
2- I don’t see a pressure gauge on the propane line at the regulator, so you may not know the pressure. Never understood making a high pressure regulator without putting a gauge on it. Do you have a method of determining PSI? 

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1. That first crucible was like that almost out of the box. The bottom where it looks like it fell apart was like that from unboxing. I have made sure to break in each crucible I've had by doing the red hot and let it cool in my furnace. 

 

2. Oh I know. I always wondered why they would sell a 30psi adjustable regulator without a psi gauge, but I am planning on getting one with a psi gauge shortly.

 

Any extra pictures of Links for video I can provide if needed. Really looking forward to not having to use my electric for my brass and copper right now. I have waaaay to much to do little 2kg pours lol.

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A friend bought a burner online, and we sat there for 3 hours at full blast trying to melt copper. I kept telling him, the burner isn't getting it hot enough. Fortunately, I had my spare brass parts with me, and he had a bunch of scrap pipe, so we made one on the spot. Nothing special, 3/4" x 6" with a bell flare. Melted copper in 20min, no problem. Turned out it was the T on his burner, 3/4" x 3/4" x 3/4".

2 hours ago, ThomasPowers said:

Also be sure the burner is running reducing as an oxidizing blast will eat a crucible fast.  I didn't see much room in that furnace for the hot gasses to get all the way around the crucible.  Have you tried it with a smaller crucible?

I'm going to second this. There appears to be about 3/4" of space or less between the crucible and the wall, that's pretty tight, and a lot of direct heat on the crucible. 

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There is actually about an inch between furnace wall and that crucible and yes I have a smaller one. They sent me two very nice replacements after I ordered a second one for safety sake anyways.

 

I just picked up a newer regulator setup as well seeing as I plan on making a second furnace once I have some experience under my belt.

So far I have been messing with aluminum. I have an electric I use right now for brass and copper. Here are my replacement crucibles and some small ingots I've poured.

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What type of tongs do you use for getting the crucible out of the furnace? When we were doing pottery, I made several long tongs to get stuff out of the kiln without any damage to the pottery. If I remember correctly the long one is about 40 inches long and the one on the far left is a pair of hammer tongs.

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Nice! I dig the ingots, that's always good to see. Regarding the foundry, let us know what pressure you're getting. Also, thanks for the correction on the space in your foundry, I was looking at the pictures on my phone which adds an odd perspective. 

Regarding tongs, I followed this guide to make some:

 

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Those Lyman lead ingot molds for bullet casting come in pretty handy.:) I've used everything from muffin tins, bread pans and corn shaped cornbread pans. When ever we are out checking yard sales/junk shops, I always look for any cast iron pans to pick up for a reasonable price.

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Thanks Irondragon, they most definitely did for my first ingots. It saved me some money on start up. Have so e people buying the ingots and I get my scrap brass as like 1.60/lb Canadian.

 

CNC machinists and Knife Makers seem to like having ingots to melt or work.

 

Just got my new regulator so I can keep an eye on pressures of my gas. Gonna be doing some brass with a decent reducing flame. I have some us pennies for my zinc loading before I pour if I end up burning it off. I haven't had much issues with it so far.

 

Everything is outside although I could probably use some better PPE than running shoes and jeans. I have a denim apron probably gonna switch to cowhide but honestly I prefer topless it's weird I like the feeling of the radiant crucible heat on.my belly.

My tongs are about 24 Inch and like your first design I right now am doing an rested tilt pour with the same ones as I am prepping to make a proper set of lift8ng and pouring tongs from that same video.

 

I watch BigStackD a lot and have had an interest in melting since I was like 12. Saw the mini metal furnace on king of random and have been hooked ever since.

 

Here is the new regulator. I dont plan on going past 30psi.

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Edited by Dexatrin82
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That regulator should work, looks the same as mine for the forge. The only thing I can suggest is to watch the tank and how you turn the gas valve on. The newer tanks with the handle like the one pictured have a safety flow limiter in the valve. If it's turned on too fast the limiter will kick in and shut down the flow.

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Welp 22.5 psi and I accidentally overheated my aluminum... never had that happen yet, it was cherry red in reference to the old pie cherries not the new dark ones.

I had added in 3 small ingots to start a puddle for the rest of my cans, got called away, my father (who worked in multiple steel foundries) came out and monitored. it took all of 10 minutes to have my load liquid in the bottom and like 20 minutes for him to finish half a blue box of crushed cans. I got a call 20 minutes from home and was told it was all liquid and to hurry home, got home to about a 1/4" crust of oxide on the top layer and a bright bright almost yellow crucible.  Nice jets coming out the top of the furnace and everything. 

 

So my regulator helped a lot, so did thread tape and tightening fittings, lol. also testing for leaks beforehand.

 

So I started reading a lot here and in the past 48 hours have severely upgraded my safety routine.

 

Having autism can be annoying because you get set in your ways but I'm open to learning. 

 

Probably gonna melt some brass tonight and show you guys the cleaned up results.

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Excellent! Be careful with overheated brass too. ;)

Sounds like your problems are resolved with the new regulator. 

Oh, I generally run 15psi for aluminum, 20-25 for brass, and 25-30 for copper. Copper is as high as I go, as I have no need for melting steel. 
Also, take it from someone that learned the hard way, always preheat your ingot molds. After a steam explosion and almost losing my eyes, I warn everyone that melts. 

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My dad having worked in steel foundries gave me plenty of warning about pre heating the molds especially the cast iron ones. 

 

That and no word of a lie my girlfriend already experienced one when she asked to pour while I was downstairs one day.

 

My assistant had accidentally dropped a single drop of water onto the cast iron mold. Didn't notice it because of the already dark color. 

 

She poured and I had to clean brass spray out of the dirt for like 2 days. She had NO PPE on and a polyester shirt and came out of it with 1 or 2 less than 1mm diameter burns.

 

Needless to say she wears PPE now and always makes sure the molds are pre heated and not wet.

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When the first attempt looks like a congealed mass of Hodge Podge brass items and your furnace doesn't work, Join IforgeIron, make a post, do some research, fix the problem and attempt again...

 

Okay, so, Vitrified Firebrick, Check, 2 5lb Bars in under an hour, check. 

 

USING ANY OF THE ORIGINAL TORCH OR REGULATOR..... ummm nope...

XXXX XXX Slow Mo Pour YouTube link to follow.

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Third picture was the coupling to link the new regulator the company sent me and the replacement torch that broke off lol. 

I'm waiting on a replacement for the replacement. I just put my own together instead following instructions from many parts of this forum.

Now the obvious fail pic is 9mm brass casings that were added to a mass of large gas fittings that congealed into a mass. I figure I'll keep it around as a learning opportunity for others who ask what's that....

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I have a question: 

Do you think my furnace is hot enough to melt copper yet? 

I went to go add more load and saw my crucible was tilting but I hadn't jostled it at all... Looked down and saw a puddle.

Immediately skimmed slag and poured pulled the firebrick out and put crucible back in to cool slow.

I haven't ever seen this before today lol.

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I’ve definitely had a crucible fail mid-melt. Thank goodness firebrick and kaowool is hardy. :) 

Now that you’re definitely cooking with gas, I’d suggest getting a thermometer so you can melt with science instead of instinct. I check temps pretty regularly, and it adds a level of confidence while you’re working. Also, it’ll tell you if the mass of copper is a brief delay because: impatient, or because: this isn’t going to melt and I need to hit the forums again. ;)

BTMETER BT-1500 Non-Contact Pyrometer 30:1 Industrial Laser Thermometer Gun, -58℉ to 2732℉ (-50℃ ~ 1500℃) 

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That's actually the one I'm looking at on Amazon lol. So far instinct had worked. But I have a feeling I might even be able to melt iron soon.

Not gonna try for a long while till I have my brass and copper pours perfected.

 

I appreciate all the help guys 

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