What type of welder do I need

[ThomasPowers]

As I'm not much of an arc welder I brought along a trained friend to check out the used welder I bought.

[arkie]

Good idea....

[Jaegers Forge and Foundry]

Thanks to everyone who responded you've been a huge help with my search

[localsmith]

Whatever you do, stay away from inverter welders unless it's from a made in the USA brand. All the cheap inverter welders are junk and have a very limited lifespan. 

[Deimos]

On 12/15/2020 at 2:16 AM, Irondragon ForgeClay Works said:

I have a problem with their description. If it is a gasless welder, it is not a MIG welder. What else are they fudging on. MIG = Metal Inert Gas.

Not true, you have gasfilled wire, making it a gasless welder.

Keep in mind you need about 40A per mm of steel you want to weld. In some other post I described the difference between a transformer and a inverter. Both have pro's and con's. Mig is very easy to learn, but you will need more replacement parts, stick is a bit harder to learn (inverter is easier then transformer) but nothing ever wears down.

My transformer trips my B16A breakers, had to install a C16A because of the induction in the coils, Inverter will not do that.

"There is a difference between a welding transformer and a welding inverter. A transformer is nothing more then a box with a copper spool and a big knob, no cooling or smarty smart stuff. These have a AC input and a AC output. They have a lower output voltage and amperage then a inverter. This means that starting a weld is harder (lower voltage so less spark, meaning you will get stuck more often) Biggest downside of these is that they are heavy (mine is about 30lbs) and because of the induction over the copper coil they can trip the breaker (like mine does in my house) Plus about these is they are dirt cheap, over here you buy them 2nd hand for about 30 euro. A welding inverter uses electronics to get welding voltage, the voltage and amperage are much higher, and because they have active cooling they can also weld longer. Since they don't have big spools they also weigh a lot less (10lbs or so) They also require less power to run, so they are cheaper to use and wont trip the breaker. These will only weld DC, so you cant weld all materials and all electrodes with them. Over here the smart ones (only change the amps and the thing does the rest, also have hot start and more fancy settings) cost about 100 euro, the dumb ones go for about 80 euro. Since the voltage is much higher (about 40 to 50 volts) they also start easier and give a little wider weld."

When you want to get yourself a MIG, keep in mind that there are many different gas mixtures, each with their own use. And you need to keep in mind that pressurized gas is always dangerous and should be stored in a safe way. You could also go for gas filled wire, but I have no experience with that, only with metal or rutile filled wire.

 

[Irondragon Forge ClayWorks]

17 hours ago, Deimos said:

Not true, you have gasfilled wire, making it a gasless welder.

Not to belabor the point, but this is from Lincoln Electric. Maybe overseas the wire is different than here in the states.
 

Quote

GMAW – which is short for Gas Metal Arc Welding. It’s better known as MIG or Metal Inert Gas welding. To break it down further it is welding with solid wire using an inert gas to shield the weld from atmospheric contamination. GMAW is not good for welding outside or in drafty conditions. This is because the shield gas has a tendency to blow away before it can do its job. Compared to FCAW the welds will be more visually appealing and will have no slag to chip off. GMAW also welds thin metals with less burn through compared to FCAW.

FCAW – which is short for Flux Core Arc Welding. This type of welding is done with the same wire machine as GMAW but doesn’t use gas to shield the weld. The wire is hollow and contains flux powder to shield the weld from atmospheric contamination instead of gas. FCAW is not as good as GMAW at welding very thin materials as it has a tendency to burn through easier. FCAW also leaves a coating of slag on the finished weld that must be chipped off. However, welding outside is not an issue with FCAW and penetration rates are typically better. FCAW can handle a little debris on the surfaces to be welded whereas GMAW needs the welding surfaces to be very clean.

 

[Deimos]

The wire is the same, but over here there is no difference between the terms. A MIG machine does no change in name just because of the type of wire. The term MIG is also a funny one, since you only use inert gasses when you weld Aluminum, copper, nickel and alloys of those. For all types of steel you use Active gasses, making it more logical to call it MAG welding.

[JHCC]

As I commented on a similar question on a different forum, get the biggest welder your budget, your wiring, and your marriage can handle.

[Frosty]

MIG, MAG, etc. is distinguished by the type of shielding gas, the wire has noting to do with that designation. 

Gas filled wire was an interesting read. Impractical for the home shop in general though as it requires very calm air or what little shielding gas it releases is blown away and you got nothing but chicken tracks. 

I'll bet it's the hot ticked for extra terrestrial welding. No need for bottles, hoses, etc. Just the welder squirt gun I'm thinking. It's in use so it provides a conductor to form a plasma column. Heck, it was probably invented for Nasa. 

Frosty The Lucky. 

[ThomasPowers]

Of course arc welding in a strong vacuum presents other issues!

[Frosty]

The need for a welding Helmet rather than just a shield tops the PPE list.

Frosty The Lucky.

[JHCC]

At least hydrogen embrittlement is less of an issue.

[Deimos]

Don't even think about using a welding shield, those things are worthless. If you can spare the money go for a automatic welding helmet (and if you really have the money, go for one with overpressure) any other type of welding helmet is you second best choice. And don't go cheap on safety glasses or earplugs. (1. a welder is pretty loud, 2. earplugs keep sparks from entering your ear (yes, this happens) 3. because the sound is damped you get a better understanding of the sound a good setting makes) Safety glasses underneath your helmet are essential, everyone who welds stick can tell you that sometimes the slag just comes off, and it always goes straight for your face. 

About the "gas filled wire" it is mostly used for home and field/farm work. Most people don't like the cost and the danger of a big bottle of gas in their shed. And nobody likes dragging a bottle of gas around in their car/tractor.

[JHCC]

I picked up an auto-darkening helmet for cheap at the industrial surplus place earlier in the year. What a difference!

[Deimos]

In the long run that will save you a lot of wear on your neck and spine, the classic nod to get a helmet into place is not really a ergonomic action to do. And the basic versions are dirt cheap. (more expensive ones work on solar power, so no need to change batteries.)