TheWanderingLlama Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 Just starting out and I have a small 55 pound cast steel anvil and would like to make a hot cut hardy and some fullers. Because this anvil is relatively small and if I stick with blacksmithing will move to a larger one, I am looking at something relatively simple. I have a 1/2” thick bush hog blade that is medium carbon steel. I was wondering if making a “T” shape where the narrow part of the T could fit diagonally across the hardy socket would be workable. The “T” would form a shoulder across the anvil face with the top of the “T” being the working surface. Pictures below. Given how small this anvil is and the dimensions around the hardy hole, I am leery to doing any kind of serious hot fitting of the hardy. So I would thing I would get it really close to shape via forging/grinding/filing and then just do some light strikes to get it to square up and fit. I was not planning on upsetting the tool stem enough to fill the hardy hole - so it would be locked in across the diagonal. My hardy hole is 15/16” and the stock is 1/2” (minus some rust...) - so there is decent contact against the hardy walls. Hoping that if I am just doing downward blows on a small anvil that this would be enough to get some work done. Thoughts? Obviously not “best practice” - but usable? Another advantage is I can do most of this cold - since forge time is limited for me right now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 That will work just fine...a lot of folks make hardy tools that way. Go for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goods Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 If you want to use it square to the anvil, you don’t have to upset that stock. You could make the shank twice the need length, then fold it over, forging to fit. Just a thought, David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 Got access to a welder to add a strip to snug it up in the hole? If not; just slipping in an inverted L piece of appropriate sized scrap would work. (As I have a number of anvils, few with the exact same size hardy hole, I have a number of such shims to hand by the anvil(s).) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWanderingLlama Posted July 28, 2020 Author Share Posted July 28, 2020 Arkie: Great - glad to know this is not out in left field. Thanks. Goods: That is a great idea. I supposed I should fuller it a bit at the bend point I fold it to help with the bend squishing out a bunch? Since I am just filling up space I wouldn’t even need to forge weld it or anything - but might be an opportunity to give it a shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 The alloy for a bush hog blade may not be an easy weld, especially to it'self. Won't hurt it to try and fail (as long as you don't burn it up!) Do you know how modern the blade was? (Could it be one of the boron alloys rather than easily worked carbon alloys?) I like that you included the premade taper in your plans---saves work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWanderingLlama Posted July 28, 2020 Author Share Posted July 28, 2020 Thomas: Normally I have access to a TIG and MIG at work - but COVID has made that off-limits for now. I like the shim idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 Fast and easy way to share tooling on differing anvils. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWanderingLlama Posted July 28, 2020 Author Share Posted July 28, 2020 Thomas: The blade is 20+ years old. Not sure if that would considered “modern” or not? It could be a fair bit older - the deck it was off of was well older than that but unsure of when this one was pulled off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 Well I found a patent for a high boron blade that dates to 1995 so unknown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWanderingLlama Posted July 28, 2020 Author Share Posted July 28, 2020 I ended up going with Thomas’ wedge approach. Below are picture of the work I progress for the fuller. The wedge is a piece of spring steel scrap that I had on hand. I can tap it up from the bottom with the side of my hammer. It needs driven out from the top with a punch. Seems to hold it pretty good - we will see! Still need to cut out the hot cut tool. Thanks to all for the suggestions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWanderingLlama Posted July 30, 2020 Author Share Posted July 30, 2020 Near finished pictures - my very first hardy hot cut and fuller. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 When you make your next hardies you'll find they work better if they're about 2"-2 1/2" wide and have a curved edge like an ax. As a last FYI. A hot cut and a hardy are two different tools. A hot cut is a top tool be it a hand chisel or has a handle. A hardy is a bottom tool on a shank that fits the hardy hole. Hardies are hot or cold chisels used to cut parts and stock, the basic types are Hot and Cold though there are many variations. To be a "hardy" it has to be a cut off chisel that inserts in the hardy hole. The "hardy Hole is named for the hardy. Bottom cut off chisels that just sit on the anvil are often called anvil devils and those held in place with a saddle I don't know. It's become common terminology to call any tool with a square shank a "hardy tool." I'm not calling you on anything I just thought you might be interested in a bit of blacksmith minutia. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWanderingLlama Posted July 31, 2020 Author Share Posted July 31, 2020 Thanks for the terminology lesson - lots to learn... I had come across the anvil devil term before but not yet tracked down what it was. It is important to use the language correctly - particularly when asking for help - otherwise I will confuse my would-be-helpers needlessly. I did see that most hot cut surfaces are curved. For this quick one I figure straight was OK since I am only working with small stock. I was also lazy since this was all cutting, grinding, and filing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 Yeah, encouraging a consistent jargon is sort of a thing with me. I keep hoping to get more folks to use common terms. I try not to be borish about it but I can get carried away. Your tools are excellent for someone as new as you are and they'll work for a long time. The curved edge makes them more efficient cutting similar to the angled edge on a Mandolin slicer. (kitchen tool) The fuller looks like a real work horse. Well done on both. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 I'm bad about using the term "hardy tooling" when I really mean "hardy hole tooling". Now if I can just convince Frosty to wear lederhosen, an aloha shirt and a disreputable red hat when he gets to Quad-State; I might be able to attend incognito and so avoid the wrath of the grammatica malleo AKA σφυρί γραμματικής! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWanderingLlama Posted July 31, 2020 Author Share Posted July 31, 2020 Frosty: Thanks. Thomas: I am running some leads on some bigger anvils in central Ohio. I am hoping you left some for me before you moved... Now that I have an anvil to mess around with I can hopefully be patient and persistent and TPAAT myself to an upgrade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 I only took 2 anvils of greater than 400# out of Ohio when I left; plenty still around I'm sure what with *3* good brand anvil makers once active in the state: Arm & Hammer, Trenton, Columbian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 I might even have a Hawaiian shirt but lederhosen? !! I'm thinking a: carrot false nose, candy corn, cob pipe and my bowler. That's just tentative though, maybe a tie dyed mop suit, air conditioned by a train of thralls working a bellows. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 Quad-States have ranged from so cold I had ice in my water bucket when I woke up and with a strong wind---army surplus wool overpants worked a treat that day. To temps in the high 90's and humidity even higher. To a deluge of several inches of rain. The lederhosen on the Friday is "weather allowing". Wearing something distinctive so folks who have never met you can set their dogs on you recognize you helps folks to meet up. I enjoy camping onsite; RVs are allowed and hookups available. I usually use a sibley tent if alone or sleep in the van if with my wife. A lot of the old KeenJunk crowd used to camp together to share food and craziness. VI Copper used to go to a local motel; as after the US Virgin Islands, pretty much all Ohio Weather in late September was glacial... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 I intended to think of something distinctive and trademarkish to wear when we make a Q.S. I thought a nice large Frosty the Snowman hat would do the trick but I can't wear much of a hat since the shingles. Watching the weather and packing for anything is how I travel, hopefully we'll be able to cope. 90s above might have me hanging out in the RV's AC though. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 Flat spring forged to fit diagonals works well to . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWanderingLlama Posted August 1, 2020 Author Share Posted August 1, 2020 Thanks Charles. Would you have any reservations about forging to fit on this little anvil? I was a little leery of anything that might me “wedge-like” going on there with the not-so-robust dimensions. There is a joke there about giving my anvil a wedgie - but I am not through my first cup of coffee so I will just leave it... Also: Thanks for curating all of the great info on charcoal forges. That was a real enabler for me to get started. Added: Halfway through the coffee. “Wedgie” and “anvil crack” popped into my head. I am worried what the second half will bring - I am channeling my inner 10 year old apparently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnut Posted August 1, 2020 Share Posted August 1, 2020 An anvil devil just lays on the face of the anvil. They are handy if you don't have a hardy hole. Pnut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWanderingLlama Posted August 1, 2020 Author Share Posted August 1, 2020 Pnut: Wow, that is quite simple. Thanks for the image. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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