solvarr Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I didn't know the kit was 40$ !!! between car gas and my time driving arround to get parts It's a savings. All of those parts cost over 30 dollars from my local stores. I think from here on out I'll tell people to go buy a kit and we'll assemble it when we make the ammo can forge body. The cost of the ammo can forge would still be under 120$ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerkid Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 DL, It would be more buT probally SAFER with it. :rolleyes:YES it maybe a bit higher but probally better. CHRIS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabre Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 yes i agree it would be way safer than welding on a torch ment for somthing else.... either but one or make one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solvarr Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I was told that a yard torch is balanced for a reducing flame. It wants to heat, dry, and then start the combustion of the material. Also yard torches burn an obscene amount of gas when compared to a forge burner which is why many of them have an "idle mode" and a blast trigger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabre Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 yes that is true i have to heard that but i seem to forget where... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 No most weed burners are severly oxidizing and will need to be choked to use as a forge burner. Oxidizing is more fire starting than reducing---can't catch on fire if there is not excess O2 around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer3j Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Now, now, Phil,. The listing of my Whisper Baby was active when he was searching. Not that he should have bought it; but it is a new forge except that I coated the appropriate surfaces with ITC-100. And I had it priced at $100 less than "New" with all of the warranty. I bought a forge from Jim Wahls, a two burner, well insulated and floored and it is a good forge- certainly not "scrounger cheap," but it is a bit unfair dumping on all products for smithing on ebay. My V & B anvil was on until 3 hours ago- I am glad it didn't sell because I had changed my mind and am building a mobile stand for it now that I know it stays at home with me. I'd swear that Steve at "matchlessantiques" has anvil dedicated rare earth magnets in his body. You don't buy his stuff on the cheap but he doesn't over-rate his inventory. Scrounging and bargain hunting are great ways to enjoy smithing, but some of us can't drive around to the garage sales and scrapyards. Some can forge well, but cannot weld in the modern sense. I am in the process of building a gas forge and a couple of coal forges- I like to weld and have a nice mig and three torch set-ups. WIth its new carburetor, my big 10hp Tecumseh run generator is a one -two pull deal.( My fault:no Stabil in gas). I wake up each morning at 4:30 to 5:00 AM. Cowboy breakfast(5 cigarettes and three cups of coffee) and then I work on law stuff until I head for court(most days) which starts at 8:00AM or 8:30 AM. Then back and forth from office to courthouse and maybe leave at 5:00 PM. Home, feed the canine security pack of angry chihuahuas, fix and eat dinner(even after over 30 years in Iowa, I have never adopted the "supper" for evening meal), then play with woodworking tools or basic anvil stuff for an hour or so, and then study legal stuff and go to bed. I am sure that there are others here who have a similar or tougher schedule- it does lend itself to buying implements that get you started shaping hot metal;instead of starting to start. I am not complaining but explaining why not everyone is able to DIY the cheapest way. Also, at times, buying proven equipment takes away one worry and lets the student concentrate on the human skills like hammer control. Just my thoughts here.Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicForge Posted July 28, 2008 Author Share Posted July 28, 2008 Well i was thinking about a solution to my forge since i need something to well provide the heat. After some searching of torchs on wiki i found the Butane torch. They are cheap as i see and i have found some that can get as hot as 3000F! Most run for 1-4hours on a tank of fuel which you buy replacements about $20 for a pack of four. I think i found my burner. What do you guys think? Will this work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry W. Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Out of curiosity, yesterday I stacked up a bunch of fire brick and used a small propane torch as a burner. I wanted to see if I could use it for small work. I let it burn for about 30 minutes and it was not near hot enough to forge in. I think I will invest in a proper burner. Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Caradoc Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 are there any risks to burning the butane torch for 1-4 hours? like overheating or possable explosion or the tip melting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 There is more than just the temperature; there is the total ammount of heat produced. That is why you cannot heat your house with one wooden match. The temperature is high enough but the total ammount of heat is still low. Heat is generally measured in BTUs; you may want to check what that butane burner puts out vs what some of the forge burners are rated at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicForge Posted July 28, 2008 Author Share Posted July 28, 2008 dude im talking butane torch not a propane they are differnt differnt fuel so will it work or xxxxxxxx what? And how do you build a forge burner or where do you buy one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry W. Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 There are several makers of the burners. Gas forges was at the Balcones Forge June meeting. He sells complete gas forges, burners and regulators to make your own. I don't know if it will burn with butane. It may just be a matter of changing an orifice. Maybe not..... Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicForge Posted July 28, 2008 Author Share Posted July 28, 2008 ive seen those chili burners that you put a link to jerry and xxxx they are a dream but too expensive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer3j Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 If you go to Ron Reil's site, you get the component call-out for a burner. You get basic instructions-there, and many other places on the net. Google "ron reil burner assembly". Unless you want to use riverbank clay in the coffee can, you will need to buy ceramic liner and a couple of high temp bricks-check Old World Anvil- get the burner kit from Darren- what a bargain! Or find a freon tank from HVAC and cut and weld up a bigger one.Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keykeeper Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 dude im talking butane torch not a propane they are differnt differnt fuel so will it work or freaken what? And how do you build a forge burner or where do yo ubuy one? Whoa! Getting a little demanding there. Slow down, take a breath. Enthusiasm is encouraged, just don't let it overtake you. There is plenty of info about forges and forge burners and such on this site, and multitudes of other sights on the internet. Spend an afternoon and search the web. Read a lot, print out plans of different ones, decide which is easiest for you to build, then build one. Then get a propane tank, a GOOD adjustable regulator, and fire it up. Don't get hung up on it and over-engineer it. Just slow down. JM$.02W Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLOB Posted July 29, 2008 Share Posted July 29, 2008 I'm not sure what the price is now....but looking at the price list I have from last year I could buy a Jay Hayes single burner forge kit for 7$ more than the price of one of the "super" chilli burners. my current forge is using his burners and a shell made from a scrap of sheet metal rolled around an argon tank I had. all my future will be from him. (my next forge is already being built now) Jay's email is jay@hrea.coop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted July 29, 2008 Share Posted July 29, 2008 Jay's a good guy, best price on ITC-100 as of a couple months ago too. I have one of his 3/4" linear burners and it works just fine all round. Frosty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keykeeper Posted July 29, 2008 Share Posted July 29, 2008 Yeah, and that little forge you built really cooks, eh Rob? Not that I've seen it in action or anything. I mentioned it in my write-up on the Harris' hammer-in for the ABA newsletter. Still gonna have to build me one, soon as my budget allows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLOB Posted July 29, 2008 Share Posted July 29, 2008 Jay and I were using his forge to play around this weekend. we used his 3 burner forge (alot larger volume than my 1 burner) to weld up a timing chain out of my jeep......it welded fine with just one burner going. I dont think we turned it up over 6 psi either. Aaron, cant wait to read your write up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 29, 2008 Share Posted July 29, 2008 Well hold on there Son, a btu is a btu it doesn't depend on if it's produced by electricity, coal, charcoal, propane, butane, methane, oil, solar, nuclear or friction. (I've seen most of these used for smithing BTW) If your butane burner will not pump enough BTU's; it will not work as a forge burner. No matter what the temperature it produces as it will not produce enough energy to heat the steel up to where it needs to be. Think about it: a wooden match will heat a straight pin up to forging temperature, but won't even warm up a rr spike appreciably. The butane burner might work for something like a one firebrick forge that uses a soft firebrick and a torch to make a very small forge suitable for very small items--1/4" stock and under. Where the small chamber, good insulation and small stock make use of the relatively small number of BTUs produced. On a cost per BTU it's probably quite expensive to run though. You can build your own burners; blown propane ones are particularly easy to build not being as fussy as the aspirated ones. Plans are out on the net. Be prepared to spend some time adjusting/tweaking them to get the best burn and note that as a system heats up you may need to adjust the air/fuel ratio again. You may want to adjust it anyway depending on what type of smithing you do. I generally run it balanced to slightly oxidizing to heat up the forge and then go to reducing if I'm doing blade work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJ234 Posted July 29, 2008 Share Posted July 29, 2008 I've not used one personally, but lot's of folks seem to like the Bernzomatic JTH-7 (~$30) torch for coffee can/fire brick scale forges. I took a lesson from Tai Goo in Tucson a while back, and he was using a coffee can forge with a Harbor Freight weedburner torch (~$20), and he seemed pleased with its performance and fuel economy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtomicForge Posted July 29, 2008 Author Share Posted July 29, 2008 Will these items be suffcient for starting blacksmithing? NC Whisper Deluxe Atmospheric Forge with a Back Door NC 70 lb. Standard Anvil .Peddinghaus 1000 g German Pattern Hammer Centaur 3/4" x 3-7/8" Heavy V-Bit Bolt Tom Tongs, 14" Rein (these the right tongs to get?) Centaur Gas Forge Stand Will those work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Hale Posted July 29, 2008 Share Posted July 29, 2008 I believe the whisper deluxe has a sheet metal front door, if that is the case it is really good for horse shoes but you will have trouble betting enough heat for forge welding. I have welded in them and it is a borderline thing.They make a whisper momma low boy with insulated door that works extremely well for almost everything. I have the whisper daddy model and it is about the same with a larger interior space. There is a difference in price but it is worth it. You either want the insulated door now or will later. Have fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Caradoc Posted July 29, 2008 Share Posted July 29, 2008 Absolutly YES that is beeter than what I have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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