Justin Topp Posted May 1, 2020 Author Share Posted May 1, 2020 Finished the knife and I’m very happy with how it turned out. Nicholson file core. The jacket is a lot lighter/whiter than expected so I think it was either pure iron at that point or very close to it. Either way cool pattern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Burnt steel is not bloom! But it may be approaching oroshigane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzkill Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Regardless of the proper name for it, converting burnt steel back into a usable bar and then making something functional out of it gets my respect, for whatever that's worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Topp Posted May 1, 2020 Author Share Posted May 1, 2020 Ya I know it’s not a bloom. Just saying it acts a lot like one in how you process it! Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Nice work.. did it harden up nicely? Much of how steel is processed today can be looked at differently from a spectators view.. Thomas has expereince in many facets and metallurgy so it can be a lot of fun. The carbionization of steel was carried out in many ways early one and one was burning it and if the fire is deep enough and done right you can gain more carbon than lost. I love your go for it attitude.. Refreshing.. Way back in the day I would read something and go try it.. if it worked i would try to refine it, If it didn't work I would try to figure out why it didn't and if I never got it to work I moved on. Self exploration is what brought about so many changes in working metals.. Keep at it.. I started when I was 8.. I keep looking at your inquisitiveness and wonder how old you are? Age does not matter when it comes to forging.. Just curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Topp Posted May 1, 2020 Author Share Posted May 1, 2020 Thanks. The jacket didn’t harden much but the file core hardened nicely. I definitely lost more carbon than I gained. Fairly shallow anthracite fire and all. Trying different Things is one of my favorite aspects of this craft. I am 16 as of April 28th I started getting serious in November 2018. Perfect timing considering I had to deal with a consistent freezing temperatures and snow haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 As some folks may have guessed, I read a bit; so I've tried a LOT of stuff I read about to see if it actually worked like they said it did. One of the odder ones was a pre-1900 speculation on how wootz was made by using plates of wrought iron and cast iron and forge welding them together. Well I like billet welding and I had some bathtub cast iron pieces---thin and fairly high grade stuff I had scrounged to try the UN smithing book's idea on "crayoning" carbon on the edge of a mild steel axe. Any way I built up a nice stack, heated it in my coal forge till it looked ready for welding and took it to the anvil with cast iron dripping from the billet. The first smack for welding and big gloopy cast iron drops squirted out and were arcing through the air until they would burst into sparks---they were decarbing as they flew through the air and when it hit steel carbon levels they *burned*! Leather aprons are your BFF! (Did a case hardening run once where I got C levels up to cast iron, too.) I love the oddball stuff; please report anything you try and how it worked! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Topp Posted May 1, 2020 Author Share Posted May 1, 2020 I post pretty much everything here! Once it’s summer I’ll be attempting a bog iron smelt with some ore I was given! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Happy Birthday.. Thanks for sharing.. I am inspired and love all you are trying. Thomas, I am getting ready to do the very same thing but a little bit differently. I'm going to crush the cast iron or cut it, wrap it much like a japanese setup in clay. do a soak in heat and give it a go.. Wont' be for some time but it's interesting just the same.. I love to trouble shoot.. Trouble shoot = figure it out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Have you though of using brake lathe "shavings" a meehanite cast iron dust sort of thing? Back in the early 1980's there was a Prof at the U of AR looking into casting cast iron around small mild steel balls and letting it soak for carbon transfer to try to get a more uniform result. (We had something odd happen and were consulting a metallurgist to see if what we though was happening was accurate and discussed his research too.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Topp Posted May 1, 2020 Author Share Posted May 1, 2020 I might give lathe shavings a try. I know a guy with one. A bucket full of spirals a few feet long. Hardest part is sorting the aluminum from the steel. Though I suppose once it’s up to temp the aluminum will have melted away Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 I could do that for sure.. It would be easier.. I've looked at several different methods of which I'm sure they have all been tried.. How did that billet you attempted come out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 I was assuming that the cast iron was to be a carbon donor and so most lathe swarf wouldn't work. I have seen a knife made from lathe swarf. Fellow at Q-S brought it one year. Filled a large coffee can with swarf, compressed it with a 50K pound press, fluxed it and welded it. Needed to be folded and welded again as there were some voids in it. Hmm Lathe swarf and meehanite dust? I didn't get the Ci/WI billet to weld and so marked it down on the "not proven" list. The tightly bound WI plates in molten cast iron I hadn't got around to yet when I volunteered to be the helper when Al Pendray did his demo at Quad-State one year so to be up close when he was discussing the experiments he and Verhoeven had done and decided that those results matched extant wootz pieces close enough. I also got a copy of Dr Feuerbach's thesis on Crucible Steel in Central Asia. Which clearly states that not all crucible steels from that time/place were wootz steels. Some folks today are using the term crucible steel to mean wootz steel; Huntsman must be getting good rpms! Mixed steel and Al; be careful that it's fresh and not corroded any as thermite requires special handling. (There was a guy on Sword Forum International 20? or so years ago who was using thermite reactions to custom alloy steels. Interesting results until he reported that even with fancy protective gear he was going blind and had to stop...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Topp Posted May 1, 2020 Author Share Posted May 1, 2020 It sits inside and has no rust. Although I’d probably just lockout the aluminum ones before I started. Don’t gonna attempt it for now but eventually it could be a fun challenge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Just use a magnet with a cloth over it.. Aluminum problem no more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 I was just checking on when they dropped asbestos from brake shoes and at least here in the USA it was over 20 years ago so "modern" brake lathe waste material should not contain any! I'll have to take a lard pail and visit my mechanic when this is all over. (Picked up a half dozen old (steel) small lard pails nicely cleaned out at the scrapyard and figuring out what to use them for...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Topp Posted May 1, 2020 Author Share Posted May 1, 2020 Too hot for me to comfortably forge today so I added a rack and some walls to my vise stand to hold tongs and prevent punches and stuff from rolling away between heats Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyGoatLady Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 Nice Justin. I have a set up about like yours. Not for tongs but for chisels, punches, every day files and what not. Walls are a good idea. Soon it will be hot here and I regularly forge in 100° + weather. I'm a weirdo probably because I prefer forging when it's warm out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 To hot.. You just had snow on the ground a week or so ago.. What you have for temps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Topp Posted May 2, 2020 Author Share Posted May 2, 2020 Bear in mind I prefer the winter over summer. And I’m still used to winter weather. This is laughable to you all I’m sure but it was not Much wind. no clouds so super sunny and 75 degrees. Hot to me. And considering the snow last week it felt hot. And my forge is up wind (Of the small amount there was) so the heat all went directly at me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Topp Posted May 2, 2020 Author Share Posted May 2, 2020 Weird hook thing to hang my twisting wrench from my vise stand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 the weather and such is not laughable to me.. We have been all over the place here.. 30, 60, 25, 50.. Today is supposed to be near 70 and I'll be dying as I go for my Saturday walk. I just didn't realize there was such a shift from winter to summer in such a quick fashion there. I work outside everyday so my temperature acclimation is pretty good, but when we get a spike in temps it can be draining to push the limits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Topp Posted May 2, 2020 Author Share Posted May 2, 2020 Yea I think the biggest issue is when it shifts from 30 to 75 in a few days and not gradually. It’s supposed to cool back down to the mid 50s so pretty good weather. Still gonna have my fan on when forging though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyGoatLady Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 It's not laughable to me either. It's just a difference in climate and what you like. I hate winter. When it's warm, I live outside. We don't get as cold of winters here in Texas so I'm not acclimated to it at all. It doesn't even feel warm to me until it gets in the upper 70s. And we have had big swings in temperature ranges also. Normally it would be very pleasant but it's been nearly chilly enough to turn on heat at night. No bueno to me. So it's all just a matter of what your used to. I've watched your videos and seen you forging in the snow. My hats off to you because I'd freeze to death Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Topp Posted May 2, 2020 Author Share Posted May 2, 2020 I suppose it’s all about climate. It’s only too cold for me to forge when it’s below 0 haha. Anything above that is fine. I particularly like forging when it’s snowing. Except when you forget to wipe the snow off and you just about make yourself go deaf from the snap of water evaporating under hot metal haha. as a side note I made a much more comfortable handle for my brush Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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