Eventlessbox

Devil forge, 2 burner with door

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After a few recent threads it was suggested that those of us that went the commercially manufactured forge route share our experience.

Item one, and this is huge, unless you spend the big money for a manufactured forge,

They are not plug and play.

When your forge arrives there are steps to take and for a good experience products to buy before your forge is useable. The forges 101 thread covers this extensively.

Devil forge now comes with a ridgidizer, which appears to be a very fine paint on clay. This is the step I just completed. 

After this step I will still be applying a layer of Kast-o-lite. And then most likely a layer of IR re-radiating coating. 

So while the forge arrived very quickly I expect to be weeks before actual usability.

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Thanks for posting. The least head information here is just this kind of input from forge buyers.

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I will be adding pictures and documenting through to forging. The forge even after purchasing refractory is still coming in less then my first forge I built myself. If it works as well then maybe I can help some starting Smith's have a less expensive start up. 

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I am considering getting a 2-burner Devil's Forge with a door (the DFPROF2+1D) and came on here to ask if the refactory clay they supply is enough or not (especially after reading the https://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/53239-ceramic-wool-insulation-safety-alert/ post!).  I had seen one video of its application (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNOywSx01pM) but have no idea generally how thick the clay liner should be - I just assumed it should be enough not to allow the fibres to break loose.

So anyway, it was good to see this thread because it looks like someone else has figured it all out :-D  So please let us know how it goes! 

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Andrew,

Welcome. I'm hoping to apply the Kast-o-lite tommorow and will post those pictures then. The clay supplied is quite thin and not really very penetrating. It also has already started to crack just as it dries. After application my impression is that while it may( and I enphisze may, there are small holes in the layer) contain the fibers, it would likely degrade very quickly. Does not at all seem durable. A few other recent members have posted about the round version and reported similar results. 

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Do you think the clay will be rigid enough to suspend the refractory while it sets up? If not, you may want to get some West 406 and spray the other side with it (suspended in water with food coloring). It will be a cheap fix I think.

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It is seldom too late to fix a forge problem. rigidizer can be poured into ceramic blanket, even after a seal coat is applied, At worst, it can be poured in through a small hole at the top of a metal shell, and the excess gathered into a pan, as it pours out of a bottom hole. Take a deep breath, relax, and just do what you need to end up at your desired end point.

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20190314_125044.jpg

20190314_125035.jpg

I'm hoping the kast-o-lite takes care of any issues. If not I'll deffinatly try a ridgidizer piur through.

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Seems like the clay should support. I just wouldn't trust it solo. 

Andrew, that being said, for the price I am very happy with the quality of construction and am not too upset with buying some castable. I found a small bag from a local furnace repair shop. Although Wayne Coe( a member here) also sells small batches for a very reasonable price.

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Good to know you're happy with the quality and thanks for posting those pictures.  Yeah, there are some quite obvious gaps there...  So you're just laying a base of the supplied clay (is it refactory clay or rigidiser?  Is there a difference?  Sorry - no idea about this stuff yet!) and then putting a much more complete layer of Kast-O-Lite over the top of it?  Could one option be to remove the blanket entirely and replace it with fire bricks that are of an appropriate size?  (The base ones supplied and then some on the side that effectively hold up ones across the top with holes drilled through them for the burners, of course.)  Their DFPROFK series seem to use fire bricks rather than blanket, so I guess it's possible, but don't know if the internal construction of the forge you have is any different.

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My first forge was a fire brick construction. It started degrading somewhat quickly. So I'm hoping to do better with what seems to be the preferred method of the group. 

My plan is to put a 1/4" layer of Kast-o-lite one the walls and ceiling and a 1/2" layer on the forge floor.

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A kiln shelf from your local pottery supply will protect the Kastolite floor, especially if you will be forge welding.  I got that bit of advice from someone on here and it really helps protect my forge and provide a very flat floor.

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Same one I've got. Works very well. Although I'm having issues with the second burner, seems like it's combusting a bit early at the lower psi. Also, when the tank gets icy and pressure drops, it seems that's the burner that suffers. Might have to rethink how they have the piping done for them, but that's down the line. I also threw on some refractory and an IR coating, fired up the forge today to forge the Fuglies. Seemed to hold it's heat longer, so the IR definitely helped. Might get me to the point where I can eventually forge weld without needing to do anything else. I'll check out the forge tomorrow or Monday after work and see if the IR needs any patching. Ended up using ITC 100 since some of the other stuff I was seeing couldn't be used over a refractory. Not sure how accurate that was, but I took the dive. Overall I'm happy. Should hopefully last me a decent amount of time.

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Paul,

Was already headed down that road. Unfortunately my local pottery supply shop is an hour and a half away and only carries a limited supply of shelfs all of which I'd need to cut down and which would still not be a great fit.

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Kast-O-lite 30 is not as strong as high alumina kiln shelf, but is better insulation; it makes a good alternative, for about the same price if you buy from Wayne.

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Eventlessbox, the alumina kiln shelf cuts very easily with a masonry blade and it sands very easily as well on your belt sander to shape-to-fit.  And to be clear, I still put a thick floor of Kastolite down but then use the shelf to protect the Kastolite so that you don't have to repair it as often.

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Eventless, looking good.  I wish I'd have more time on my forge these last few weeks, but now that we are short at work and my wife has me on some other home projects, it'll be another week or two before I get back to the forge.  If I didn't live in a community, I'd just beat on steel at 11 pm, but the neighbors are all trying to sleep at that time.

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Eventless, good idea on sharing info on commercial forges... I recently purchased a Hell's Forge duel burner forge, I don't think my homemade forge will get hot enough to forge weld. I'm very happy with mine, it came already rigidized, firebricks for the floor, regulator and hose, and comes with castable refractory all for 300 bucks. I have about the same money in it as I do the homemade one I built.

Make sure you follow the directions when setting it up though. I did the leak test and found a pinhole in a welded joint on the piping that goes to the burners. I called them up and they sent me out a new one and they even offered to refund me some of the purchase price. I just told them I'd be happy with the replacement part. Once I got the new part in I put it together and fired it up, it worked great. I forged a railroad spike knife using it, it took about 3 minutes at 4-5 psi to get the spike hot enough to start pounding on using just 1 burner. Honestly for the beginner I don't think you can go wrong with it especially for those who's building skills may not be that good (like me). I don't know yet if it will get hot enough to forge weld but as soon as I get the 15n20 and 1084 I plan on giving it a go and see what happens. I'll let you know how that goes even if it is a failure...

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I bought a Devil Forge 3 burner model, I painted the interior with the rigidizer. I used what was left to coat the top of the brick, I thought, what could it hurt right?

What do I need to do next? I have mainly used coke on my forging until now, so I am uneducated on gas forges.

Should I reline with firebrick? Keep the ceramic wool fiber, consequently, we used the same stuff in chimney relining to wrap the SS liners we put in chimneys, but wrapped it with SS mesh to keep it in place. 20 years of using that stuff. I bought mine to do canister Damascus as it is so much cleaner than coal, or coke.

Any guidance is much appreciated!

G George ( Firefly Forge)

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Welcome aboard G George, glad to have you. If you'll put your general location in the header you might be surprised how many members live within visiting distance.

Lose the fire brick. Even Morgan thermal's K 26 insulating fire brick (IFB) are fragile at forging temperature and will gouge up after a while. 

What is the temperature rating of the ceramic wool you have on hand? I've found 1" 8 lb. Kaowool needs a protective flame face between it and the fire. 8lb. Kaowool is rated to 2,600f.

The floor in my forge is 1/2" of Kastolite 30 over two rigidized 1" layers of 8lb. Kaowool. I don't count the home brewed kiln wash I tried out as the finish isn't good. Some of the new guys in our club are pretty  heavy handed but the Kastolite floor has held up nicely for better than a year of casual use. 

I don't recommend any fire brick in a propane forge unless it's a brick pile or clamped brick forge. Brick forges have advantages but the trade offs are durability for IFB or they are fuel hogs if using hard brick.

We talk about this a lot in the Forges 101 section.

Frosty The Lucky.

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Metal frame holding the bricks in place.  You Jed Clampett !

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I can't find a pic of one from the club forge workshop. I'll have to get Tristan to send me one. It's basically angle iron and all thread and clamps the brick in position. 

I'll find a pic.

Frosty The Lucky.

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