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I Forge Iron

First Knife Attempts (Photo Heavy)


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Hey guys, I've been here lurking in the shadows learning for quite some time, decided to finally post some pictures of my first knife attempts.  First a little backstory.  I've always been interested in making knives and swords since I was young.  My very first attempt was when I was 10 I hammered a piece of angle iron into the rough shape of a katana using a bonfire in the backyard.  With a lack of information and no one to teach me the ways that's where it ended.  I never lost my love of a beautiful sword or knife, I just didn't know how to make them so I started collecting replicas.  Then Forged in Fire started and I saw the episode with the guy forging in a frying pan in his backyard and found my inspiration.  After seeing how few tools you needed to get started I built a charcoal forge out of a BBQ filled with refractory cement and a bathroom fan.  I don't get a whole lot of time for forging but every day I get to fire it up is a great day regardless of what I get done.  I work at a car dealership so I have access to the odd bit of metal such as axle shafts and springs so to start I have been using these random bits to get a feel for things. 

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This is the very first thing that came from my forge, hammered from the rear axle shaft of a truck.  The hammer marks were pretty deep, it picked up a warp in the quench, and the most painful part about it was the "grinder" that I used to shape and sharpen was a Black and Decker Dragster locked upside down in a vise.  I gave it as a tester to one of the mechanics I work with and he absolutely loves it and uses it every year as his hunting knife.  The edge retention isn't the greatest and lasts long enough to get through a deer before needing to be sharpened.  The sheath was also the first Kydex I had ever worked with.

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This next one was the second knife I made, also out of the same rear axle shaft, and also given as a test to one of my mechanics.  The handle was oak but it cracked and separated from the tang so I replaced it with my first homemade micarta using old jeans and t-shirts.  The finish is a little cleaner, still some hammer marks in the blade but not as bad as the first.  Edge retention was also better then the first and this one managed to maintain a good edge after skinning three deer.  It has since become a kitchen knife due to size.

 

 

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And the last knife I have made that went to a friend of a friend, forged from a rusty wrench my brother in law gave me.  It was meant to be a rough, unfinished, apocalyptic style but I feel I took the grinding too far to really get that across, but not far enough to be a nice clean knife.  That said, the rough look is what the guy loves about the knife.  The sheath for it was a last minute addition as the guy who got it said he didn't want one but I didn't want it floating around a backpack all willy-nilly.  This is also the sharpest knife I've made yet, shaved the side of my finger off without feeling it when I was cleaning the blade.  

 

 

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I'm interested to hear the advice and critiques you guys have on these, and thank you all for the very, very informative posts on this site.  There is so much knowledge and inspiration in this site it's unreal.  And a quick note, after 4 today I will be gone for the Christmas holidays and won't be back until the new year, so if I don't reply I'm not ignoring the posts, I'm just not around.

 

Merry Christmas and happy holidays everyone.

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A forged frying pan as "the inspiration" for making knives.....kinda cool:ph34r: 

The second knife is the serious one.

the first and the third are honorable efforts but ...Nr.one has only wrapped handle and like it looks just a fat uneven bevel on flatstock and Nr. three is still half a wrench that will turn in the hand while chopping....so my focus is on Nr2 as a developed knife.....that came out ok, mate.

still there are a lot of aspects to improve.Like  control over HT(you need a Thermometer!) understanding blade geometries(thinner edges, !) avoid fancy profiles like finger grooves like on Nr2 which is undeveloped ...keep it more! simple and so on....

 it is difficult and time consuming to advice You in all the right directions, so lets turn the spit over and ask You:

What is it that You need to know?....what makes You struggle the most?....how can I(we) help You?.....

all in a nut shell,...with Nr2 You did a good job!

 Good luck and Happy christmas.

 

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List of simple tools, harbor freight belt sander, cheap whetstones. harbor freight usually has pig iron stones for about 3$ as long as you level them you can use them to make a knife sharper then a razor as well as some sand paper, and then later get nicer stones to work up the grits going from lowest for stock removal to a finer grit belt to get the edge and then stones.

Charcoal forging is very much an experience type deal, you can do more with it then propane, but propane is more consistent. I like propane but my hearts in coals.

I also recommend looking up Vehoeven's guide for bladesmiths and others who heat treat and forge steel. (yes the name is an insult)

I would also recommend investing in some 1084, and looking up Kevin Cashen, a ABS Mastersmith who practically wrote the book (he actually did write the book) on heat treating knives.
His website has the info for some of the steels.

That said about 80% of the problems with heat treatment come from batch variance, The steel conforms to standard usually with a +5 or -5 variance in carbon and a range of around +10 or -10 in alloy content. A slightly different part of steel can effect heat treatment in silly ways so take a grain of salt when you get slightly different results.

Merry Christmas

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On ‎12‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 8:11 AM, Sly said:

I also recommend looking up Vehoeven's guide for bladesmiths and others who heat treat and forge steel. (yes the name is an insult)

Sly, a lot of good advices in my opinion You are giving there.You mentioned Verhoevens book, thats the best advice....i just dont understand what name is an insult?

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because it wasn't written "heat treatment for blacksmiths" it was labled for bladesmiths; then "other people", which is sort of true I guess in who manipulates the steel the most, would be bladesmiths in basically making their own steel and then knife makers and then smiths, its just the wording can also be read: people who treat the steel and then try to work it. Which isnt that off considering for some steels like A2 we have to austenize it fully each and every time before hitting it since it air quenches and has a plethora of unstable phases as it cools. or that can be "youre doing it wrong". if you read the title to someone who isnt involved in our world they would ask "there's a difference?"

It's clever because its an insult and not an insult at the same time, if you misunderstand it then the fault is on you, but its an insult none the less. It's an oldschool type saying something without saying it. But then who is insulted anymore with titles like: Blacksmithing for dummies.

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On ‎12‎/‎24‎/‎2018 at 1:42 AM, Sly said:

 

Now is it to the point, where I understand it even less than before....in my understanding You try to interpret something between the lines..?

But I have to point out that "such" conversation is far above my skills in speaking English, so the chance that I get You completely wrong is there for sure.

As the same that I didnt red the edition of the book in English.I red the book in its German edition and it is far away of beeing insulting, neither cynical nor sarcastic.

In fact it is a very good book, with the intention to educate people so that there can be better qualities in the result....dosent matter if you are blade-or blacksmith.

Old school saying in German is right in the face, especially in the profession of metal working society...its about precision in word and in deed, so nothing comes from behind.

Nobody needs that to make good quality and quality is what counts....not what might be there between the lines.

I dared to pick up Your words but feeling pretty unsure if I got this right, hope You dont mind and still see the conversation with and of good will.

 You have some serious knowledge about the whole thing, I like this and respect this a lot.

with all due respect

Daniel

PS: that has nothing to do with the topic of Coyotebait, sorry man, that we went in and an off topic direction

 

Cheers

 

 

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Merry (almost) Christmas, Daniel

I don't think you should be worried about what Sly thought was insulting by using the word 'Bladesmithing'. The Heat Treating information is identical, whether you are a Bladesmith or a Blacksmith. I guess the Heat Treating information is identical, no matter what name you call yourself. I see this problem as a difference in languages. There is no problem!!

Enjoy the Journey, sometimes there are bumps in the road.

Neil

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On 12/24/2018 at 3:39 PM, swedefiddle said:

Merry (almost) Christmas, Daniel

I don't think you should be worried about what Sly thought was insulting by using the word 'Bladesmithing'. The Heat Treating information is identical, whether you are a Bladesmith or a Blacksmith. I guess the Heat Treating information is identical, no matter what name you call yourself. I see this problem as a difference in languages. There is no problem!!

Enjoy the Journey, sometimes there are bumps in the road.

Neil

Thank You for Your kind words, Neil.I appreciate them :)

Merry Christmas

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  • 2 weeks later...
On ‎12‎/‎23‎/‎2018 at 5:23 AM, templehound said:

A forged frying pan as "the inspiration" for making knives.....kinda cool:ph34r: 

The second knife is the serious one.

the first and the third are honorable efforts but ...Nr.one has only wrapped handle and like it looks just a fat uneven bevel on flatstock and Nr. three is still half a wrench that will turn in the hand while chopping....so my focus is on Nr2 as a developed knife.....that came out ok, mate.

still there are a lot of aspects to improve.Like  control over HT(you need a Thermometer!) understanding blade geometries(thinner edges, !) avoid fancy profiles like finger grooves like on Nr2 which is undeveloped ...keep it more! simple and so on....

Yeah, the first is kind of a train wreck, but like I said, it was the first thing to come out of the forge.  At that point all I had for gr4inding was a black and decker dragster belt grinder locked in a vice and the edge geometry was done by sight, and it was a poor estimation of angle.  I now have a 4x36 belt sander and am currently building a 2x72 grinder.

In regards to the heat treat, what kind of a thermometer can you use on a charcoal forge? I have been looking at infrareds but can't seem to find anything that goes high enough.  What I did on them all was used a magnet to check and then once it was not magnetic I soaked in the heat for a couple minutes and then quenched.  I am definitely open to more precise methods then the gamble with a magnet.

Thanks for all the replies guys, sorry I was away for so long.  Happy New Year!!

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