AR. Hillbilly Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 A Clay Spencer tire hammer to be exact. I make a lot of hooks n such. I’m wondering if I can draw and taper things very small with a tire hammer. Hope this is ok in this section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latticino Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Correct section as far as I know. I think that you can get there with practice. I've seen some very precise work done on a power hammer with use of the right technique and tooling. I think Clay Spencer has a online pamphlet on power hammer tooling that may help (he certainly is the expert for that hammer). On the other hand I certainly don't have that kind of skill at the moment. Yesterday I was trying to learn how to use the Big Blue 110 we have in the studio I meet at, and on occasion help teach in (Arc and Flame in Rochester, NY). Just not used to that kind of power, and the combination die made a quick thin ribbon of the middle of a integral handle blade I was experimenting with. Power hammers work faster, but they make mistakes way faster too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swedefiddle Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Good Morning, Learn manual control first. Most small things are way faster by hand. With a machine, you have the ability to magnify your weaknesses and make garbage at a really fast rate. A faster way to draw out something, is between 2 rollers. The rollers suck the heat out of your material, so you are back to, How fast can I make garbage. There is no one answer and there are multitudes of other answers. To start, you have to start. Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AR. Hillbilly Posted October 23, 2018 Author Share Posted October 23, 2018 Not trying to do anything faster. The ones that I make now I am very satisfied with. The fact that I’ve swung a hammer for 35 years for a living has left me with a weak shoulder. I can still make the hooks and small things by hand no problem. 5 years from now I don’t know. Im just curious what all I can do with this hammer when I get it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basher Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 there is very little one cant do with a power hammer (the rite power hammer) given some ingenuity and tooling. I do 90 % of my own forging on one and could most probably make that 100% with some time spent on tooling. I happily draw small knife tangs on a 110lb sahinla . below about 4mm by 2mm things get a bit tricky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Budd Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 I use a tyre hammer built by a British smith (Dave Preston) to a similar design as the Clay Spencer. I use it for much smaller things than I ever imagined I would, not because it is quicker but because I can do more of the donkey work on a larger number of items for a given amount of energy. I occasionally make batches of tools that are basically 6mm round spring steel drawn out into spikes over a 2" distance up the shaft. I can draw one out and round it to a fine point in 2 heats by hand, or two heats if the drawing to square is done under the hammer. The difference is that I can knock out a few dozen at a time without fatiguing or breaking a sweat if I use the power hammer. The key is to practice and accept that you'll waste work once in a while, especially as your skill is developing. As long as the wasted work is scrapped quickly and the overall time saved is sufficient, then it's all good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 You should be able to do most anything with a power hammer once you're practiced up with it. Oh sure you'll be doing some stuff by hand, say truing up finial scrolls or working in a closed space piening a rivet or tenon inside a scroll say. Most forging processes though go nicer if you don't have to swing the hammer yourself. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AR. Hillbilly Posted October 24, 2018 Author Share Posted October 24, 2018 Thanks for the input guys. I’m not as concerned with the cost of the hammer as I’m concerned with the real estate it requires being used in a positive way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason0012 Posted October 25, 2018 Share Posted October 25, 2018 Clifton would make coat hooks on his 250 pound Murray just to prove a point. As long as the hammer has decent control and runs predictably you should be able to work as delicate as need be. I haven't used a tire hammer but from what I see, this level of control looks pretty common on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swedefiddle Posted October 25, 2018 Share Posted October 25, 2018 Arr, Billy The Power Hammer doesn't make the Blacksmith, the Blacksmith makes the Power Hammer work. The point I was trying to get across earlier, Power anything, creates exaggerated Miss Steaks. You have to know how the Hand Hammer works, before, Power anything gets turned on. Some people never become comfortable with anything Powered. In Automobile Racing, you don't start with Grand National Racing (even though most people think they can), unless you have unlimited resources and a poor Accountant. I don't understand why you want to ask the world, if it is a good idea to buy/build a Tire Hammer. If you had good Hand Hammer control, you would already know your answer. Another waist of time. Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AR. Hillbilly Posted October 25, 2018 Author Share Posted October 25, 2018 6 hours ago, swedefiddle said: Arr, Billy The Power Hammer doesn't make the Blacksmith, the Blacksmith makes the Power Hammer work. The point I was trying to get across earlier, Power anything, creates exaggerated Miss Steaks. You have to know how the Hand Hammer works, before, Power anything gets turned on. Some people never become comfortable with anything Powered. In Automobile Racing, you don't start with Grand National Racing (even though most people think they can), unless you have unlimited resources and a poor Accountant. I don't understand why you want to ask the world, if it is a good idea to buy/build a Tire Hammer. If you had good Hand Hammer control, you would already know your answer. Another waist of time. Neil Son just so you know I was a dirt track racer and car builder from 1985 to 2005. I built several championship cars and won a couple myself. I started in a street stock and finished in a super stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 25, 2018 Share Posted October 25, 2018 And what would you tell a guy who wanders up and says he doesn't know how to drive but wants to win races---how should he go about doing that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotoMike Posted October 25, 2018 Share Posted October 25, 2018 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AR. Hillbilly Posted October 25, 2018 Author Share Posted October 25, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, ThomasPowers said: And what would you tell a guy who wanders up and says he doesn't know how to drive but wants to win races---how should he go about doing that? I would never assume anything about the guy without learning a little about his experience. Then I would try to give some positive advice. 45 minutes ago, MotoMike said: [video link removed] That is very impressive. Edited October 25, 2018 by Mod34 Excessive quoting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 18 hours ago, swedefiddle said: Arr, Billy I don't understand why you want to ask the world, if it is a good idea to buy/build a Tire Hammer. If you had good Hand Hammer control, you would already know your answer. Another waist of time. Neil I believe AR. Hillbilly was asking about how he might be able to use the power hammer inasmuch as his shoulder was becoming a problem...an alternative to some smithing, if you will. FYI, he is a member of our blacksmithing organization, a personal friend, and a pretty good smith to boot; and in addition to that has fine hammer control which you questioned....your comments bordered on a personal attack which violates terms of use on this forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judson Yaggy Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 8 hours ago, AR. Hillbilly said: I would never assume anything about the guy without learning a little about his experience. Then I would try to give some positive advice. Well said. Tire hammers if built to Clay's design are just fine. If you have experience and want to step up to the next level, they are a great place to start. Fair warning, there is a serious rabbit hole you can fall down when it comes to power hammers! (grin) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason0012 Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 True enough about the rabbit hole. I wouldn't discourage anyone from adding a small hammer. Perhaps if I thought they were getting in over their head, paying stupid money for a trashed machine, buying way too big ( like a 3000 pound steamer) or just not competant around machines. In general, anyone who can handle hand forging will find a power hammer a great asset. The tire hammers are a good affordable entry point. I think that is exactly what Clay had in mind with the design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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