Sudsii Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 So I looked up a video on YouTube and I watched abit didn’t really pay any attention and skipped most of it so that’s what my first xxxxx up was. So I got concrete and I had a metal barrel that used to hold industrial soap but it’s probably a 20L barrel and I made about a 1.5 inch bottom with a old tail pipe coming through the bottom so I can use air to make the coals hot and I made a 2 inch wall inside and I used a old patio step made from concrete for the top and drilled holes through it. Now my problem is I can’t melt anything not even a Pepsi can so I don’t know what to do can someone help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 You need to tell us more about what you want to accomplish so we can point you in the right direction. For casting please read Overview of metal casting for beginners For a forge (getting metal hot to hammer on at the anvil) please look up the JABOD (just a box of dirt) posts. Photos will be very helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sudsii Posted July 5, 2018 Author Share Posted July 5, 2018 Hey glen I am trying to melt metal to liquid form to put into a mold to make a tool I will change the title to foundry furnace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Then I suggest you read the first link. Then turn your attention to Smelting, Melting, Foundry, and Casting. There is lots of information there. One caution I will provide is wear full personal protective equipment, and have a Plan B in case anything goes wrong. Finding someone to learn from is a way to jump start your knowledge. Please add your location to your profile as there may be someone in your area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoggy Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 From your post above, you do not have, have not made a forge. It's a foundry furnace and I suspect it to be something like a Gngery Charcoal Foundry Furnace. Look it up on the internet or by his book for full information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Concrete is a massive heat sink and can spall at working temps for a foundry. So basically you have filled your car's gas tank with water and are wondering why it doesn't run. As I consider foundry work to be much more dangerous that blacksmithing I STRONGLY SUGGEST you learn what you trying to do before you end up matching Freddy Kruger scar for scar! Also there is a forum dedicated to foundry work: alloyavenue.com (used to be backyard metal casting.com) that may be a better place to learn as it's focused on casting like we are focused on smithing here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sudsii Posted July 5, 2018 Author Share Posted July 5, 2018 That is kinda why I’m here I’ve done abit of research but nobody says anything about concrete so now I know that won’t work but no should I do the plaster and Paris and sand mixture or should I do clay or fire bricks I do know I would really like to use the same barrel just take the concrete out and just re do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Actually we have said no concrete many many times here and that plaster of paris and sand is extremely terrible as well. I googled: concrete site:iforgeiron.com and plaster of paris site:iforgeiron.com And found this: "Posted March 8, 2009 Do not use concrete as the heat can cause it to spall throwing pieces of the concrete into your face." Plaster of paris had 105 hits when searched similarly; degrades at temperatures 1/3 to 1/4 that of forging and has low insulation value as well. (also starting in 2009...) Generally what we see is people saying they do not want to spend a few dollars to line a furnace correctly yet seem perfectly happy to spend many times that amount in extra fuel trying to make a non-insulative lining work. Everything you have mentioned as possible lining materials have little insulation value. I suggest you do due diligence in researching furnace construction and NOT rely on you-tube or other non-peer reviewed sources. If we are nobodies why are you seeking our advice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sudsii Posted July 5, 2018 Author Share Posted July 5, 2018 Thomas thank you for the advice but don’t be give me attitude I never said anyone was a nobody and I am just trying to figure of what’s the best thing to use and I haven’t been on this site for long (1 day ) so I don’t know how to use it that’s why I created a post to see if someone could give me a straight answer on what to use and I’ve read a lot of people use the plaster sand mixture and I already use concrete before I read anything so now I’m trying to restart and figure out what to use/ do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Sudsii, we encourage new people around here to read this first, it's pinned in the introduce yourself section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the iron dwarf Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Sudsii said: That is kinda why I’m here I’ve done abit of research but nobody says anything about concrete a quote from your post, most of us have told people many times about concrete and plaster of paris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 I apologize; I misconstrued: "but nobody says anything about concrete" ; I guess as this site has said lots about concrete and plaster of paris/sand we do not fit into that description. Have you checked out the forums at alloyavenue.com yet? Note as foundry work is dangerous; you may find that skilled people are unwilling to go out on a limb for people they may not feel comfortable with regards to their research and methodologies as we really don't want to help folks hurt themselves. (Especially in the USA with the liability issues we have.) Do you have a shrink rule? As, save for certain alloys, castings are smaller than their molds due to shrinking of the metal while cooling. (This can be an issue when people are trying to duplicate an item exactly from an original.) GB&TFATF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the iron dwarf Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 35 minutes ago, Sudsii said: ’ve read a lot of people use the plaster sand mixture and I already use concrete before I read anything so now I’m trying to restart and figure out Most of the things on youtube are wrong and a lot of them are dangerous ANYTHING BY 'KING OF RANDOM' MAY EVEN KILL YOU do not rely on false information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 IForgeIron pushes safety first. We can provide information on many subjects. Casting and foundry are specialized processes which can get you injured or killed unless you know what to do. This is a general caution to anyone working with molten metal. As Thomas said, Have you checked out the forums at alloyavenue yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sudsii Posted July 5, 2018 Author Share Posted July 5, 2018 Okay so thank you I haven’t even got to the mood yet cause I want to make sure I can melt first but as u can see in the pictures that’s what I first made and I got mad and started to take it apart and in the other two pictures I have a tiger torch and a hot plate so I’m thinking about making the next one a gas forge but still could someone just tell me what I should make my walls out of just a simply one word answer cause I want to start it ASAP cause I would like to move onto figureing out the mold 1 minute ago, Glenn said: IForgeIron pushes safety first. We can provide information on many subjects. Casting and foundry are specialized processes which can get you injured or killed unless you know what to do. This is a general caution to anyone working with molten metal. As Thomas said, Have you checked out the forums at alloyavenue yet? No I haven’t I tried signing up to the website but never got email confirmation and just gave up but I have the safety thing covered to a point. My brother n law is a diesel machanic at Volvo and he got my welding gloves and I have a jacket that a buddy used to use while working at custom casting for heat resistance and safety Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 One word answers will do you a disservice. First read Ceramic Wool Insulation, Safety Alert Read the gas forges section with particular attention to refractories, and other insulation materials. This should provide some base information to help you understand the additional material you need to read on the subject. One additional caution is there is a very large difference between and ounce of so of molten liquid and several pounds of molten liquid. There is also a very large difference in the types of metal that us used for the melt. Composition, melting temperatures, and pouring temperatures are very important to the process and the final result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzkill Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 While I understand your frustration with what seems to you as a lack of straight answers, it's just not that simple. We still don't know where in the world you are. Thousands of people from around 150 countries participate here. What may be available to one person down the street may not be available at all in another country. The normally recommended lining system for gas powered forges/kilns/foundries is not a one word answer or description. There are multiple layers that should be applied in the correct order and each of those layers should be handled correctly in order to get the desired result. I've only done a minor amount of casting, but it appears to me you would benefit from some further research/reading regarding both the foundry body construction and burner construction. These are things that have been covered quite a few times on this site and are also a main point of focus of the other site already mentioned. Rather than type all of these things out yet again, we're asking you to spend a little time reading what has already been written many times in great detail to help you get headed in the right direction. We want you to succeed and we want you to be safe. However, we do not want to type everything out again since it is already there for you to read. Without speaking for anyone else, I'm a little concerned that your desire to start pouring molten metal is overpowering your sense of caution and/or safety. It's not uncommon and many of us have scars to show for it. We'd prefer that you don't repeat our mistakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sudsii Posted July 5, 2018 Author Share Posted July 5, 2018 Oh okay and by the way I live in Winnipeg Manitoba Canada Okay see this is why a lot of people use YouTube. It’s easy to navigate and you can get what you need and see what is happening. I’ve read afew threads now and heard people talk about forge 101 yet I can’t find it I’ve searched up building a gas forge can’t find anything I’ve tried just a generic search of building forge nothing it just keeps bringing up the same ones I’ve seen multiple times over and that have nothing to do with what I want like one was welding in a forge so this is why I try to ask Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzkill Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Here you go: https://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/47439-forges-101/ And for burners: https://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/46536-burners-101/ FWIW, they are both pinned to the top of the Gas Forges subsection of the forum. You'll probably need a comfy chair, some snacks, and a cool beverage to wade through those, but if you do you should have a better idea of what makes a good forge body and good burner. Although a forge and a foundry have different purposes and somewhat different designs, the lining used in the interior will work well in either case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 IForgeIron is divided into sections by subject. Forges > Gas Forges is what you are looking for. Several of the links you seek are Forges 101, Burners 101, T Burner Illustrated Directions, Gas Forges Main Link There is no quick answer or quick way to get started. You have to do some homework, read everything you can, and ask question to verify and understand what you learned. You must do it safely as liquid metal is unforgiving. Be sure to have a plan B, that works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Sudsii, the READ THIS FIRST post has excellent advice on how to search the forum for the information you need. Yes, it’s very easy to navigate YouTube. The downside is that some — even a lot — of what you find there is obsolete, inaccurate, or downright dangerous. It may take a little while to figure out how to navigate IFI, but at least you get reliable information that won’t kill you. Stop expecting instant gratification, and your patience will be well rewarded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Sells Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 the Read this first thread is posted in the required reading to join., I am sure he must have read it already Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sudsii Posted July 5, 2018 Author Share Posted July 5, 2018 So I’ll give a little back story on my life so you realize where I’m coming from. I’m 17 I’ve work construction I’ve done sandblasting I’ve worked machanical and I’ve driven tractors for awhile and even worked retail at Walmart I’ve almost fail English every year because I hate reading. Reading is useless in my generation because everything is digital like I buy audio books when I need to do a book report etc so that’s where I’m coming from a person that hates reading and doing this is more of a hassle then anything else and I learn from watching not reading so have this stuff doesn’t help my understanding and I’m trying my hardest but this doesn’t work for me and maybe this forum isn’t for me. I’ll give you guys some advice now, why don’t u go make your own YouTube video show everyone the proper way and link it on here. People hate reading and listen helps a lot and if you made a video and it’s the right way to do it and it’s a good video you could make money easily and that could help you upgrand your forges I’m just saying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Sells Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 learn to read if you want to learn anything substantial Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Almost all of human knowledge is NOT on YouTube. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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