Elapid Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 I’m mainly a woodworker but I often make my own tools out of annealed O1 tool steel I buy and then I heat treat them with an acetylene torch. I’d like to build something closer to a Forge to use both for heat treating and to try some forging. I don’t have any experience with Forge building other than back when I was a teenage mad scientist I got hold of a large steel artillery shell, drilled a hole in the base and put a blower in it which allowed me to burn a charge of charcoal in it at enormous temperature. Recently the propane heater in my shop went out due to electrical board ignition problems. I put in a new heater but now I’m thinking the burner setup in the old one might be salvaged and converted to a Forge. There are 5 burners with Venturi tubes. The whole unit has a rating of 75,000 BTU. The burners with tubes as well as the regulator can be removed as one piece. It’s spark igniters could be activated manually with an ignition coil. The blower could be salvaged as well. I would use steel plate as a housing. Does this sound like a workable plan or should I start from scratch? i will try to post pix of old heater burners Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Binesman Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 A single 3/4" forge burner can usualy reach 150k btu. I dont know jack about furnaces but im guessing the differance in heat means the burner design is way off from what you want for a forge. Start from scratch you can make a frosty burner for about 20US and if you post pictures he will most likely help you tune it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 I'm not a gas forge gurue nor a furness tech so my input may be for not. I know that a simple 3/4" black pipe nipple, 1" into 3/4" "T" a mig welder tip and a 1/8" brass flare fiting make up a "T" burner that will work, how the gas burners will work when you go from inches of water column to feet of water column I don't know. It may be worth the experiment. Otherwise build a wood box, insert a 3/4" black pipe tuyere, fill with dirt and atach a $5 double action bed/raft inflator pump. Walla, improved charcoal forge (lump not brickets) as a woodworker you can then improve it buy building a box belows, tear drop or constantina bellows (they just look cooler). I'm not a gas forge gurue nor a furness tech so my input may be for not. be warned, you won't be the first woodworker to be lured in by the black arts... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 It would be interesting to experiment with the salvaged burners. It would be practical to listen to their advice instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elapid Posted November 19, 2017 Author Share Posted November 19, 2017 I had a suspicion that using the 5 burners would not work properly which I am asking the experts. But it looks like such a nice unit I couldn’t just throw it out. What if I just build a heat treating oven to get blades and shafts to around 1900F and quench them? Or is that no better and I should just throw the burners and regulator out and use a proven design? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 My recondition would be to build a proven desighned burner and forge, then let's see what the burnerners from the fernace do. First natural gas and propane fernaces work at much lower pressures, and as natural gas and propain have different BTU per mole so switching from natural gas to propane may require jet changes. You may make it work, but untile then you will have a proven forge You will also have a high pressure regulator and such to help in your experiments Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elapid Posted November 20, 2017 Author Share Posted November 20, 2017 You are correct about the different heat content between natural gas and LP but when I first installed the furnace in my workshop 6 years ago I bought an LP conversion kit from the manufacturer and installed it. It involves changing all 5 jets and putting in a new pressure regulating spring. Then I used a homemade mannometer to set the pressure to spec which is 10” of water. So it’s all set to go from that standpoint. But it does sound like I should start with a conventional design and store the heater burners for another use. I sure hate to throw them away. Thanks for the help and advise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 A home appliance pressure regulator is much lower pressure than a forge high pressure regulator. 5-15 psi vs .25 psi. This is part of the reason why I recommended building a 3/4" "T" burner. It's a cheap, easy and proven design and Jerry is usualy more than willing to look at pictures and help you tune it. Then you can use your high pressure regulator to experiment and see how your burners perform. I honestly think you have a worth wile experiment on your hands, but I also want to get you up and running with a usable forge that you can use to compare your Franken furnace against. If you put 5 psi to tat burner assembly it should sound like a Pegasus engine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 Welcome aboard, glad to have you. If you'll put your general location in the header you might be surprised how many of the gang live within visiting distance. There is a lot of forge potential in those burners but the length of the gang would make for an inconvenient forge. I'd be thinking of changing the manifold so I could group the burners more conveniently. One really attractive detail is those are low velocity output which means keeping the fire in the forge longer for more heat exchange. However that's a tinkerer talking not someone who wants to put together a working forge and get to working. My practicalest suggestion would be to pick ONE set of plans and follow them for everything in your shop. One burner plan, one forge plan, One anvil stand, vise stand, bench, etc. etc. I'd just keep things mobile till you've learned the craft to a point you know what works best for you. Oh Charles is right as usual, if you run into problems building or tuning a burner Mike or I will be around. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 See, we don't necisaraly think you have a bad idea, it's a great idea to experiment with but it's frustrating when a forge dosnt work and you are trying to figure out why. That's why we are suggesting that $10 in pipe fittings and an afternoons work will set you up with a proven burner, and generally even if you order small amounts of Material from Wayne to build the forge it's self you end up with enugh leftover for a second one (franken burner friendly) if as Jerry suggests you try and reconfigure the manifold that the jets need to be dead center of the burner tubes. And on the heat treat oven, many knife and sword makers have gone vertical for hardening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 Proven burners are sooooo nice when it comes time to tune your forge... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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