LB47 Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 I have an old anvil that I aquired back in 1980-81. I have started looking on u-tub about blacksmithing. I would like to know more about my anvil. Any information I could get would be great. Has a Trenton LOGO (i think) on the side of it. See pictures. Also a series of numbers under the horn on the base. W 85 A830 48 (i think) The hardie hole is 1' X 1-3/8" looks like someone drilled it out to inlarge it. This anvil has been abused before I got it and I have used it when I needed it. Good anvil. Thinks for your help on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Geist Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Nice one, Thanks for reporting the abuse to the SPCA. Hope you'll give it a good forever home. George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Welcome aboard LB, glad to have you. If you'll put your general location in the header you might be surprised how many of the gang live within visiting distance. Good rescue, rescued anvils never forget and your Karma has scored bonus points. How are it's edges? It's hard to see in the pics. Trentons are good anvils, good score. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 The hardy does look modified; you can modify it back or use an insert or just make your hardy tools to match---and not worry about them getting mixed up with someone else's tools at a multismith demo! Please do not allow anyone to grind or mill on the face!!!! The thickness of the hardened face is limited removing any of it is MAJOR ABUSE in almost every case. We have seen people take perfectly usable anvils and turn them into unusable decor items by removing the usable face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Geist Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Just curious, of all reported and unreported cases of anvil abuse and cruelty, I believe this is an unprecedented butchering of a hardy hole? Can anybody imagine what in the world that could have been done for? Glad to see that good old anvil withstood the torture and didn't break under questioning. George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB47 Posted September 7, 2017 Author Share Posted September 7, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Frosty said: Welcome aboard LB, glad to have you. If you'll put your general location in the header you might be surprised how many of the gang live within visiting distance. Good rescue, rescued anvils never forget and your Karma has scored bonus points. How are it's edges? It's hard to see in the pics. Trentons are good anvils, good score. Frosty The Lucky. How do I get back to my header to update it? The top is in OK shape, the edges are rounded off with one broken corner. 50 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said: The hardy does look modified; you can modify it back or use an insert or just make your hardy tools to match---and not worry about them getting mixed up with someone else's tools at a multismith demo! Please do not allow anyone to grind or mill on the face!!!! The thickness of the hardened face is limited removing any of it is MAJOR ABUSE in almost every case. We have seen people take perfectly usable anvils and turn them into unusable decor items by removing the usable face. Mr Powers I am in New Mexico (Just North of Santa Fe) I am not concerned with the hardy hole. I would like the edges to be square, which they are not. What should I do about the edges. One corner is chiped and both edges have gouges in them, Some advice for me? Edited September 7, 2017 by LB47 More info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 You Do NOT want square, sharp, crisp edges. That is how you get cold shunts. Sharp inside corners on bends are where cracks start. Anvil edges should be rounded. Mine are acualy rounded from 1" radie at the heals to 1/4" at the front (the clip horn is about 1/8" A clearer picture of the face and edges would be helpful for us. a note, welding on anvils takes exacting methods and materials, otherwise you will damage it. So unless it has major damage (chiped edges do not qualify) do not weld on it! As to grinding, except in the case of reliving sharp edges on new anvils do not grind on an anvil, use it for a year, some defects become valuable features as you learn to use an anvil after at least a year (300-400 hrs) of use you will have learned enugh to evaluate what you need to do. Not to be offensive, but right now it sounds like you need to learn enugh to be considered ignorant about blacksmithing and anvils. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 You found the header, good deal. It takes longer to type directions than it does to edit. Square edges aren't that desirable, can be bad in fact as they cause stress risers when forging shoulders. Varying radius are much better but don't go grinding or welding on it at least till you have some of the old hands take a gander. You can NOT weld on a heat treated piece of high carbon steel without risking damage in the HAZ. (Heat Affect Zone) If you're going to use that fine old lady you want her in as good a shape as possible. Yes? There are bottom tools that will provide any shape edge or face you want or need and not effect the anvil's face at all. May we see some pics of the edges and face please? Oblique or diffuse light is best for showing dings, dents, etc. and not glare out the pic with reflected light. From what I can see I'd build a better stand and put her right to work. Do a rebound test to see if there's hidden damage, delamination of the face plate from the wrought iron body or HAZ damage around the hardy hole. Damage to the heat treat around the hardy hole isn't too serious as you don't do much heavy work around it. A rebound test is easy, drop a ball bearing I carry a 1/2" ball in my pocket though lots of guys like 1" ball bearings for some reason, easier to find when they get away from you I guess. Anyway, drop the bearing on the clean face and estimate how far it bounces back, rebounds. Gussitimate the % of rebound. If you use a ruler, drop from the 10" mark and eyeball the rebound you'll have as good as necessarily precision. A light smooth faced hammer I carry a 4oz. ball pein in the pickup for testing. It takes more experience to judge a relatively accurate rebound % but it's darned lot faster to look and listen for dead spots on the face. Tap a pattern over the entire face, expect rebound and tone to fall off gradually as you test towards the heal and horn, that's normal. What you're looking for is abrupt changes in rebound and sound. ting to thwap is a RED FLAG. Expect some thwaping around the hardy hole if it's been torched out. If it was drilled and filed it should just taper around it. More pics please. Till then PLEASE NO GRINDING OR WELDING! Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Have you talked with Frank Turley in Santa Fe? He has a world renowned smithing school there! http://www.turleyforge.com/ Also the New Mexico Artist Blacksmith Association sometimes have had meetings in the Santa Fe area, (not to mention one in Rowe!) www.nm-artist-blacksmiths.org/ If you are ever down my way (either place) let me know and we can try to meet up! (If I'm in Socorro NM we can go to the local scrapyard!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB47 Posted September 7, 2017 Author Share Posted September 7, 2017 1 hour ago, Frosty said: You found the header, good deal. It takes longer to type directions than it does to edit. Square edges aren't that desirable, can be bad in fact as they cause stress risers when forging shoulders. Varying radius are much better but don't go grinding or welding on it at least till you have some of the old hands take a gander. You can NOT weld on a heat treated piece of high carbon steel without risking damage in the HAZ. (Heat Affect Zone) If you're going to use that fine old lady you want her in as good a shape as possible. Yes? There are bottom tools that will provide any shape edge or face you want or need and not effect the anvil's face at all. May we see some pics of the edges and face please? Oblique or diffuse light is best for showing dings, dents, etc. and not glare out the pic with reflected light. From what I can see I'd build a better stand and put her right to work. Do a rebound test to see if there's hidden damage, delamination of the face plate from the wrought iron body or HAZ damage around the hardy hole. Damage to the heat treat around the hardy hole isn't too serious as you don't do much heavy work around it. A rebound test is easy, drop a ball bearing I carry a 1/2" ball in my pocket though lots of guys like 1" ball bearings for some reason, easier to find when they get away from you I guess. Anyway, drop the bearing on the clean face and estimate how far it bounces back, rebounds. Gussitimate the % of rebound. If you use a ruler, drop from the 10" mark and eyeball the rebound you'll have as good as necessarily precision. A light smooth faced hammer I carry a 4oz. ball pein in the pickup for testing. It takes more experience to judge a relatively accurate rebound % but it's darned lot faster to look and listen for dead spots on the face. Tap a pattern over the entire face, expect rebound and tone to fall off gradually as you test towards the heal and horn, that's normal. What you're looking for is abrupt changes in rebound and sound. ting to thwap is a RED FLAG. Expect some thwaping around the hardy hole if it's been torched out. If it was drilled and filed it should just taper around it. More pics please. Till then PLEASE NO GRINDING OR WELDING! Frosty The Lucky. Just now, LB47 said: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Does not look 1/2 bad, honestly. Other than astetics that's a perfectly usable tool. Am I right in seeing a rectangular Hardy hole or is it just a 3" face with a 1" hole and an optical illusion? It will be a wile before you develop the hammer control to forge smooth enugh that the dings will effect your work, and other than knife making the public expects a marked finish. no more sanding disks on the face, ok? The proper way to polish the face of an anvil is with hot steel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 From your pictures, I don't see any real damage just good honest work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Well I'd consider the hardy hole mod to be damage... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Geist Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 28 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said: Well I'd consider the hardy hole mod to be damage... Along with the telltale scars of an angle grinder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Is there a chance that hardy hole was a custom order from the factory? I don't see anything I'd want to repair. Give it a couple years of use and see what you think then. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB47 Posted September 7, 2017 Author Share Posted September 7, 2017 1 hour ago, Charles R. Stevens said: Does not look 1/2 bad, honestly. Other than astetics that's a perfectly usable tool. Am I right in seeing a rectangular Hardy hole or is it just a 3" face with a 1" hole and an optical illusion? It will be a wile before you develop the hammer control to forge smooth enugh that the dings will effect your work, and other than knife making the public expects a marked finish. no more sanding disks on the face, ok? The proper way to polish the face of an anvil is with hot steel. Charles, The hardy hole is 1" X 1-3/8" and I will try to refrain from trying to clean it up. Thanks for all the comments. Does anyone have any info on the # W85 A 830 48. How old, whwer built? Etc 27 minutes ago, Frosty said: Is there a chance that hardy hole was a custom order from the factory? I don't see anything I'd want to repair. Give it a couple years of use and see what you think then. Frosty The Lucky. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 I believe it was made in Columbus Ohio, USA. Trenton with the caplet depression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 I would be proud of that anvil. And TP is right, no fear of having your hardy tools walk off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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