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I Forge Iron

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1 hour ago, jrmysell said:

old springs

Just want to remention a warning of the dangers of getting springs off of struts. (Have a professional do it). There is wicked dangerous energy pent up in them. 

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What DAS and Randy just said.....There are plenty of youtube videos out there showing what can happen when disassembling strut assemblies without the proper tooling/equipment and experience....saw one that shot out of a shop bay door, across the parking lot and through a parked car door.

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i recently pulled strut springs off a pair and luckily my father was there to stop me or i might not be here with the proper tools is safe. without it can kill you

on a side note i got 2 fix up snow machines today a 500 and a 440cc hope to post pict tomorrow

M.J.Lampert

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The cheap do it your self strut spring disassembly tools are dangerous.  Take it to a auto shop that has the proper tools and knowledge on how to use them.  Give them the strut and then leave to purchase lunch for you both.

Once you have the spring loose, consider why they replaced the spring and shock (strut).  How many cycles has that spring gone through in its lifetime.  Does it have microfractures in the metal?  What type metal is the spring made from and do you really need an unknown type metal that you have a guess at how to heat treat or temper.

After spending several hours (days) making a nice project and with the last hammer blow, hearing the metal fail and one piece hit the floor with a "tink" sound is a valuable lesson.

You can purchase a know metal of the size you need that should come with heat treating and tempering instructions. Another plus is that it comes straight to begin with.

Do not guess at the price, call and ask for the price of the metal you need in the size you want.  Then use that known cost in the list of consideration for you decision.

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On 8/16/2021 at 3:39 PM, Frosty said:

Frosty pro tip regarding lathes. Don't study the manual and try to figure out what all the tooling you got is for!

I advise you NOT to use the automatic feeds until you have a decent handle on running your lathe.

Thanks for the advice Frosty. I'm not new to machining (far from coinciding myself a good machinist) I worked for two years as a machinist making suppressors on CNC machines, then another 2.5 years as a millwright running manual lathes and mills. Where my knowledge lacks is in the tooling itself. All of my experience is with carbide insert tools, so the different shaped cutters and bars and old style tool holders are what I need to get figured out. Not hard, it's just gonna take time to learn how to use sharpen/shape them. 

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If you plan on using the lathe on a regular basis, consider getting yourself some quick change tool holders - Aloris is the big name but big dollars - there are many other makers as well and most interchange including some Chinese imports.   You probably know about these already given your past experience.  While the lantern type tool post and rocker type tool holders work, they are slow to change between specific cutting bits.

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The loot from a quick stop at the industrial surplus place: a cordless angle grinder (which should make runs to the steelyard easier), a couple dozen pairs of hearing protectors for my tailgating table at Quad-State, and a large bin of semi-random steel brackets, bolts, hose, and mechanical bits. Not yet sure what I’ll do with the  last, but I couldn’t pass it up at $1.99!

56FC4234-8298-4AA5-8042-AC047CD9B746.jpeg

35C4A8C8-E5BF-4487-9AE8-316A66C5D4F3.jpeg

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Wow I ran across a manufacturer selling hardies with a 3/4" stem on A*; made from "specially forged top quality cold rolled 1018 steel"!  "High temperature resistance" "Won't crack or break".

I guess they are fishing in the shallow end of the pool...

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11 hours ago, Cannon Cocker said:

All of my experience is with carbide insert tools, so the different shaped cutters and bars and old style tool holders are what I need to get figured out. Not hard, it's just gonna take time to learn how to use sharpen/shape them. 

I don't have any of the numbers or angles in reliable memory. 5* for carbide and IIRC 15* for HSS bits. Find an older machinery handbook but not older than say the 1970s  or you start seeing some really extreme relief ground into bits. 

All the relief a cutter needs is enough it doesn't drag under the edge and the face has enough angle to direct the shaving away from the bit.

I get a little jumpy when somebody new tries figuring out a piece of equipment that can bite you in so many sneaky ways. I don't have to sweat you running the lathe though. I can relax.

Frosty The Lucky.

 

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Just keep your fingers out of the way. ;)

I prefer to grind my own tool bits.  I can get what I need that way.  I also don't much care for quick change tool post.  While four sided, the set up takes the same amount of time when changing tools.  (but then I learned on machines built at the turn of the century late 1800s-early 1900s)

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2 hours ago, bluerooster said:

Just keep your fingers out of the way

I have always believed that the lathe is THE most dangerous shop tool out there. I'm always conscious of the fast spinny parts because of how fast they can grab you and ruin your life. So after bringing it home I had a very serious talk with the kids explaining the dangers of the machine and telling them under no uncertain terms they were to never touch it unless I told them they could. Then I showed them a (very mild) video of a guy getting wrapped up in a lathe to drive the point home. I also want to put a lock out on it so they can't adventure when no one is watching. 

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Lathes are dangerous alright but I still say a buffer or wire wheel is more dangerous. Close but I think a lathe is edged out.

A good safety "lockout" is to run the lathe's power through a fusebox and pull the fuse if you aren't using it. I used to keep the guy who "took a class" from screwing with the lathe in the shop by moving the gear selectors to a neutral position. 

When he'd try and turn something and it didn't come out right he'd start adjusting the lathe. In no time the tailstock was 10* out, the cross and final feeds were both adjusted several degrees out of true. Seems he couldn't figure out why he couldn't turn 36" of 1/2" round to 3/8" and keep it straight. He even bought a new bit himself and instead of cutting it barrel shape like his dull bit did, his new sharp one cut a spindle. He adjusted everything he could find. The lathe was worn out. Obviously, he'd taken a class.

The follower was in the cabinet under the tail stock. 

I've got to stop, there are just too many stories about him and how poor an operator he was let alone a driller. 

Frosty The Lucky.

 

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I am not sure if we are talking about the same kind of tool holder/tool post.  While the tool post is square they are typically used with just one tool at a time.  The tool holder is set up with a particular cutting tool bit, left hand, right hand,  threading, cut off, boring etc. to be at the right height and they are locked into place on the tool post by a lever and piston.  Turn the lever and lift the tool holder out and replace with the tool for the next operation and lock it in place by turning the lever.  It is that quick to change to tools.  I have maybe ten holders set up with different bits and it.  I made this video to convince a friend that is what he needed in place of the lantern type tool post.

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Back in high school, our carpentry teacher would give the safety talk at the start of nearly every week. He had zero tolerance for just about anything, especially the lathes. He would always show a large tuff of hair from a girl who thought it was more important to look good than be safe around equipment and her hair got caught up in the drill press and ripped a giant chunk of her hair out.

I remember one class me and 3 others were working on the lathes making bowls for our projects as we were the only ones brave enough to work on them. Well one guy didn't quite let his pieces glue dry enough and when he fired the lathe up, the piece split in two and one half went flying across the shop at probably 50 miles and hour barely missing a person. Needless to say, the teacher wouldn't let him use the lathe anymore unless he personally inspected his work that was going onto it. 

I miss that woodworking class, but now I prefer banging on metal :lol:

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12 hours ago, Cannon Cocker said:

I also want to put a lock out on it so they can't adventure when no one is watching. 

Luckily the timing lined up that when my dad was building his wood shop he also had new grandkids. He wired all of his shop power through a disconnect that always stays off unless he is out there working so no little hands can accidentally turn on any power tools (lighting and one convivence outlet are wired to the main panel.) While this won't help you if your kids are old enough to throw the disconnect switch I thought it was a great idea and plan to incorporate something similar when I build my wood shop next year. I would think you should be able to incorporate a disconnect with a standard lock out/tag out devise for your lathe. 

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I think the lathe beats the wire wheel because although a wire wheel can hurt you bad it can't suck you in one side and spit you it the other looking like an empty tube of toothpaste!  For now I'll get one of those lockable plug covers to keep the kids from doing an imitation of used dental supplies. 

I won't be using this enough to need the fancy quick change tool holder. Plus I think I'll enjoy shaping my own cutters. I like to do as much on my own as possible for my projects. Unless my income depends on it. Then I'm all about saving time!

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A wire wheel or buff sure can if they're large enough. Lathes tend to just rip pieces off and scatter them. I think drill presses get more people, though not so badly, ripping a patch of scalp off is just tuition for rotary tool wake up school. 

Wire brushes on angle grinders are up there too, they rarely injure a person fatally but can remove flesh to and into bone. 

I can't take any power tool for granted, they're all dangerous some just more so. I get carried away.

Jer

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Wire brushes on angle grinders can be scary stuff yeah, my wake up moment with that thing was when it grabbed and got stuck in my sweater while working. Managed to turn it off before it ripped through but things like that wake you up on safety.

~Jobtiel

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Hopefully machine tools like lathes and mills will have the operators generally a bit more trained whereas the wire wheel, angle grinder and drill press are often bought and used by people with little or no training.

I knew an armourmaker that had a massive 5hp buffer he used for polishing armour; scared the fewmets out of me as if anything went wrong it wouldn't even notice the flying body parts.  In contrast the swordmaker I worked with had an underpowered belt driven buffer.  It took longer to buff out a blade; but if anything went wrong; you could freeze up on it and you could choke it down till it stopped or the belt slipped---much less exciting than having several feet of razor sharp steel flying about in your personal space.

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I now live in mortal fear of my table saw and angle grinder.  :ph34r:

kinda makes me glad I don't have more power tools.

OK, yeah, it's a serious respect thing for me.  one second of inattention is all it takes to have a really bad day.  If you behave like your power tools can and will try to kill you you will hopefully never have that one second.  We had a lady where I worked ages ago get her hand caught in the die of 20 ton steel press when she knelt down to pick something up, and didn't take her foot off the pedal.  there wasn't enough of her hand to reattach.

So just remember kids, your tools are actively trying to murder you, take necessary precautions.

 

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My old woodworking teacher always said that you should never fear a machine, but you should always respect what it can do. Fear, he would say, makes you stiff and slow, but respect will guide you to use the machine carefully and effectively.

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