Joel OF

Urgent, time vs money dilema

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I just realized I may have misunderstood your question about the aggregate.  If you mean how far out to build up the ground when you backfill, then yes, you do want to extend out from the actual building location by at least a couple feet.  In my case, I also extended out much more on one side, to create a less steep slope connecting with my existing driveway so I would have a much easier time backing my truck in to unload coal and steel.  After you get to about a foot from the building, you can slope it down to make it look nicer, and a gentle slope is more resistant to erosion than an abrupt one.  I planted grass on mine right away to help resist erosion, as well.

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What about Konex boxes? All steel, alter 'em with a cutting torch, weld on another later. No dirt floor either. Shallow roof and not much width, but the width could be changed with overhangs and cut doors later...

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What about Konex boxes? All steel, alter 'em with a cutting torch, weld on another later. No dirt floor either. Shallow roof and not much width, but the width could be changed with overhangs and cut doors later...

Certainly have had that thought but I also hear that in the UK condensation can be a problem with them.

 

I know which direction I'm going now...for all my "supporting dying trades" ideologies and using local coppiced chestnut, I showed a mate who is a traditional timber framer, (I mean English medieval framing techniques, a guy who really knows his stuff), a cruck frame design I was working towards and he instantly said that it would take a long time and be difficult and expensive and that if I went with bog standard 3x2 he could build it in 2 days...so I'm going with that haha.

 

This is the cruck frame I showed him, he said he'd love to do it because it would be fun but for my own sake he said go bog standard. http://www.wholewoods.co.uk/page.cfm?pageid=ww-timberframe

 

EDIT - I should have said that he said it would be difficult because I wanted alernating clear/black onduline on the roof, and that would affect the rafters somehow...but I didn't really understand that bit because the lingo went over my head.

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Well the cruck frame would certainly be interesting.  As for the rest, can you translate into Appalachian Hillbilly so's I can ken it? :D

Cruck frame I know from the link but what is bog standard 3x2, and onduline? I am pretty sure I know it in different terms.

Sounds like you've got it in the bag now though, so good for you!  Be sure to give us some pics!

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Yeah, Grizzer I am an Appalachian American myself, though transplanted to Mississippi.
I did like the cruck, but lost on the rest. Mr Kurgan please tell us about these interesting items.

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"Ken"- I thought that was Scottish colloquialism as I'd only ever heard my Scottish cousins use it before, interesting.

 

Onduline is a roofing material like corrugated tin but it is fiberous, it's lightweight and comes in a variety of colours. I'd want black onduline interspersed with clear plastic corrugated panels to let light through from above.

 

3x2...*drum roll*................................3inch x 2inch timber :)

Back when I used to watch WWF wrestling as a kid, Cactus Jack used to cheat and hit people with a 3foot length of timber that Good Ol' JR, the commentator, called "4 by 4". I guessed that one of the 4s meant 4inch diameter but the other 4 really confused me because I was thought he meant 4inch length...I used to think "what is this guy on about?! That bit of wood isn't 4 inches long!"

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Kurgan, Appalachia IS still mostly Scotch-Irish, and has been since George Washington said that if the Redcoats took the coast, he would retreat and regroup to the hills and hollows, and harry the invaders for decades. Indeed, the War of Independence was a stalemate for 4 years, until the backwoodsmen of the South got involved, then it was over in a year.

 

There are more Gaelic names in the census within 150 miles of my home than in all of Scotland and Ireland today. Every school group outside the big cities has a sprinkling of pure-bred pale freckled red-headed children.

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This world of the internet is amaizing isn't it. I had never heard of a conex box.... Google and wow!!!! a common old garden shipping container!

 

Kurgan,. I would humbly sujest that you first "trench" your site with a mini digger that is along the lines of highest to lowest area, the "trenches should be about 600x600mm but the trenchers bucket is probably the best bet (a small pel job/ Volvo has a 600 bucket) line the trench with bidum(geofabric, shadecloth will work as a cheap alternative) then fill with hardcore(this is a builders term for broken bricks ,stones & bits of concrete it should contain no fines ie. nothing smaller than a pea.  Imagine if you will that you are creating a giant stone sausage to drain water away , the Bidum is to prevent the "sausage" from silting up with sand and clay.then use hardcore to level the site. use a compactor(rented) to level and compact( it will also help to keep the floor dry.) Another option to keep costs down is to put down some polystyrene sheets(think of asking your local fish dept in the supermarket for the polystyrene fish boxes and cut them up)then some sheet plastic. on top of this "pave" with used bricks as your floor.

 

Good luck Ian

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Appalachia IS still mostly Scotch-Irish,

 

Reminds me of a joke: "Why's the grass greener in Ireland? Because they're all over here walking on ours." Boom-boom chaaar.

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Don't get us started! lol

So 3x2 is the size, I assume "bog standard" is an expression similar to our "run of the mill" then, and you've decided to just go with standard framing.

I'm trying to recall who said something along the lines of "America and England are two countries separated by a common language". :)

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It may be worth checking building materials on E-Bay, 

Because the building trade is in the doldrums there is usually a lot of materials going cheap - Ie drainage and inspection chambers etc

Try a 10 or 25 mile radius from your post code

Wayne

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Definitely Wayne!

On 2/15/2013 at 9:18 AM, Grizzer said:

I'm trying to recall who said something along the lines of "America and England are two countries separated by a common language". :) 

 

Very true. Yep "bog standard" is the same as "run of the mill". Al Murray, a comedian who's character is a pub landlord says that "Britain and America are divided by a common language, and a massive ocean.".  :P

 

On 2/15/2013 at 5:54 AM, ianinsa said:

 stone sausage

LOVE IT.

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Kurgan, a cruck frame smithy would be lovely though!!!! Did you ever watch the Grand Designs woodland house episode?? Amazing!!!

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EDIT - ignore what's below, I would just delete the post but I don't know how to. I've found a couple reasons not to do what it says below.

 

Can anyone find anything wrong with this idea?... I was thinking of ways to "pre-fab" my post footings and I remembered that my Dad has a load of old plastic tubs that are about 2 feet deep and about a foot and a half wide, I could put the posts in them and pour the concrete in and let it set, then another day I'd dig the holes to the match the tub dimensions and just drop the tub/post combo in. I've done my research and for my area the post footings don't need to be more than 2 foot deep and the only other thing I read is that the footing diameter should be one and a half times the diameter of the post...which this certainly will be. Normally when I get an idea it's rubbish, but this actually sounds ok?!?!

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Mr Kurgan, I wish I could travel over there and help you build this shop. Last Saturday five of us from Fire in the Swamp got together and built a 16' X 24' pole building and today me and my two sons built a 10' X 14' addition on a shop for a neighbor. I think I am anticipating you build more than I did my own. This will not be a hard build for you, just pull some string lines check them for square and plant some poles. The pole placement should be as close as possible to perfect as you can get but......if they are out a little its ok, cut the beams to the correct length and pull the top of the poles to fit the beams. If the beams get out of square secure one side with bracing and slowly pull the other side with a chain hoist (checking often) until its squared up. It is surprising how easy the beams will "twist" to square. Once it is true the rest is just normal building procedures.
This is not the only way and it may not be the best way but it will work and it is very easy. Really this is just my attempt to get you started with whatever method you choose. Looking back I should have sent this one in a personnel message as this is no benefit to the group discussion. All I can say is sorry folks but this takes to long to re-type on a phone.

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Folks, things took another complicated turn to do with planning permission - it's very boring and complicated so I won't go into it but the upshot is I just decided to re-shape and extend my existing smithy. I already had a small post single pitch smithy so I decided to make it into an A frame using some bits of half-round posts I had as well as some other bits I cobbled together.

 

I took on board what my timber frame mate said about 4"x2" and 3"x2" being easier to work work with so I just made the roof out of them. I can't claim it's done with traditional carpentry - it's basically all held together with 10mm threaded bolts, though the traditional shape is there. I've never done anything like this before so I'm pretty proud of myself, so far it's taken me 3 days.

 

As it is it's about 14'x8' but I'm going to tack on a single pitch lean-to to extend it at some point. I'm going to leave the posts "expressed" so to speak so the uprights are on the outside and I'll build the walls off the inside of the posts...basically I don't want to hide the part of the frame that's got all the charm.

post-26685-0-51793200-1361566044_thumb.j

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That's going to look great! I have never thought about leaving the post exposed. It will defiantly give it a unique look. Can't wait to see the next pictures. Good work.

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