braselforge Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 ive been seing flatter hammers on ebay and they are like 100 dollars, i have lots of hammers that are just laying around, maybe convert them to a huge square face from welding maybe? i was just wondering how Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsberg Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 A flatter isn't a hammer. It is held on top of the work and struck by a hammer to flatten the surface. The end opposite the flat bit needs to be made to be struck. Caleb Ramsby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McPherson Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 Making things from large stock and tool steels the old fashioned way is difficult to impossible without a power hammer, striker, or proper instruction. Fabrication skills and tools are easier to come by in the 21st century. IIRC, there was a tutorial in an old Hammer's Blow (ABANA) by Brian Gilbert on making flatters, top fullers and other things from cheap import or flea market hammers. Even if the faces are ruined, the eye is the hard thing to make. Armorers make up their own specialty tools all the time. You can knock out the handle, anneal the whole head, weld a plate, ball, rod or other shape to one face, put the handle back, and use it as a flatter, cheese fuller, etc. You do need access to a good welder, and know how to anneal, or the struck end will chip and spall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HWooldridge Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 If you can find a pneumatic air chisel bit, it will have an integral round collar that provides some mass for the face. You can cut the shaft next to the collar and be most of the way there. The face can be ground or forged flat at that point. In addition, don't worry about punching a hole for the handle if you aren't comfortable with it. Instead, just hold the tool with ring tongs or wrap it with a 1/4" rod for a handle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Turley Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 Is a flatter flat? Of course, EXCEPT I radius-raise the edges 3 or 4 degrees by disc or belt sanding. In this way, you avoid edge marks which otherwise may be left on your work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Trez Cole Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 one I made a few was a 4 pound sledge and welded a piece of steel to one face the steel was 2 1/2"x2 1/2"x 1/2" It has served me very well for the last 5 years. Free hammer and scrap metal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
braselforge Posted August 5, 2012 Author Share Posted August 5, 2012 francus trez cole that is what i was thinking of doing, do u need to anneal the hammer to weld it? and the welded steel does it need to be hardened Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted August 5, 2012 Share Posted August 5, 2012 I forged a flatter at the beginning of my blacksmithing journey with less than one year experience. It is physically demanding but, Its actually not a super hard forging to make. I started with a 2" truck axle I squared up a section about 4 1/2" long with a clear shoulder. I did this on a power hammer but this could be done with a striker or even by hand. I cut off the squared up section and about 2" of the 2" round with a chop saw. You punch the eye as you would make any hammer. It is better to punch the eye first because it is hard to do after you have spread the face. I dropped squared up part int a square hole in my swage block and upset and spread the face. This gives you a round faced flatter you can square up the face but it is a lot of extra work. Alternately you could start with square stock and more easily make a square faced flatter but 2" round was what I had. Do a bit of grinding filing to dress it up. Harden and temper as directed for the alloy used. I have also seen wrought iron flatters with welded steel faces and forged mild steel flatters. Water quenched Mild steel is probably good enough for a flatter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Olivo Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 A simple fuller can be made in the hardy hole of your anvil or if you have a swedge block you can make it in one of the larger holes there. I made my first one that still serves me today although it has been used heavily for the size of it by myself with a 10lbs sledge and upset a piece of mild steel in the hardy hole. The surface is casehardened. My second one was butchered out of a truck axle with a large flange on it and forged. Second was done with the help of my striker. I have also seen a plate welded on to an old sledge hammer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Unless you want to give your house, truck, savings, etc to some random stranger you sure tooting will need to know about proper heat treating for struck tooling; else the first time someone spalls a chip off and loses an eye you lose EVERYTHING! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
braselforge Posted August 7, 2012 Author Share Posted August 7, 2012 well here is what i was thinking, i have an old 3lb sledge, i was gonna flatsand the face and weld a piece of mildsteel and then heat the whole thing, while its is welded and superquench it or maybe just cast harden it, then after since it is brittle from the powder and water put it in an oven for 2, 2 hour times at 400 degrees so soften it up so it wont be very brittle, does that sound right or is there another safety measure i should do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfootnampa Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 The struck end should be softened MUCH more... more like tempered to 1,200 degrees Fahrenheit. You can't do that in a household oven and it would be too soft for the face anyway. 400 degrees is a good temper for a knife blade... NOT for a struck tool end! 900 degrees Fahrenheit is a good spring temper and might be okay for the flatter surface... still over hard for the struck end though, IMO. Can you see why these tools are WORTH $100 now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Olivo Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 bigfootnampa Unless your using a softened hammer to strike it. Most of my tools are now fully hardend and tempered and they must be struck with a softened hammer. This makes dressing the struck ends a non issue and only once in a while you have to dress the soft hammer face (read annealed hammer) This also makes remaking tools a less often chore. This does however mean you have a special hammer just for striking tools and a soft face and a hard face on your sledgehammer. (and you have to know the difference and use appropriately :D) But after having to dress 60 or so hand tools each year or more not including my set tools, I had to find a better way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McPherson Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 Mushroomed chisel heads and spalling hammer faces are a recipe for a trip to the emergency room. Been there, done that, had to get a tiny sliver of wood splitting maul cut out of my eye. If you think ebay prices are high, that probably worked out to $500K/lb. I could have bought the finest new anvil on the market instead, and paid shipping. Now, I am an evangelist for safety glasses at all times. The rule is to never strike hardened steel with hardened steel. Striking steel on steel will work harden the faces. Using a brass, copper, lead, or dead soft mild steel hammer head reserved just for that purpose is a way to avoid the problem. IIRC, stonemason hammers used with cutting chisels are made that way. Brass hammers are the ticket for punching marking sets of letters & numbers into metal, no rebound and double strikes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Trez Cole Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 Disclaimer "All blacksmithing activity are dangerous" With any blacksmithing task you should be wearing safety glasses there is risk of pieces breaking off with the best made tools. I just welded it on and it has worked fine The cheep ones from Harbor freight will work fine I did not even take the handle out. the method that Gerald shows is great and when I have the time I will make one at some point but for now what I make will work. ya Mythbusters episode 67 proved that that a hammer hitting a hammer would not break the face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 Would not use superquench on a hammer head of unknown composition heated to critical! If you plan to sell them then you often are responsible for the idiocy of users---my health insurance *requires* me to sue any third party possibly involved in an accident or they don't have to pay! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Olivo Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 Thanks gerald. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZIG Posted August 29, 2012 Share Posted August 29, 2012 I too, saw that mythbusters episode when They hit those hammer together, face to face. And They were really hitting alot harder than I ever could. It's still scary to do. But I've been hurt more from a nail head breaking off and flying back into me. Had That several times. Which is a Easing hammer I used And of course the nail head was made out of softer material. But When I was 17 and had a die scatter on me while using a ironworker piranha punch press. The chip flew off and went thru my chin, up thru my bottom teeth and sheared them off at the gum line. 15 stitches on the inside and 20 on thr out. My lip was held together by a little piece of skin. Now my beard grows white hair over the scar. The moral being : I was super lucky. It was under 125 toms of pressure and I saw 3 Sparks and was then spitting teeth out over the shop floor. Had It hit me in the eye it would've gone like a bullet To my brain. I wasn't wearing any safety glasses. Either. So I've Bern super careful about my eyes ever since. And I've been a Boilermaker for 26 years next month. I'm terrified of loosing my eyes. And in my career. I've had multiple chances to lose them both so easily. So anyone attempting To do any work. Please wear the proper Z-87 glasses. It only takes a split second and You could be screwed for the rest of Your life. No one wants that. I think of that day. Everyday. I keep the die too. So no one else would try to use it. It had been cut down. And I didn't know it. But I was blessed to have kept my eyes this long. With wire wheels on grinders being used in the boiler around me and flying wires popping me in the face from 50 foot away. I'm scared of those wire wheels. We holler " power wheel, coming on! So in case someone around Might not have their glasses on at That moment. Cause its Such a hot job that someone is always wiping sweat or cleaning their glasses. I Don't want to lose my eyes. Much worse. Be the cause of someone else losing theirs. So Please. No matter What anyone believes. About tempering or whatever. Always wear Your glasses. I wear them and a clear face shield alot. But always my glasses. I make my family knock befiore they open the door To my shop. Just in case. Its my worst fear. And they make some Good glasses That a man can wear all day without any issues. Actually some are better to wear than my sunglasses at home. They came a long way over the years. So no excuses. !!! And I've enjoyed reading all yalls post on This subject. Very much. Alot of Good info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1forgeur Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Bout 10 years ago I had carpal tunnel surgery done on both hands. They x-rayed both of my hands looking for things that should'nt be there. They called me in after the x-rays were developed to show me something. They said it appeared I had a chunk of metal in my hand. I told them they were right and that it had been in there for about 45 years. Anyway, when I was in Boy Scouts I was into rock collecting. I needed to crack this rock open and could,nt get it. So I hit the head of my rock hammer with a ball peen trying to chisel it open. That's where the chunck of metal came from. Darned near bled to death. The doctor said he was going to leave it there so it's still in my hand. Still have the rock hammer too. Soooooooooooo, I don't care what mythbusters found out, I know better! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tran Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 This is not Telling you how to make a flattener (Thank you Mr. Powers). This is showing how I made one for light work. There is one of piece of square bar welded to a piece of truck spring. I do not usually use the 'handle' I hold the square bar with one hand and use the other hand for the hammer. The square bar will mushroom but will not splinter if it is 'dressed' often, also that helps on getting the handle off if it is used. It is hard to see but the bottom is rounded on all sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockstar.esq Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Is there any particular reason a person couldn't take a flattened sledge and rivet a large piece of aluminum or brass for the struck side? I'm thinking the rivet would be countersunk and/or the brass would have a raised dome area to be struck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rthibeau Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 well, you could always use 1045 steel, 2 1/2 inch square bar, put it on a lathe, mill the eye, heat treat, and voila!!...flatters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOblacksmith0530 Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Weld up that center drill hole or it will start a cold shut in my humble opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaughnT Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Rockstar, an aluminum/brass button on the top wouldn't last long at all, and then you'd dance a merry jig trying to get the rivet/bolt out of the sledge. Better to simply remove the temper of the sledge on the impact area by heating it up. With the working face buried in the dirt, or held in a vice (acts as a heat sink), you won't remove the hardness from the working face. Richard, those look great. All of the flatters I see at the flea markets are going for less than $50. A lot less. Maybe I need to start buying them up and auctioning them on ebay! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 I would want more material on top of the eye as flatters tend to get battered down more than other top tools. At least mine do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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