braselforge Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 is it possible to build a hydraulic forging press for under 200 dollars, a mini one, like this picture, because i dont got much room? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel.85 Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 Its possible, learn everything you can about the concept, then start digging around junkyards and such, maybe barter a few things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 That looks like a hand operated bottle jack. It would work for bending but it's too slow for forging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 An air-over 20 ton jack is about $130. Leaves you $70 for other materials. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Auctions, craigslist, garage sales, fleamarkets............all can save a ton of money for a project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Leaves you $70 for other materials. Phil Other materials and a compressor?........... :huh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Other materials and a compressor?........... :huh: Eh, ok. I assumed he has a compressor already. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 A couple of things concern me about air/hyd pumps.......Correct me if I'm wrong but don't they operate at very slow gpms which is fine for pressing bearings and such but no good for forging. Also they put out huge pressure, 10,000 psi or so and that won't fly with most cylinders which generally can only handle 3,000psi................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Yates Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 The only thing that concerns me is an air over Hydro project with out plans can kill a person fast ! there are PSI ratings and things to consider and the ability to build the project . a simple mistake and a good friend lost his life over a cylinder rod going through his chest! starting out it is easer to build from a known plan and work with that . now as for helping some one I do not mind to do so , however a drawn plan is better then ideas trials and earrors that a feller might not walk away from . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
braselforge Posted June 14, 2012 Author Share Posted June 14, 2012 i agree with u guys, i seen this http://www.knivesplus.com/minihydraulicpress.html and am wondering if i shud attempt to try this, and all the stuff not mentioned, like the psi levens so it doesnet blow up and stuff, like how to use it because ive never uses a bottle jack, especially a air compressed one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 The air over hydraulic is fine in this case, (harbor freight or northern tool air over hydraulic 20 ton jack) it is a prebuilt system with an over pressure device built into it and it is not getting modified, just fastened in. Knowing what I know about how pneumatics and hydraulics work I am positive a home built system could get very scary very fast. This jack, if I understand it right, provides rapid pulses, not a continuous operation, but it is fast enough that others have done this with some success. There have been a number built and posted here on IFI. If your frame is underbuilt and fails you cannot assume it will stay put. A broken weld can create a projectile. I considered building one of these, but my material got used instead for a post vise stand. I had a more immediate need for the post vise stand. (and it is handy!) Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 The pulsing can be a plus. A friend who worked in an auto machine shop had an air actuated bearing press that was around 50 ton cap. On my 50 ton press I could barely flatten a penny, on his the pulses smashed that penny down really flat, like a train ran over it flat. . It was if a bunch of 50 ton sledge hammers were hammering on that penny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpotter Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 I have built several air hydraulic forging presses and they work fine, they are not as fast as full size machine but they work great for small stuff. I have a video on youtube of mine in operation, it can squeeze a 1 in bar in half no problem. I build hydraulic presses for a living and I just converted one of them to air over hydraulic and made a set of forging dies. I am building a 50 ton forging press with an enerpac cylinder and pump right now, it will be a table top version, I have also made some 100 ton coining presses using enerpac stuff. The only problem is they cost lots more than 200 bucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmann2118 Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 I just finished building one of these and I have limited welding experience. All the welds are decent. I just tested it the other night and it worked fairly well. I have it a little too tight though and the ram goes up fine but doesn't travel back down easily without help. So I gotta fix it. Here are some pics. I'm not worried about the danger aspect. Second Pic: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainely,Bob Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Know what worries me? Folks who say; " I`m not worried about the danger aspect". Too often that translates into "I really don`t care enough about being responsible for my own actions so when things go wrong someone else, who wasn`t even part of this (like my family), will take up my slack, possibly for a several years or decades to come". I personally feel that folks who say that sort of thing ought to have their words engraved on their tombstone so the rest of the world can fully understand the mindset that put them under that stone. I just have a hard time understanding how any responsible person can say " I have limited welding experience" and then go on to post pics of what is basically a time bomb backed by massive amounts of hydraulic pressure. This is exactly the reason why there are properly trained welders out there who make a living doing what they do. All I I can say is good luck to your friends and family, they`re gonna need it. If this sounds harsh it`s because I feel, when it comes to safety, harsh is sometimes what`s called for. Maybe it`ll wake someone up enough to think about both safety and personal responsibility. Feel free to click on my profile and contact me directly if you`d like to talk about some of my personal experiences cleaning up after people who do things like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Friends don't let Friends play Russian Roulette! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petere76 Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Brasel, Seriously, the welds don't look right and you are working with big forces in immediate proximity to your body. Be responsible for yourself and others that may be near you when you work this thing and fix it. You will be at fault if someone other than yourself is injured using this thing. Bob is right about your family as well because if you get screwed up they will have take care of you. Rule of welding...if it looks bad it probably is bad. If you cant weld, that's all right, just get someone to help you out or hire the job out.. Don't pass off bad welding jobs as good enough, people get killed this way. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmann2118 Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Wow bad first experience for posting to this site. First of all dont presume you can tell me how to live my life and make assumptions about my family. How am I not responsible for my actions? How is your family going to pick up my slack? I was just be honest saying I'm not a "professional welder". Last point I what to make is that this hobby is inherently dangerous. If I was building a burner for a forge I could possibly blow myself up or get burned badly. While using other pieces of machinery I could easily injure myself. Don't let personal problems cause you to be mad at the world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RGraff Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 To be honest...your statements coupled with the pics you posted scare the crap out of me (for your family's sake). Please take the following as nothing more than constructive criticism. Your welds are not decent. They're probably fine for fixing the neighbor's wheelbarrow or tagging the gate hinge back together. It's truly scary to imagine that assembly involved in anything that generates the psi potential of a press. Please consider getting more training or having an experienced welder put that together for you. My .02. Take it for what it's worth. No one's mad and there's no reason to make a dangerous occupation more dangerous than it needs to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmann2118 Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 I'm not mad I just don't like someone telling me his family is going to have to take care of me for generations. I pay my taxes, I make a good living, I wasn't the one who made a personal attack. Guess I should tone down my sarcasm on the next post.Mod note: the only hint at any personal attack came from you not being able to admit your lack of welding skills may get some one killed. Personal attacks violate the IFI ToS. Some one pointed out your welding is bad, and when those fail anyone near they can get hurt or worse also this hobby has enough risk with out allowing an ego to get in the way of safety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 When it comes to safety Your feelings are secondary.dont let your ego get in the way of a long and healthy life. Blacksmithing is not really that dangerous as long as you use your common sense. Your fabrication skills need work to safely complete a job like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RGraff Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 No worries. Just the internet. I'm new here myself and I gotta say I am impressed with the level of experience in this group. Some folks may seem a bit gruff but I believe they have good intentions. Ask questions...listen to what folks are saying. Just when you think you know it all, someone will step up and prove you wrong (I speak from experience). Ask for help if you're not sure. You'll get plenty offers. Personally, I'm looking forward to meeting some of these guys in person and getting down to some serious education. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmann2118 Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Just as a tidbit of info I think around 50 or so people have built these and tested them. Found the info of of Don Foggs forum. Each piece thats welded on the structure has about 4 welds per section. I check everytime I use it to make sure the weld isn't broke. The bottlejack isn't homemade. I dont mind people telling me it's an idiotic idea, or that the welds aren't good. I just dont like people making personal comments about me being disabled and having to take care of me. And anyone that says blacksmithing isn't somewhat dangerous scares me, haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Have you done tests on your welds in the past? If you have not make some sample welds and try breaking them. There are some standard tests that can be easily done, or approximated, in the shop (bend tests). (mine aren't perfect either) Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Just as a tidbit of info I think around 50 or so people have built these and tested them. Found the info of of Don Foggs forum. Each piece thats welded on the structure has about 4 welds per section. I check everytime I use it to make sure the weld isn't broke. The bottlejack isn't homemade. I dont mind people telling me it's an idiotic idea, or that the welds aren't good. I just dont like people making personal comments about me being disabled and having to take care of me. And anyone that says blacksmithing isn't somewhat dangerous scares me, haha. I have been a smith for 20 years 15 as a professional. Blacksmithing is not a killer craft. I have never suffered a serious injury. Burns and bruses yes, but loss of limb or death no. Power equipment on the other hand is dangerious. Especially stuff that is cobbled together and not engineered. The longer you do it the more you understand the nessesty of safety because cutting corners eventualy catches up with you. I have sent workers to the hospital who were more interested in shutting their ears and protecting their egos than hearing what I had to say. Seeing someone get hurt makes me upset regardless of my responibility to that person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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