dan_m

Hydraulic press build with progress pictures

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I began work on the press this afternoon. It was really nice to start to do something with it after a few months of research and playing with SketchUp on the computer. I've posted a few threads with questions about it in the last week, but I'll restate what I'm doing so later on when people look at this thread it will make more sense. I'll do my best to document each part of the build as thoroughly as I can including photos, hopefully it'll help someone out down the road.

It will be a 70 ton press, two 6" cylinders at 2500 PSI, with a 20" stroke. The frame is WF 8x35 I-beams...the reason I chose this size in particular is that the flanges are .495" thick, allowing me to use the flanges to guide the ram with a .5" spacer. Here's a screenshot from my SketchUp drawing that shows how that will work:

post-23126-0-34399500-1334892700_thumb.p

The frame and ram guides are basically a copy of the one Eric Fleming built (photos of his here:http://www.flemingkn.../largepress.htm). I've never corresponded with him, so I don't know if it's his original design or not, but it seems simple and appears to work well. I abandoned the SketchUp file when I got closer to finishing up the design and working more on details that don't need to be drawn on the computer. The 3D model was mostly to give myself a better look at how the ideas in my head would actually work out spatially, and to verify dimensions for each of the frame components. Here's how I left it about a month ago:

post-23126-0-70002600-1334893000_thumb.p

The frame is two 72.5" pieces of the I-beam oriented vertically, spaced by two 17.25" inches of the same beam, a flange facing the interior of the frame on each piece. The vertical flanges will be the slides that the ram guides move along, the lower spacer will have a 2" plate attached to the top (the bottom dies will mount on it), and the cylinders will be mounted on the top spacer, with a another 2" plate/die holder being driven by the rods.

I'll explain each part as I go, too much to explain all of it at once and I'm tired. But I've got it planned out most of the way through, and already have most of the components I need, so this should go rather quick (shooting for two weeks). Pretty much all I have left to order is the oil, lines, and fittings. Today all I did was work on the frame, laid everything out square and did most of the welding. I don't have a hoist or a gantry in my shop, and it was a PITA manipulating the frame around as it already weighs over 500 pounds. Fortunately I've got a friend visiting for the next ten days, so he'll be helping me out, and I'll try to get all of the welding done and have it mounted on its base while I've got the help. Tomorrow I've got another hour or so of welding the I-beams, and then I'll start on the ram guides. Here are a few pictures from today, nothing too exciting, but I'm trying to be thorough:

post-23126-0-72390400-1334894656_thumb.j

post-23126-0-31332600-1334894748_thumb.j

post-23126-0-68937800-1334894658_thumb.j

Tomorrow I'll post pictures of the completed frame and whatever progress I've made on the ram guides.

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Looking good, Dan. My only concern is it bowing sideways with that long push that you're going to have. Are you going to add any bracing or end plates to the vertical I-beams? I like how Eric super glued his guide pieces together for drilling. Smart! What is this going to mount to? A table like Eric's or..?

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Thanks Randy. There'll be 3/4" plates welded over the horizontal I-beams as in the SketchUp drawing, but the ends of each of those plates is actually welded to the inner flange of the vertical beams, which I think will help a lot. And a 1/2" plate will be welded over the entire top as a cap, and the bottom as well. I'll use half inch bolt to attach the press frame to a stand, I guess it'll be something like Eric's but I haven't drawn it out yet. I usually use 2" or 3" square tubing for that kind of thing. I like the idea of mounting it on wheels, but the total height with the frame and stand will be approaching 9 feet, so it's not really an option. I'll weld two pieces of channel under the stand though, so whenever my building finally decides to get a new forklift I can easily move it with that if I need to.

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Looks like a good honest OVERBUILD. Something that needs to be done when your first push may be the distruction of all that hard work........ B)

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To reduce the possibility of racking and binding, you could make the sides of the ram assembly longer and add X braces. Something like this
post-3810-0-30640200-1334955656_thumb.jp

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I finished welding the frame today and got all of plates cut, but had limited time in the shop so nothing worthy of pictures happened. Tomorrow I'll weld the reinforcing plates and lower platen onto the frame, and get started on, hopefully finish, the ram guides. Dkunkler, good idea but I'll wait to see if it works well as is first before doing extra work. Im pretty confident it should be alright, but we'll see

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I would have gone with full pen welds where the horizontal beam meets the vertical frame. 70 tons is a lot of force to rip stuff apart. Fillet welds are strong, but a full penetration weld is the design I see being used in critical joints.
Why the top push? it seem like your work will be really low.

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The horizontal pieces were beveled halfway through the material at 45* on one side wherever the flanges met the verticals:

post-23126-0-66409000-1335039303_thumb.j

Is this what you meant? Also, they are top mounted because bottom mounting would put the dies too high. The cylinders have a 20" stroke, and the retracted length is 31", so even disregarding the frame and die plates that puts it at 51". It'll go on a stand to get the working height correct.

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Well beveling like that gives you a partial penetration weld- better than a fillet but not as good as a full pen weld.
4-3. WELD JOINT DESIGN AND PREPARATION


a. Purpose. Weld joints are designed to transfer the stresses between the members of the joint and throughout the weldment. Forces and loads are introduced at different points and are transmitted to different areas throughout the weldment. The type of loading and service of the weldment have a great bearing on the joint design required.

b. Categories. All weld joints can be classified into two basic categories: full penetration joints and partial penetration joints.


(1) A full penetration joint has weld metal throughout the entire cross section of the weld joint.

(2) A partial penetration joint has an unfused area and the weld does not completely penetrate the joint. The rating of the joint is based on the percentage of weld metal depth to the total joint; i. e., a 50 percent partial penetration joint would have weld metal halfway through the joint.


NOTE


When joints are subjected to dynamic loading, reversing loads, and impact leads, the weld joint must be very efficient. This is more important if the weldment is sub jetted to cold-temperature service. Such services require full-penetration welds. Designs that increase stresses by the use of partial-penetration joints are not acceptable for this type of service.

c. Strength. The strength of weld joints depends not only on the size of the weld, but also on the strength of the weld metal.


(1) Mild and low alloy steels are generally stronger than the materials being joined.

(2) When welding high-alloy or heat-treated materials, special precautions must be taken to ensure the welding heat does not cancel the heat treatment of the base metal, causing it to revert to its lower strength adjacent to the weld.


d.
Design
. The weld joint must be designed so that its cross-sectional area is the minimum possible. The cross-sectional area is a measurement of the amount or weight of weld metal that must be used to make the joint. Joints may be prepared by shearing, thermal cutting, or machining.


(1)
Carbon and low alloy joint design and preparation
. These weld joints are prepared either by flame cutting or mechanically by machining or grinding, depending on the joint details. Before welding, the joint surfaces must be cleared of all foreign materials such as paint, dirt, scale, or must. Suitable solvents or light grinding can be used for cleaning. The joint surface should not be nicked or gouged since nicks and gouges may interfere with the welding operation.

post-10376-0-50768300-1335102822_thumb.j See attachment here correct fit up for full pen weld

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Gotcha, thanks for the info and the sketch. That makes sense. The beams are already welded together, but I'll put the bevel all the way through the material when I weld on the reinforcing plates today.

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Sounds like a hoist of some type will happen before this project finishes!

Very interesting.

Phil


It will have to happen sooner rather than later. I have a 1.5 ton chainfall on loan, and I'll build a rolling gantry for it. I'd like to make a large one, but I have a 6' drop from the I-beam and that's a good use for it. The I-beam frame weighs 525 pounds, and me and a friend can just barely manipulate it into different positions and slide it off the table to stand it up. Yesterday we cut all of the plate to length, and it weighs another 460 pounds:

post-23126-0-67210000-1335154670_thumb.j

Today we fitted the plates for the ram guides, and tomorrow they'll get bolted together. The flange on WF 8x35 beams is supposed to be .495" so I cut 1/2" plates for the spacer, but I didn't realize what poor tolerances structural steel like that has. All of the flanges have a slight arc to them, so that as it goes away from the web it curves away from the beam by more than .005". We added an additional 1/16" spacer and it's a good fit on three of the four slides, and one will have to get switched out for something thinner before it's bolted together. The sliding action is very pleasing.

post-23126-0-48581700-1335154671_thumb.j

post-23126-0-24739500-1335154672_thumb.j

So it won't bind the other way, we gave it a little horizontal play by cutting foil tape into strips and sticking them to one side of the beam before we clamped the plates together. The guides can't go into place with both sides attached, so one side on each had to be fitted in place, and this was easier than trying to hold a shim in place between it and the frame while we assembled. I guess you could glue it, but the tape has its own adhesive.

post-23126-0-70496800-1335154669_thumb.j

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I can't tell you how much I'm enjoying this build. I just got my own shop(garage) for the first time since I started making knives and have downloaded all of Eric's plans from his WIP build he did. I'm planning on a build almost identical to his except I am planning mine to have channel slots on the base so I can either use a forklift of a pallet jack to move it.
I plan on using a slightly longer stroke than his because I plan on doing feather pattern damascus billets and need more space for a chisel die. Your 20" stroke should cover just about any task!
Are you planning to use his wiring diagram and use the foot petal controls too like he uses?


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Hows the build going Dan?


Ugh, it's been stalled pretty much since I posted last. I've been super busy with the rest of my life and have barely gotten to work in the shop the past two months. The frame is done though, and I finished the guides last week. I still need to fit the top plate between the guides and attach it, and then I'll mount the cylinders and weld the stand. I have to start bugging my landlord to replace the forklift, it died right after I started the build. I have a hoist hanging from a beam over the edge of my table, which lets me manipulate on the table and take it on and off of the floor, but once I set it on the stand I want the forklift to move it across the room. It's way too top heavy for me to feel comfortable rolling it or using a pallet jack. I'll post pictures when I mount the top plate on the guides, hopefully later this week. I ended up getting a mill about a month ago, and I'm thinking about milling t-slots for clamping down dies, and also for auxiliary attachments like depth stops etc. I'll have to take the bottom plate off though. Always more work....


I can't tell you how much I'm enjoying this build. I just got my own shop(garage) for the first time since I started making knives and have downloaded all of Eric's plans from his WIP build he did. I'm planning on a build almost identical to his except I am planning mine to have channel slots on the base so I can either use a forklift of a pallet jack to move it.
I plan on using a slightly longer stroke than his because I plan on doing feather pattern damascus billets and need more space for a chisel die. Your 20" stroke should cover just about any task!
Are you planning to use his wiring diagram and use the foot petal controls too like he uses?


I'm using channel on the bottom of the stand too, it only makes sense. I'm using foot pedals, but I'm not going to set mine up fancy like Eric's. Just a simple up and down, since I really don't need the automated feature. I've thought about hooking up a DRO, but I'll wait and see if it necessitates itself once it's in use. Easy enough to add one on later.

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New guy here,
Getting ready to build a Hydraulic press, but the plan i've decided to go with is a single I beam construction (well, really not single as another I beam is used for the anvil, so I guess it'll be a 1 and a 1/2 I beam design). Much like what the knife maker Bruce Bump uses, that is mostly where my inspiration to build mine this way came from. Although, yours is very nice and looks very strong. I wish I could find steel like you have there, well, find it and still be able to make the house payment!

I'm new here, and I hope I can figure out how subscribe to this thread, so I can keep up with this build! I'm enjoying what I'm seeing so far, Rex

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how is this build going ?  would like to see what you do next :)

 

have just started my own press build today to build one also with two cylinders will make a thread when I have gotten further with it

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New guy here,
Getting ready to build a Hydraulic press, but the plan i've decided to go with is a single I beam construction (well, really not single as another I beam is used for the anvil, so I guess it'll be a 1 and a 1/2 I beam design). Much like what the knife maker Bruce Bump uses, that is mostly where my inspiration to build mine this way came from. Although, yours is very nice and looks very strong. I wish I could find steel like you have there, well, find it and still be able to make the house payment!

I'm new here, and I hope I can figure out how subscribe to this thread, so I can keep up with this build! I'm enjoying what I'm seeing so far, Rex

Rex look at the top right of the thread.....big button that says "follow topic" press that button and you will be notified as people comment on this thread. It will send an email. Hope this helps and enjoy!

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