Filling a hole with no welder?

[Brasilikilt]

I have a *really* poorly made clunky sword like object made from a leaf spring. The hack who made it used a section of leaf spring with the bolt hole in the middle!?!?!?!

I don't have my welder set up yet, but I still want to utilize this material.
My thoughts are to flare out/counter sink the hole on either side with a die grinder, heat the section of leaf spring up, and then drive a length of cold coil spring into the hole and hammer the coil spring as I would with a rivet
My understanding is that if I let the spring cool off it will shrink around the bit of coil spring and hold it firmly....Correct?
Will it still be stationary if I continue to forge and reshape the leaf spring, or should I just have it welded?

Thanks :-)

[Rich Hale]

You couild also try a cold rivet,,anneal the rivet and chamfer the holes a little bit,,alternate sides as yoiu pien the rivet so it fills the hole and expands to fill the chamfers,,dress it down flush,,,you may still see a little ring where it was,,,One and one times the rivet diameter is usually correc twhen figuring how long the rivet should be. For a rivet where the head is proud on both side,,so make it a little shorter....And if the blade is not heat treated correctly it may crack from the hole out as you pien....

[ThomasPowers]

No virtue using spring material over mild steel for that.

If the leafspring was cold straightened it may already have micro cracks in it that will just result in catastrophic failure.

How much distal taper do you need to do? If a lot I would refrain from riveting the hole until after the basic forging is done.

Have you thought of riveting it in copper and using that as a place to stamp your mark? If so do it even after heat treat but before final grinding.

My basic take on this is: It's a lot easier to work with hay directly from the bale than with hay that has already been through the horse.

[pkrankow]

Since this is in general blacksmithing is it safe to believe you are beating a sword into something other than a sword?

A rivet won't stay put if you are forging the metal around it. Does your intended purpose allow for you to cut part of the hole away and reshape the material?

Phil

[Timothy Miller]

Why can't you use your forge welder? Just forge weld in a rivet I have seen it done on old work more than once it is one of the easier possible welds.

[Brasilikilt]

Hey all, thanks for getting back to me.

The story behind the sword-like-object is that a very good family friend commissioned it some years ago from someone who could talk the talk, but certainly couldn't walk the walk. After I got into forging and making knives, he asked if there was anything I could do with it. I simply made another seax for him and kept the original.
He recently showed me a type of Roman Gladius that he likes, and asked if I could hammer one out for him. I've made big knives, but never a double edged sword...I figure it'll be challenging, but a good way to impove upon existing skills.
I figure this poorly constructed excuse for a weapon *might* yield usable material, but most likely not. I figure that I could stick it in the forge, check for any obvious flaws, and more or less treat it as a "practice run" before I commit to buying a new peice of 5160 or 1095.
I'm not counting on it, but the leaf spring could be okay....If that's the case I'd like to fill the bolt hole.

I like the forge welder idea, and have given it serious thought, but since I am somewhat shaky with those skills, I'm exploring other options beforehand and consulting those with more experience who might have done this sort of thing in the past.

I was also thinking of using softer mild steel for this, but figured that the contrast between the 2 types of steel might make the plug stand out too much, and I do have lots of cut up coil springs laying around....It never hurts to ask questions.

Anyways, I will try to post a shot of this example of bad workmanship so that we may point and laugh. :-)

[clinton]

Shoo goo

[ThomasPowers]

As the Roman Gladius were forged from generally very heterogeneous bloomery iron a colour mismatch would make it look more authentic!

[ramsies11]

if you are leaving the outside blackened, i would suggest a crude braze when you finish making the sword from hammer strokes, heat up the metal and use a brazing rod, if you cant find a good brass one or dont have an o/a torch, simply ask a friend with a gun if the next time they pop off a couple rounds to give you the shells, cut off the firing pin, and cut a slit down the middle, then roll it as tight as possible, this will give you a crude but effective rod, then heat the section to id say about an orangy color and then just tap the brass on there to melt it. if you have an o/a torch, you can completly surpass the need for brass even and melt steel into the hole, if its not on a part that NEEDS to hold an edge, a simple clotheshanger braze will work. i would though, suggest the steel brazing over anything, if you dont have an o/a set then see if a friend will let you steal it for a couple hours. hope it helps, and tip the friend. B)

[ThomasPowers]

Note that brazing on a high carbon blade can result in auto quenching leaving a brittle zone so drawing temper *after* the brazing is required---and tempering temps won't affect the brazing. (Hardening temps will though)