JamesBBrauer

First firing of my top-loading forge (video)

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Great idea with the metal drawer slides.

What was the reason for this special purpose design? It is a pretty large box.

I would be uncomfortable having burners blowing directly into each other. Seems like it is asking for trouble.

Phil

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I make insects and fireplace tool holders that won't fit in my gloryhole style forge when the legs are splayed out, so I have been using a O/A rosebud for final adjustments. This should let me do most of the work in the smaller forge, then heat the larger sections at the end for final adjustment.

And I did four burner holders, so the plan was to be able to have them blowing at opposing corners and maybe getting a little vortex going on. I could see burners pointed directly at each other blowing burning propane out of the air intake, or failing in some other similarly spectacular fashion.

thanks for checking it out

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Looks good. I'm thinking the burner you had trouble getting lit might be getting too much back pressure from the first burner. The flame will drive a vortex and it'll run directly into the second burner, which ever you light first. It is of course possible the second burner needs some tuning.

I'd really like to see it running with burners running kittycorner.

Well done.

Frosty The Lucky.

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Looks good. I'm thinking the burner you had trouble getting lit might be getting too much back pressure from the first burner. The flame will drive a vortex and it'll run directly into the second burner, which ever you light first. It is of course possible the second burner needs some tuning.


I might try and light the other burner first, and see if it does the same thing, or experiment with opening/closing the top to change the pressure, or the gas jet might be off center or the wrong distance from the reducer.

Didn't you come up with the idea of using a tee for the top burner? I like it, it was easy to get the tee in the lathe to center-drill. I may have mentioned it a few years back, but I use an 1/8" brass coupler with a plug in one side to mate the re-threaded Tweco tip to the nipple. I tap the pipe plug and re-thread to match - think I did 1/4" x 20. But after I get it all together, I sweat solder the threads, then turn the coupler down smooth in the lathe to get better air flow.

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James have you been using this forge yet ? I have an old ceramic electric kiln that's made out of firebricks with a metal exterior that's about the same size and shape as yours... I'm thinking of lining it after cutting firebrick corners to make it more cylindrical inside and cutting a door in the side instead of top loading it. I was thinking the curved corners would make the flames circulate inside rather than hitting directly into the rear wall. I don't know that that matters..It just seemed it would distribute the heat more uniformly inside the forge.

Being as old as it is and made from the old soft firebricks I'm fairly positive I'll need to use some sort of liner to protect the interior,but at least it'll contain the heat with slight modifications and since it's been setting in the back of the shop for 16-18 years it's about time I re-purposed it into something usable...

Any suggestions about lining material or lining procedure much appreciated..

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Any suggestions about lining material or lining procedure much appreciated..


Two months later, I remember to check up on my post. Sorry about that. Anyway, my old Skutt potter's kiln is made out of soft firebricks. I'm sure it could stand the heat of a propane burner, but the volume of the thing would take a long time to get hot. I suppose you could line yours with ITC-100 to get it hotter, faster. Or you could line the interior with a ceramic fiber insulation like Kaowool, use the kiln bricks as secondary insulation, and reduce your volume to get a fast heating solution. If your kiln is in working order, personally I would sell it and use the proceeds to fund building a propane forge from the ground up. I'm certainly not trying to tell you what to do, I'm just giving you a couple of things to think about if you haven't already worked something out.

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It might be repairable but probably not worth fixing it and then attempting to sell it... It's been years since I looked at it very close actually. I thought I could fill the corners with bricks and then line it and coat it ...a bit of overkill on wall thickness,but would save a lot of fabricating by just re-purposing this very old kiln into something I could use. Probably save a bunch of cash on firebricks too.

I'll look it over better and see if the heating elements are still intact then decide... I could use that big on/off switch on my antique AC welder anyway (refused to pay $20 something for one) LOL

Been designing some sort of power hammer for the time being anyway and need to put up an addition to the shop with an area to beat & heat metal first. This is a project from scratch and I'm doing things as I can when I can as finances allow.

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I might try and light the other burner first, and see if it does the same thing, or experiment with opening/closing the top to change the pressure, or the gas jet might be off center or the wrong distance from the reducer.

Didn't you come up with the idea of using a tee for the top burner? I like it, it was easy to get the tee in the lathe to center-drill. I may have mentioned it a few years back, but I use an 1/8" brass coupler with a plug in one side to mate the re-threaded Tweco tip to the nipple. I tap the pipe plug and re-thread to match - think I did 1/4" x 20. But after I get it all together, I sweat solder the threads, then turn the coupler down smooth in the lathe to get better air flow.


Sorry to be so slow replying, I don't follow as closely as I maybe should. yes, I started using a "T" about the time Ron Reil and I were brainstorming the things.

That's close to how I make up the mig tips. I use 1/8" mpt x 1/4" flare fittings, the through hole is often the perfect diameter to tap 1/4"x28 so I don't have to re-thread the mig tips. Take the correct drill bit to the plumbing supply and pick the fittings it barely fits or won't go into and chase.

I don't solder or even tighten the fitting much though I do use a lock nut on the inside to keep it from moving. I don't picture the coupler as you describe, I drill and tap the "T" fitting from the back so there's no plug or fitting other than the brass. There is one thread protector at the tube outlet to act as a flare sort of but I leave the threads to provide some smooth turbulence to enhance fuel air mixing.

Frosty The Lucky.

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What's the volume of your kiln? The rule of thumb is one 3/4" burner to 300-350 cu/in. A 1" burner is twice the cross section and will heat twice the volume.

Unless it's a pretty small kiln heating it will be a feat using enough burners it won't matter what kind of corners it has. If it's not worth selling using the firebrick to build what you want is my choice.

There is debate about vortices in the chamber for even heat and perpendicular flames. I have both and haven't noticed enough difference to make me pick one over the other. The one exception I can think of right off the top is heat treating, a good even heat in the chamber is a good thing for heat treating.

Frosty The Lucky.

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The kiln is approximately the same 16"x16" (maybe smaller) but a bit deeper. If I add hard brick to the bottom and angled brick to the corners and then line the interior and coat it ...the overall interior should be about the same as in the video just deeper. That's sorta what percipitated this line of thinking since it's about the same size.

Usually you see round forges...since this was square it triggered grey matter into remembering I had that old kiln and perhaps it could finally function as something I wanted/needed.

It shouldn't be too difficult to reshape the interior with additional bricks and line it with kaowool and an interior finish over that for durability.

It is made up of sections (so you could add or subtract height) with a sheetmetal outer case. I would think I could cut out a side section for a "door" opening and still leave the top intact and removable in case the interior might need repairs at some point.

I could make a round forge,but this is already semi-made and should only require minimal tweeking & lining to be functional with the addition of a couple of burners.

Having a removable top might be helpful should I want to heat treat something like a power hammer die or anything awkward in size.

At any rate I won't be out much converting this and if it doesn't work out I can always take it apart and use the bricks building something else. Once I get into this project I'll take some pictures and start a new thread on how it comes out.

Thanks for the input...

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I don't picture the coupler as you describe, I drill and tap the "T" fitting from the back so there's no plug or fitting other than the brass. .


Here is a picture of how I have done my last four or five burners. It isn't shown, but i tap holes for four screws to adjust the centering of tip.

burner.jpg

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