Glenn Posted May 11, 2012 Author Share Posted May 11, 2012 I spoke with an audiologist and they strongly suggested that anything above normal conversation you need hearing protection. They went on to suggest being in a constant noise for any length of time (minutes) you should have hearing protection. One thing they said was that the BODY conducts sound to the ears and can cause damage, standing in front of concert speakers, working next to motors etc. I knew you could bypass the ears by attaching a device to the skull bone behind the ear, but it was interesting to find the body could do the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Jones Posted May 11, 2012 Share Posted May 11, 2012 The lower the frequency the more body transmission occurs, so you can actually have physical effects from low frequency harmonics that your ear will not hear - some research was done on it for crowd control etc. The high frequency stuff tends to effect the ear more directly, luckily the high frequency end is the easiest to damp out and is also the main part of the noise produced by hitting metal with metal, you probably notice this when you put on ear defenders as they will kill the high frequency stuff very well but the lower end stuff isn't fully attenuated. I used to do some work on Radar systems and the anechoic rooms we used for that were very good at damping out sound as well as radar waves. Very funny standing in a properly anechoic room and closing your eyes and your sense of balance fails you very quickly. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted May 11, 2012 Share Posted May 11, 2012 I've been to the anechoic chamber at Bell Labs Murray Hill; spooky! You can hear your blood running in your veins and arteries it's so quiet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bentiron1946 Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 I used to shoot around five hundred rounds of big bore rifle a month, plus another 200 of big bore pistol, plus 300 of 12 gauge shotgun, not to mention the small bore pistol and rifle. It didn't take long for me to up grade my hearing protection from cotton balls to something more substantial. During my Navy years I was in a boiler room where we read lips because it was so noisy and it was six months after I got out that I quit hearing the roar of the boiler room all the time, now that is noise. We had a forced draft blower that cranked at anywhere from 5 thousand to 15 thousand RPM, plus steam driven pumps, steam driven electrical generators, just lots of equipment driven off of 1,200# steam and none of quiet. The Navy didn't think hearing protection was necessary at all. It wasn't till I got out and started shooting and one of the range masters told me about real hearing protection that I ditched the cotton balls, now I have very nice hearing protection. Kind of like closing the barn door after the horse has left but there is still a little bit of the hearing left, might as well save what's left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
son_of_bluegrass Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 I just read this http://www.sciencenews.org/view/generic/id/340704/title/Even_moderate_noise_may_harm_hearing It might not need to be loud to be damaging, constant lower lever sounds may be enough to cause problems. I'm wondering about fans, blowers and the like and if the constant but not overly loud sound may cause problems. I gather from the article that being able to distinguish subtle differences in sounds could be compromised by the lower volume constant sounds and that could make it difficult to properly understand speech even if your hearing is fine. ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 It is time to review the sound warnings again. In a large multiple bay auto repair garage, the air gun for removing lug nuts from tires, and the air driven ratchet wrenches were giving me discomfort. A quick measurement by the dB meter on the cell phone said they both were way too loud, and could cause hearing damage. Even in the office the sound levels were high. The one thing the audiologist recommended was if you drive with the window down, use a single ear plug to stop the repeated popping of the wind against your ear. Sound levels are interesting to measure. They are all over the scale, and oftem times louder than you ever imagined. Prolonged exposure is a real concern even to the lower sound levels. If you really want to KNOW how much sound your being exposed to, put a set of foam or other ear plugs in, and then ADD a set of ear muffs over the ears. Yes TWO layers. Now set down with a cold drink, relax and enjoy life for 30 minutes or so.Listen to the sounds your body makes, your heart beating, air going into and out of your lungs, etc. Be careful with standing up and walking around as you may experience vertigo. Speak or say something in a low volume, than again at normal levels and listen to the body vibrate. Stand up and walk a short distance and listen to the impact of just walking on your body, the joints being hammered with each step, the joints creaking and grinding, and a world of new noises. When you finish the 30 minutes or more test, remove just the muffs and listen again with the ear plugs still inserted and providing a 30 or so dB noise reduction. Finally slowly remove the ear plugs and let the sound of the world back into your hearing and life. Try to identify what is making all the racket and the intensity of the sound. Sound damage to the hearing is accumulative. Protect what you have as once it is damaged, it is not coming back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoName Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Glenn, just gave up the flip phone. Sad to say my #4 stopped working on the dial pad. The only numbers I could dial, with a 4 were from my contacts. Gave into the smartiephone, since I have been looking at different apps, hard choice, with the endless options. As an administrator can you share the name of a dB app, you like? Its a Swedish anvil thing N.N.F. Beautiful, Manchester, Michigan. USA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 There are several sound dB apps available. The sound apps are not all calibrated the same. Two different apps running at the same time, same location, can sometimes have a 20 dB difference in the readings. Try Sound Meter by Smart tools, and Sound Meter by Abc Apps. The time graph of the sound levels lets you can see the numbers displayed in a graph of time vs sound levels. While your at it, look up a flashlight app that turns on the flash of your camera on so you can use it as a flashlight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Just downloaded Decibel 10 to try out. That should be fun in the body shop. Thanks for the idea Glenn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 Take two readings, one at body location, and one from in the room. Please post your results (grin). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaleb Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Lol this is kinda funny I have a video that relates to this as well. (If only I knew how to embed videos into post) Even though you guys were bashing this guy on his safety and such he did make a video on shop noise and some of the dB s of certain tools. Mod Note. Link removed due to language. But then again he did do some thing stupid, I wonder if you will pick it up. *Edit: In this one he uses the phone app as well as a real dB meter Mod Note. Link removed due to language. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 I don't know how this app is calibrated but so far in the lunch room I got the low of 57.2 db. And in the shop without the really loud tools going its at an average of 81.7db. With a high of 102db and a peak of 110db. I'll keep playing with the app and see how it goes in different places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 My hearing is damaged, the drill rigs we used most often were powered by 2 cycle, Detroit Diesel 353 engines which are extremely loud no matter how you try to muffle them intake or exhaust. I used to shoot a lot too and it wasn't till later in life I started wearing ear protection. Then there's the tree, my left ear was about 35% while my right ear was around 92%. Tinnitus is constant but the left ear is very loud. Nerve damage on the left side of my head has caused a number of issues. Anyway, my old AM FM head phones died a couple years ago and I finally replaced them, Amazon was having a sale and we have Prime so shipping is free. I bought a pair of "Howard Leight Sync" head phones, Am Fm cable jack with a NNR of 25. They're a little heavy and squeeze a little much but the shingles made the left side of my face and head really sensitive so it's probably not bad at all. I can hear things around me well, I tested by dropping a cotter key while listening to the radio and heard it fine. It's so quiet in them I can keep the radio or audio book turned way down and hear everything just fine. I also tested them against a disk grinder on a 15' length of 8", 27lb(IIRC) wide flange. The sounds of the: motor, the grinding, and ring of the steel came in clearly but wasn't deafening, not close. With my best ear muffs it would've been plugs and muffs job that left my ears ringing. These things are worth every penny, I wish I'd had something even close when I was young. We used to plug our ears with tissue paper. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 1 hour ago, Kaleb said: Even though you guys were bashing this guy on his safety and such he did make a video on shop noise and some of the dB s of certain tools. Please do not think we are bashing the creator of the video. He can do what ever he wishes, as it is his shop, and his life that may get shortened or ended due to his actions. We are trying to warn others that there are very clear risks and dangers being shown in the video, and those risks are being downplayed or dismissed. It is one thing to put himself at risk but it is NOT ok to put others at risk, or suggest that others do not have to take precautions when doing dangerous things. That IS being irresponsible. Videos on youtube and other video hosts can be very helpful and informative. They can also be very dangerous. When bad information is presented, or when safety is dismissed, it can get others hurt, injured, or killed. The noise videos he presented have several flaws, including how to properly use the meter. Improper use of the meter gives incorrect measurements which have little or no value. Properly used the sound meter is a very useful tool. It can provide you with good diagnostic information. You can then take measures to reduce the sound or noise levels or take other actions to remove your self from harm. The IForgeIron membership is encouraged to step up and post any time they see a safety problem or hazardous situation. It keeps us alive and able to enjoy life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaleb Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 2 hours ago, Glenn said: Please do not think we are bashing the creator of the video I know you weren't really I should have used a different word but as I have been known to not be good at choosing the right words. But even if you were bashing on him I would never get worked up over anything like that, trust me. 2 hours ago, Glenn said: The IForgeIron membership is encouraged to step up and post any time they see a safety problem or hazardous situation. It keeps us alive and able to enjoy life I also get this as well you know, I mean if I caused someone to get hurt by repeating my actions I would feel really bad and wish that someone would have said something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT. Many times we become too involved to see or recognize the danger of our actions. We depend on others to warn us. There is nothing I can think of that is worth someone getting intentionally hurt, or being killed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaleb Posted July 22, 2017 Share Posted July 22, 2017 I know some times I make myself look ignorant and make a fool of myself idk. You know I am completely sorry if I had missed the whole point and caused you the frustration of "Can't this guy get it". I don't mean any harm, I guess I think I need to sit back and stay away from the computer for a bit before I say anything stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted July 22, 2017 Author Share Posted July 22, 2017 Kaleb, you found the point of the whole discussion. No one is going to fault you for asking questions, or participating in the discussion. They would however fault you for not asking questions and not learning that there are things out there you should avoid is at all possible. You got Frosty to so a safety check on his shop and remove any potential problems that others might stumble into. Or problems he might expose himself or others to if he did not remember the thread and it's warnings. Others viewing and following the thread have been exposed to the warnings, and should remember the warning, maybe not exactly, but remember well enough so they do not continue doing something that could cause grave harm to them selves or others. Sounds like a success to me. (grin) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted July 22, 2017 Share Posted July 22, 2017 8 hours ago, Daswulf said: Just downloaded Decibel 10 to try out. That should be fun in the body shop. Thanks for the idea Glenn. I've been using the Decibel 10 app on my phone. Assuming it's reasonably correct, it helped me get the sound level of my vacuum cleaner blower down to a much safer level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daswulf Posted July 22, 2017 Share Posted July 22, 2017 It seems to at least be accurate to itself. I will try it out further in the next couple days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 Reviving an old post, I'd been using earplugs under 25db NRR earplugs under 25db NRR earmuffs for a while, then recently switched the earplugs out for earbuds for my iphone (fiddle music is great for keeping that hammering rhythm going). Just found a few extra ducats and decided to invest in a set of the Howard Leight earmuffs with the MP3 cord but without the radio. Hoping this is a better (and more comfortable) option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 I was told if you have to raise your voice to be heard two feet away from someone you need hearing protection. I use 33NRR foam plugs all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 Say again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 This is another thing that folks tend to ignore when young as it doesn't show up till possibly years after the damage was done and then it's too late! My wife's hearing aids cost more than her minivan and a high multiple of what preventing the issue would have cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHCC Posted October 5, 2017 Share Posted October 5, 2017 This is another thing that folks tend to ignore when young as it doesn't show up till possibly years after the damage was done and then it's too late! Amen to that. I wasn't sufficiently scrupulous about hearing protection back when I was a cabinetmaker, and I suspect that's why I get tinnitus now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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